Adventures in Closed Loop

[Doer]

The least expensive extractor I could find, is the DIY list, from skunkpharm. If you order all the parts and have a access to a good welder that can do boiler spec, on 403SS, you can come in for maybe $700 or so.

<sigh> I was not set for that time sink, to save $300 so I went with Cascadia Dynamix, Li'l Foot, for $1000.

That is by far, the cheapest, ready to go, closed loop extractor, I could find. The next one up is $1700, and spending $20K on these, CL systems, is easy enough, if you want big material weight throughput.

This has a 3x6 inch column. Plenty big for me, since I only produce about 2-3 oz a month for personal meds. It came with 1/2 valve adapter, (shown sticking out the side) I will reduce that to 3/8" for my hose.



DV-41 Micron gauge, on the upper right, I got used from ebay, for $120.

 

[doubletake]

That is bad ass my friend!

 

[Doer]

Still just new out of the box. I thank you for saying so.

No instructions, what so ever. I'll talk to them next week.

- do I leave the butane in the jug or transfer back to LP5?
- what is the max fill in liters of the jug?
- is there a bottom plate that has sort of a container? This one is flat.
- is it intended for use with a transfer solvent, like Ethanol?
- do I dare scrape around that seal area?
- any general use tips, that may not be obvious?

 

[Texas(THC)]

that not a bad deal ive been considering one of these
http://bestvaluevacs.com/extractors.html

 

[Doer]

Nice. I never did use the search term "vacs" Good link.

That would work, but you still a jug, don't you?

 

[Doer]

Good prices there for all that gear, especially the chambers. Nice score.

 

[Doer]

I was thinking since I have a very nice vacuum chamber in the Foot, how can I use it to save some steps? It comes apart nicely. I could:

- remove column and internal filter seat at the bottom
- introduce hot ethanol for transport solvent, on warm extract at the bottom
- pour that off into vacuum filter
- chill that in the cold bath I already have to run the extraction (salt water and ice at 28F.)
- attach vacuum filter to the top plate valve
- pull suction to the flask and filter the solvent back into the Foot
- replace vacuum filter with condenser input line
- pull to 1 PSI on the foot and get the ethanol to boil off at room temp (more or less)
- collect the ethanol in the round bottom flask for reuse
- collect the absolute from the Foot bottom plate
- I think I will add a 6" food grade silicone disk on the bottom plate for this step.

I think this will work and save me the trouble of refitting the acrylic vac bell I have to metal fittings.

I have this Graham style condenser column ready to go.
It too will run on the cold salt water I have ready for the extraction.

To protect the pump oil from the solvent I will also use a small cold trap that sit dry ice and acetone at - 78F. That rig sits in the salt water bath for insulation.

If I was not just doing this for myself once a month I would not use glassware. You can make all this stuff, including the cold trap, out of copper....not cheap either, but durable.

-

 

[R&RHashman]

It really helps if I read the whole post before I respond. anyways cool little set up there. wish I had a rig like that lol what does the finished product look like

 

[Doer]

I haven't run it yet. It just got here.

 

[Blunter the kid]

I bet the alcohol you distill from the extract is gonna be carrying some of the more volatile aromatics so theoretically you could reuse the same alcohol for a couple batches of extract, then dilute it and make yourself some damn fine liquor.
Also your setup is badass, I like how your combining your closed loop system with a couple pieces of glassware, props on the way your rigging it up.

 

[Fadedawg]

The alcohol distilled after extracting or winterizing cannabis concentrates definitely is a Gin, containing mono and sesquiterpenes. You can both smell and taste them.

They are after all themselves alcohols, ethers, aldehydes, ketones, esters, and carboxylic acids.

 

[Doer]

Ah...Ganja Gin (tm)

A better drink than all, Ganja Gin (tm)

YOU may talk o' gin an' beer
When you're quartered safe out 'ere,
An' you're sent to penny-fights an' Aldershot it;
But if it comes to slaughter
You will do your work on water,
An' you'll lick the bloomin' boots of 'im that's got it.
Now in Injia's sunny clime,
Where I used to spend my time
A-servin' of 'Er Majesty the Queen,
Of all them black-faced crew
The finest man I knew
Was our regimental bhisti, Gunga Din.

 

[Doer]

I bet the alcohol you distill from the extract is gonna be carrying some of the more volatile aromatics so theoretically you could reuse the same alcohol for a couple batches of extract, then dilute it and make yourself some damn fine liquor.
Also your setup is badass, I like how your combining your closed loop system with a couple pieces of glassware, props on the way your rigging it up.

Well it turns out, you can get screw in glassware adapters for vacuum. I was just looking at some last night. https://www.aceglass.com/page.php?page=5857

For use as column end fitting that allows connection of appropriate size Ace-Thred to tubing connectors with NPT threads. Available in various Ace-Thred and NPT sizes. Most come complete with both a 100 micron and a 350 micron polyethylene filter. Call Ace for details.
-----------------------------
I am sticking to 24/40 for the ground glass taper joint and then I may need an Ace-Thred connector for the top of the column, collection flask, and cold trap.

I get the glassware from China and 30% cheaper. So far so good with the shipping.

http://laboy.com

 

[Doer]

The alcohol distilled after extracting or winterizing cannabis concentrates definitely is a Gin, containing mono and sesquiterpenes. You can both smell and taste them.

They are after all themselves alcohols, ethers, aldehydes, ketones, esters, and carboxylic acids.

Hey, I wanted to ask you something about cold traps.

I have been following your builds. I especially like how no plan survives the saw.
Prototyping is a fun hobby in itself.

How much condensation do you get in the cold trap? Have you normalized that to parameters, like heat and pressure? Can you say something like, for every liter evacuated you get X grams of ethanol in the trap?

Pump oil is cheaper than ethanol, but the point is to minimize the loss of the ethanol.

 

[Blunter the kid]

Well it turns out, you can get screw in glassware adapters for vacuum. I was just looking at some last night. https://www.aceglass.com/page.php?page=5857

For use as column end fitting that allows connection of appropriate size Ace-Thred to tubing connectors with NPT threads. Available in various Ace-Thred and NPT sizes. Most come complete with both a 100 micron and a 350 micron polyethylene filter. Call Ace for details.
-----------------------------
I am sticking to 24/40 for the ground glass taper joint and then I may need an Ace-Thred connector for the top of the column, collection flask, and cold trap.

I get the glassware from China and 30% cheaper. So far so good with the shipping.

http://laboy.com

I'm a little confused could you clarify for me, are you just using the fittings to connect your glassware to the to the apparatus?
And if so where is it going to connect?
I'm looking at a heating mantle/magnetic stirrer right now and I'm thinking of getting a cold trap and a 1000ml rbf to go along with it so I can perform an extraction how i intend to, so I lose no terpenes during the whole process, I'll even be able to keep the extremely volatile aromatics.
Once I get my set up I'll be a happy camper

 

[Doer]

Yes and no. I am just getting set up. Some of the glassware has not arrived yet.
And since I had my AH HA moment about using the Foot as my chamber, I have not thought through all the connections.

But, here is how I think it will go. I have not completely decided what cold trap config I will use.

Top of the column will have a 24/40 joint adapter
- #7 ace-thred to glass, to 1/8" NPT female
- 1/4" SAE male - 1/8" NPT female reducer coupling
- 1/4" braided steel hose to Foot

Bottom of column has an angled glass adapter to turn straight down into round bottom collection flask. (flat bottom flasks are NOT for low pressure) Vacuum is carried through the flask via the branch.

Adapter branch has the same as above but with a very short run to the cold trap.
The other side of the trap will be adapted up to the 3/8 inch main evacuation hose to the pump.

 

[Fadedawg]

Hey, I wanted to ask you something about cold traps.

I have been following your builds. I especially like how no plan survives the saw.
Prototyping is a fun hobby in itself.

How much condensation do you get in the cold trap? Have you normalized that to parameters, like heat and pressure? Can you say something like, for every liter evacuated you get X grams of ethanol in the trap?

Pump oil is cheaper than ethanol, but the point is to minimize the loss of the ethanol.

As you note, heat and pressure at the cold trap are critical for maximum recovery. Depending on piping losses, that may not leave you with optimum pressure at the vacuum chamber, but is the parameter that you must pay close attention to, or you will just boil away the alcohol in the cold trap as well.

Here is a chart that appears pretty close, compliments of Skyhighler.

 

[Doer]

Thanks. I didn't have a close increment, ethanol chart.

 

[Doer]

I'm a little confused could you clarify for me, are you just using the fittings to connect your glassware to the to the apparatus?
And if so where is it going to connect?
I'm looking at a heating mantle/magnetic stirrer right now and I'm thinking of getting a cold trap and a 1000ml rbf to go along with it so I can perform an extraction how i intend to, so I lose no terpenes during the whole process, I'll even be able to keep the extremely volatile aromatics. Once I get my set up I'll be a happy camper

Maybe this picture will help. Not cheap at $40. But, i think 2 of these might just be all I need. (famous last words)
5038-05 Adapter
https://www.aceglass.com/html/detail/5038-05.php

 

[Doer]

Actually, blunter, it is this one. I have been digging for it in the catalog.

Or I might just stick with short runs of teflon tubes. That is how I will start up.


1/4" npt 5802-15 $57.45 for #11 Ace-Thred.