may my seedlings need nutes?

endlesslyonline

Active Member
I recomend adding somthing to weaken down as most seedling soils still have generous amounts of ferts in to. Most soils seem to say feeds for four weeks which is a dead give away that there pretty loaded already.

Soil mixes the world over seem to follow the same general principles and fert levels. The fact that one soil is seedling soil and one is potting soil should make you think there are differences here.

I would do a test run on the seedling soil first and i think the answer to your thread is definatly no this seedling dosent need ferts.

Growing an african strain by chance?
Thx again for all the help.

What can one use to weaken down the soil?

And, im not sure what strain I am growing, its a random bagseed that is apparently Swazi, but there is obviously no way to be sure. I am doing all my tests on bag seeds, as soon as a grow goes well from start to finish, i will invest in some seeds
 

Ace Yonder

Well-Known Member
Thx again for all the help.

What can one use to weaken down the soil?

And, im not sure what strain I am growing, its a random bagseed that is apparently Swazi, but there is obviously no way to be sure. I am doing all my tests on bag seeds, as soon as a grow goes well from start to finish, i will invest in some seeds
Not to dismiss someone's advice, but I wouldn't "weaken down" seedling soil. Unless you are using a soil with chemical ferts added to it I doubt that any kind of seedling mix would burn your plants, honestly. I've put seedlings into Happy Frog, Ocean Forest, and even Vermifire (An extremely "hot" soil) and had them turn out fine every time. Some people like to add perlite for "drainage" but the physics of that are iffy (Actually doesn't improve drainage, or have any effect on it really, until it is >50% of the mixture). If you want to add something to your soil I would mix in some water crystals, my best plants were ones that i started in soil amended with water crystals, helps to avoid overwatering, helps prevent soil compaction since they swell every watering and when they dry they leave tiny air gaps, which in turn DOES help with drainage, and it will help keep the roots oxygenated.
 

2Hearts

Well-Known Member
Im at the same point too, obviously perlite makes it weaker but ive used it before and too much gives you super drainage when im quite happy with my soils drainage already. I hate vermiculite as makes soil too wet and messy and unsure of coco although it is widely used.

The seedling soil should be ok but consider bagseed and best to start with a weak soil as you dont know how sensitive to ferts they are.

The yanks have somthing called sunshine mix #4 but i fail to find an alternative over here.

Unfortunatly i dont have the answer i just know that most soils are strong and this is a reacurring problem with growers of marijuana.

Hec it ruined my first few crops too till it twigged to use seedling strength soils but even i struggle with them and know why so many change to coco or hydro.

My plants grow amazing just need to tune my seedling soil as i can tell nute burn from a mile away.


I hope you find the answers but i cannot say futher than that on the matter until i make a choice with what to do with my seedling soil. Will be starting a new run of seeds this weekend so will give you a shout when i get results.
 

2Hearts

Well-Known Member
Not to dismiss someone's advice, but I wouldn't "weaken down" seedling soil. Unless you are using a soil with chemical ferts added to it I doubt that any kind of seedling mix would burn your plants, honestly. I've put seedlings into Happy Frog, Ocean Forest, and even Vermifire (An extremely "hot" soil) and had them turn out fine every time. Some people like to add perlite for "drainage" but the physics of that are iffy (Actually doesn't improve drainage, or have any effect on it really, until it is >50% of the mixture). If you want to add something to your soil I would mix in some water crystals, my best plants were ones that i started in soil amended with water crystals, helps to avoid overwatering, helps prevent soil compaction since they swell every watering and when they dry they leave tiny air gaps, which in turn DOES help with drainage, and it will help keep the roots oxygenated.
My point exactly, Happy Frog is a seedling soil and lighter than their main soil. Go tru canna pro at 1.4 to 1.6ec with your seedlings or the full foxfarms soil then youll see why i advised him away from the stronger potting soil to the weaker seedling soil. Really its like you just took a stab at basic soil knowledge and then when i said keep on the safe side by making it a bit weaker i.e. less is more well you know the rest.

Ocean forest happy frog is seedling soil hence why it worked for you.
 

Ace Yonder

Well-Known Member
My point exactly, Happy Frog is a seedling soil and lighter than their main soil. Go tru canna pro at 1.4 to 1.6ec with your seedlings or the full foxfarms soil then youll see why i advised him away from the stronger potting soil to the weaker seedling soil. Really its like you just took a stab at basic soil knowledge and then when i said keep on the safe side by making it a bit weaker i.e. less is more well you know the rest.

Ocean forest happy frog is seedling soil hence why it worked for you.
You're actually wrong. First, Ocean Forest and Happy Frog are both different soils by Fox Farms, and neither of them are a seedling mix, so I dunno what you mean by "Ocean forest happy frog is seedling soil" because that sentence is just factually incorrect. Ocean Forest is their full strength soil, Light Warrior is their seedling mix, and Happy Frog is a 50/50 mix of Ocean Forest and Light Warrior. And Vermifire is even HOTTER than Ocean Forest. I didn't "take a stab at basic soil knowledge", I actually know my soils very very well, and given your last statement I will have to assume that you do not.
 

tyson53

Well-Known Member
i would water with a 50% kelp water solution..its great to develope roots and also the growth hormones in it will provide structure for healthy growth...it will not burn your plants...do it once a week...then as they grow bigger add more kelp to your solution....I am sure you get Maxi Crop there ...or some type of seaweed product..get plain seaweed ...

seaweed(kelp) is one must have in a grow...kelp can grow 3 feet a day...so get the benifts of it to you cannabis...it feeds the soil also...
 

2Hearts

Well-Known Member
Omg i remember why i left now. Please dismiss everything ive said on this thread, problems obviously not soil!
 

Ace Yonder

Well-Known Member
i would water with a 50% kelp water solution..its great to develope roots and also the growth hormones in it will provide structure for healthy growth...it will not burn your plants...do it once a week...then as they grow bigger add more kelp to your solution....I am sure you get Maxi Crop there ...or some type of seaweed product..get plain seaweed ...

seaweed(kelp) is one must have in a grow...kelp can grow 3 feet a day...so get the benifts of it to you cannabis...it feeds the soil also...
Totally, plus the vitamin b protects against stress and the cytokines in it have benefits at all stages of plant development. I would actually suggest foliar feeding with both kelp and aspirin (And amending the soil with both when moving into larger container), the benefits are enormous. Personally I am a fan of Down to Earth Kelp Meal
 

tyson53

Well-Known Member
Ace it depemds on where you live what kelp products are available....i buy 60LB bags of kelp meal..100% organic...it comes from Maine...its 55.00 a bag...now the kicker of it...its used to put in animal feed...its very fine ground up...works great...I use neptune brand liquid as my foliar ..and soil drench...the kelp meal goes in my soil mix....the same bag of kelp meal at the grow store was close to 85.00....same stuff...I go thru 3 bags a season,,,for soil and brewing teas...

also them 2 foxfarm soils you were told to use..they will nuke your seedlings....seedling and germinating soils are what you use now..no nutes in them..the root hairs are so fine an delicate when first sprouted it dont take much to burn therm...
 

Ace Yonder

Well-Known Member
Ace it depemds on where you live what kelp products are available....i buy 60LB bags of kelp meal..100% organic...it comes from Maine...its 55.00 a bag...now the kicker of it...its used to put in animal feed...its very fine ground up...works great...I use neptune brand liquid as my foliar ..and soil drench...the kelp meal goes in my soil mix....the same bag of kelp meal at the grow store was close to 85.00....same stuff...I go thru 3 bags a season,,,for soil and brewing teas...

also them 2 foxfarm soils you were told to use..they will nuke your seedlings....seedling and germinating soils are what you use now..no nutes in them..the root hairs are so fine an delicate when first sprouted it dont take much to burn therm...
Just for the record I never told him to use foxfarms soil, he doesn't even have access to them where he lives, I was just citing those as an example of soils that are much more nutrient dense than his current soil that I have successfully put seedlings in without burning them (I have pictures as proof if requested), you just have to be careful. But Happy Frog especially will NOT "nuke your seedlings"
 

2Hearts

Well-Known Member
also them 2 foxfarm soils you were told to use..they will nuke your seedlings....seedling and germinating soils are what you use now..no nutes in them..the root hairs are so fine an delicate when first sprouted it dont take much to burn therm...
Did you just suggest using a seedling soil for seedlings!!! Ffs pass me that asprin im getting a headache....
 

tyson53

Well-Known Member
sorry Ace..I miss read the post...but I myself have burnt seedlings with ocean forest before..I usally use either Black gold seedling mix or Dr earth seedling mix or Hoffmans seed starter mix...some soils with nutes in them are not consistant..example Fox Farm just had one dirt mill on the west coast...then they bought one on the east coast...North Carolina I think...now get a bag of soil from the west coast and east coast....they are different...the forest humus from west to east is different...east is more acidic also...I live on the east coast and had both ...I dont use bag soil for grow.with 1 exception...I use 90-95% compost ammended and maybe 10% bag soil mix to stop compacting..and I use Dr Earths soil...best bag soil I have seen yet..

http://drearth.net/products/organic-soils/
 

2Hearts

Well-Known Member
I have maxicrop but it would totally not be good to add to a stunted seedling in a hot soil. All this detracts from the point he needs to go buy the Culterra seedling soil and ditch the potting soil for this stage.

Seaweed has little npk but contains a bucket load of most other nutrients which just futher complicate matters in a hot soil.

People act like soil is deficient of these nutrients, iassure you it isnt and packs a variety of benificial fungi, bacteria and microbes.
 

Ace Yonder

Well-Known Member
I have maxicrop but it would totally not be good to add to a stunted seedling in a hot soil. All this detracts from the point he needs to go buy the Culterra seedling soil and ditch the potting soil for this stage.

Seaweed has little npk but contains a bucket load of most other nutrients which just futher complicate matters in a hot soil.

People act like soil is deficient of these nutrients, iassure you it isnt and packs a variety of benificial fungi, bacteria and microbes.
A kelp foliar spray protects the plant from stresses of all kinds, and would help they plant adjust to the soil, and I don't think he necessarily needs to ditch the soil he is using, his seedling isn't burned, it's growing fine, maybe not the hugest jump in 7 days ever, but certainly not abnormally slow while it is establishing roots. Kelp isn't just about nutrients, it is about plant hormones, b vitamins, and Cytokines/Auxins. Foliar spraying seedlings with kelp and aspirin (Salicylic acid is also beneficial to plants under stress) is almost always a good idea, no matter what medium they are in.
 

2Hearts

Well-Known Member
The plants stunted and new growth will not be great, this is indicative of high nute stress and seaweed is not a magic fix. I see Culterra do seedling soil as well as potting soil, potting soil is not seedling soil as much as seedling soil is not potting soil. You pot plants in one the other you plant seeds in.

Wasnt bothered about babying this plant more provide the answer to make his future grows Shine.

When i was taught to grow one thing kept bouncing back n forth endlessly 'Keep it simple'.

Please op add the nutrient rich seaweed and enough asprin for a medium sized headach cause i need a laugh when you run into more problems lol
 

Ace Yonder

Well-Known Member
Lets move from theoretical into actual for a moment. Here are two plants, each started as seedlings in "Hot" soil. If the soil is so hot that it should nuke my plants, please tell me why they seem to be thriving in it.

Seedling one, in 3" coco pot, filled with Fox Farms Ocean Forest:
crop1.jpg
When big enough, was put into heavily amended Super Soil, and is currently looking like this (Note the familiar coco pot poking up from top of pot, the slight elevation above the level of the soil allows for better root aeration):
crop4.jpg

And Plant Two, started in 2" square coco pot filled with Happy Frog, and transplanted straight into a 3 gallon plant-able pot filled with Ocean forest plus some extra myco:
crop2.jpg

Plant three, older, this time started in 3" coco pot with Ocean Forest, and transplanted into pot filled with Vermifire, showing vigorous growth and training:
crop3.jpg

All three plants also treated with Kelp and Aspirin

@2Hearts If you have pictures of your seedlings thriving in your weakened seedling soil, please do post them, I'm sure OP would love to be able to compare and pick a method based on actual, real life results.
 
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2Hearts

Well-Known Member
Did i post a link earlier plus i was just goading you, op can do what he feels is best. I run in seedling and potting soil years and years and could easily post hundreds of threads whereby the soil you use is too strong for their seedlings and they benifitted from using seedling or a light soil for seedlings. The soil aint burning the crap outa the plant its simply made it slow and probably get a bit ugly till inevitably it gets bigger and able to handle it.

Personally and in my posts i was just pointing out a) He didnt need to add fert, be that micros or asprins and b) i bet the biggest gains would be had from from purchasing the same brand seedling soil from Culterra which is possibly the best advice for any grower along with the first few posts where members suggested checking frequency of water and pot size etc.

The fact that he could simply add a half strength dose of ferts now and see if the plant starts screwing up more is an easy way to end up saying "Hey that soil wasn't to strong" or "That asprin loving dude was wrong and i really should have made that simple change before throwing bottled stuff into my soil!"
Ill bet its way much harder to find a weaker seedlimg soil than a strong one
 

2Hearts

Well-Known Member
The plants treated with asprin look like there s bit drowsey and shouldnt operate heavy machinery!
 

Ace Yonder

Well-Known Member
Did i post a link earlier plus i was just goading you, op can do what he feels is best. I run in seedling and potting soil years and years and could easily post hundreds of threads whereby the soil you use is too strong for their seedlings and they benifitted from using seedling or a light soil for seedlings. The soil aint burning the crap outa the plant its simply made it slow and probably get a bit ugly till inevitably it gets bigger and able to handle it.

Personally and in my posts i was just pointing out a) He didnt need to add fert, be that micros or asprins and b) i bet the biggest gains would be had from from purchasing the same brand seedling soil from Culterra which is possibly the best advice for any grower along with the first few posts where members suggested checking frequency of water and pot size etc.

The fact that he could simply add a half strength dose of ferts now and see if the plant starts screwing up more is an easy way to end up saying "Hey that soil wasn't to strong" or "That asprin loving dude was wrong and i really should have made that simple change before throwing bottled stuff into my soil!"
Ill bet its way much harder to find a weaker seedlimg soil than a strong one
I agree that he shouldn't use additional nutes (although I just feel he should avoid adding too much N-P-K, whereas I feel a light kelp/aspirin misting would be beneficial), I also agree that in future he should use the Culterra seedlings mix, I just disagree that he should cut it down further, I think it will be perfectly fine without this mystery "weakening" agent.
 
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