DWC Plant Issue

H

HPAgirl

Member
Grow System: Current Culture DWC
Nutrients: Cultured Solutions A & B, UC Roots, Botanicare Cal-Mag Plus
Water: RO
Lights: 1000W Metal Halide
Media: Rockwool + Hydroton (clay pellets)
Water Chiller set to 68 degrees Fahrenheit

I'm doing my first ever DWC grow. The roots on my system were starting to look questionable. I was thinking for a few days that it was probably the color from the clay pellets leaching out onto them, because the plants are only about 3 weeks old (post germination) and I've had the water chiller on the entire time. A friend of mine who works in the Ag industry strongly recommended a product called ZeroTol. I added it to the system at a 500:1 dilution rate, which was done by the book. After about an hour I took the pH and it was 3.8. I quickly drained the system, flushed it with RO water, and filled it back up with the recommended nutrient solution (long night). After 24 hours they took a dive for worst (see picture). They have yet to recover after 4 days. The pH has been stable at about 6.0-6.1 and the ppm is approximately 290-300.

Has anyone used ZeroTol before? I'm guessing I should have stuck with 35% H2O2 instead.

Has anyone experienced this kind of pH shock before? How long does it take for the plants to recover? Has anyone ever experienced delayed pH Shock?
 

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Alienwidow

Alienwidow

Well-Known Member
Did they turn white and crispy like that from the product? First glance and that plant looks over fed and burnt or bleached from too much sun, id say more burnt because the damage is on the lower leaves. I cant really see how one ph drop would do that. Have you calibrated your ppm meter?
 
SweetHayz

SweetHayz

Well-Known Member
At 6.1 you are locking Potassium.



Potassium (K)
Potassium is absorbed by plants in larger amounts than any other mineral element except nitrogen and, in some cases, calcium.
Helps in the building of protein, photosynthesis, fruit quality and reduction of diseases.

Keep pH in hydro at 5.8
As well ur plant is hungry so i suggest u slowly lift the ppm.
 

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SweetHayz

SweetHayz

Well-Known Member
Alienwidow said:
Did they turn white and crispy like that from the product? First glance and that plant looks over fed and burnt or bleached from too much sun, id say more burnt because the damage is on the lower leaves. I cant really see how one ph drop would do that. Have you calibrated your ppm meter?
Click to expand...
nute burn at 300ppm for that plant?
the leave are bright yellow
 
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H

HPAgirl

Member
Alienwidow,
I calibrate my meter at least weekly, but usually more often than that. It's a BlueLab combo meter, and it never seems to get off, at least not more than .1 on the pH scale. I have been wondering about the light intensity in the room.. it's pretty intense. Today I turned off half of the bulbs. I'm waiting to see it that helps. I really don't think it's nutrient burn because I've been behind the recommended schedule. The plants were doing fine before this ZeroTol treatment. The ZeroTol contains peroxyacetic acid, and I'm wondering if it's not totally safe for the plants since it drives the pH down so much. I believe it may be a great tool for cleaning out growing equipment but perhaps not additions into the nutrient solution.
 
SweetHayz

SweetHayz

Well-Known Member
Since your plant were fine before ZeroTol. Your setup should be fine. How long u kept them in that acid?
 
Alienwidow

Alienwidow

Well-Known Member
HPAgirl said:
Alienwidow,
I calibrate my meter at least weekly, but usually more often than that. It's a BlueLab combo meter, and it never seems to get off, at least not more than .1 on the pH scale. I have been wondering about the light intensity in the room.. it's pretty intense. Today I turned off half of the bulbs. I'm waiting to see it that helps. I really don't think it's nutrient burn because I've been behind the recommended schedule. The plants were doing fine before this ZeroTol treatment. The ZeroTol contains peroxyacetic acid, and I'm wondering if it's not totally safe for the plants since it drives the pH down so much. I believe it may be a great tool for cleaning out growing equipment but perhaps not additions into the nutrient solution.
Click to expand...
If they went from green to yellow like that in a couple of days id say your right. That stuff is leathal. Id baby them for a while, you sound like you are with the lowering the lights and all. Id lower the calmag and be gentle with nutrients too. I hope they recover for you.
 
Alienwidow

Alienwidow

Well-Known Member
Wow, i just googled the acid your talking about and it says it can be highly corrosive and its a super concentrated form of hydrogen peroxide. That is kindof a good thing....sorta. Peroxide cleans off dead roots and oxygenates the plant root zone in low doses. Higher doses can be detrimental to the root zone. My guess with the drastic drop in ph you may have added way more than the plant can handle, the google search said it was a cleaner. Did you use the cleaning dilution or the horticultural application dilution when you dosed it?
 
SweetHayz

SweetHayz

Well-Known Member
"peroxyacetic acid" Any acid will drastically drop ur pH leading to in appropriate pH level leading to nutelock.(How long did u kept them in that solution?) As far for "Peroxide" O2 you are giving extra oxygen there is no way u can harm your plants that way, especially in such low amounts. As far for "Acetic" any organic acid will build bacteria in your container not always harmful but you'll have problems maintaining the pH.

I faced similar problem not long ago. I flushed the container. Washed it with bleach to kill any living fungus and bacteria left from the aceti. Prepared new solution. Regularly maintained my pH at the appropriate levels. It took 2-3 days to recover. But i had it struggle for at least 3-4 days before that.

That thing should be miracle for soil growing but ints aliving nightmare in DWC esspesially when bacteria start eating ur nutes and then multiply with the minute. You should know from now on not to dump anything organic in ur container.
 
Alienwidow

Alienwidow

Well-Known Member
SweetHayz said:
At 6.1 you are locking Potassium.



Potassium (K)
Potassium is absorbed by plants in larger amounts than any other mineral element except nitrogen and, in some cases, calcium.
Helps in the building of protein, photosynthesis, fruit quality and reduction of diseases.

Keep pH in hydro at 5.8
As well ur plant is hungry so i suggest u slowly lift the ppm.
Click to expand...
nice chart, ive run hydro with a swinging ph from 8 to 10 with amazing flowers and yeilding almost a gpw. Heres how ph was explained to me a long time ago......ph is not as important as people make it out to be, if you imagined a row of trees and the middle one had the perfect ph, that one would be the biggest. All the other trees moving away from that tree in both directions would be fine for the most part, they would just be shorter. Also explained by the same book writer, ph is usually the first thing someone who has no idea nor cares to learn what the problem is reaches for. It's basically like saying i have no clue. Unless the ph problem is drastic itll be fine. Ive never phed anything in my entire life besides rockwool for cloning and ive never had lockout.
 
SweetHayz

SweetHayz

Well-Known Member
In soil inappropriate pH will stun ur grow or at least not as good as if u maintain the proper level. When u water a plant, the water kept in the soil in time will lower its own pH level. I use wood dipped in my aquarium for regulate my pH. Lets put it that way look at the chart. At certain point of pH plant can absorb certain minerals. Now imagine when u water the plant with 6.5. At the very beginning the plant will will absorb the minerals available at 6.5 and with time water pH will drop and other minerals will be available. As far for hydroponics u need to maintain the proper pH level where most minerals are available for the plant to be able to feed itself.
 
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Alienwidow

Alienwidow

Well-Known Member
SweetHayz said:
"peroxyacetic acid" Any acid will drastically drop ur pH leading to in appropriate pH level leading to nutelock.(How long did u kept them in that solution?) As far for "Peroxide" O2 you are giving extra oxygen there is no way u can harm your plants that way, especially in such low amounts. As far for "Acetic" any organic acid will build bacteria in your container not always harmful but you'll have problems maintaining the pH.

I faced similar problem not long ago. I flushed the container. Washed it with bleach to kill any living fungus and bacteria left from the aceti. Prepared new solution. Regularly maintained my pH at the appropriate levels. It took 2-3 days to recover. But i had it struggle for at least 3-4 days before that.

That thing should be miracle for soil growing but ints aliving nightmare in DWC esspesially when bacteria start eating ur nutes and then multiply with the minute. You should know from now on not to dump anything organic in ur container.
Click to expand...
Wrong again genius all over this post. Google hdrogen peroxides horticultural applications and youll see that theres many different strengths and concentrations that are used in industry and peroxide will devestate the root zone when over applied.

I do agree with the part where you messed up your plants royally and had to take drastic steps to fix them.

As for never adding organics to your system thats wrong too. Many hydro growers use teas with bennificials bred into them. The key is to breed good bactieria and not bad, some bactierias are healthy and premote root growth and destroy baddies.

Gold...
 
SweetHayz

SweetHayz

Well-Known Member
But vinegar is acetic acid isn't it? So the general concentration of his product is double oxygenated concentrated vinegar MY dear friend!

Not all organics cause bad bacteria. But u clearly don't need good bacteria since its been used to fight bad bacteria and there is no bad bacteria to fight with? Beneficial bacteria are being used generally for root rot. With other words if u keep ur container bacteria free no matter if its good bacteria or bad bacteria. Your plant will grow healthy.

Its funny how u bring up a little problem i had which i solved with a help of a member but not you. Because you are a plant killer which i understood overtime.
 
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