organic vs chemical vs elements

shredder4

shredder4

Well-Known Member
No till here for about five years now I guess. I've had three soil mixes in these years, but two of the mixes were the same soil. So put another more relateable way, I've grown about 35 lb of organic bud in about 3 bales of pro mix, and a handfull of amendment and homemade compost.

For feeds I like comfrey, kelp, alfalfa meals in teas. Fermented I like comfrey, alfalfa, wildflowers, horsetail, lamb's quarters.

I also make and use sprouted seed teas. Primarily alfalfa seed and barley seed.

For top dresses at transplants, I like kelp meal, neem meal, and crab shell. All three along with being nutrients also contribute to bug defense.

I top dress a pinch of rock dust and gypsum from time to time too.

As indicated above i think, I believe in diversity, and I don't use a lot of nutrients at a time. Perhaps you've heard less is more in organic growing, it's true.

And lastly get the best compost you can get, and have a regular bug prevention program.

So all in all very little cost involved except the physical work needed, and then have a plan for a shit load of stinky bud.
 
cannakis

cannakis

Well-Known Member
justanoldtimer said:
For years I've grown in soil.
I've enjoyed growing organically, it makes you feel proud....
go ahead say it. "I grew my weed organically"
We almost wear it on our chest like a badge of honor.

you get your various products, your bat guano and what not...
you brew your tea and wholla you fed your soil, which fed your roots,
which fed your plant.

Now i get.... the initial fear when you hear someone who is not growing organically...
but its a misnomer to judge a salt based grow vs organic,
as you would lets say an organic/free range chicken vs perdue...

In the instance of growing a pot plant, all a non organic grow means is,
getting your nutrients from salt based compounds to form the needed levels on n-p-k.
now remember above we mentioned that.... you fed your soil, which fed your roots,
which fed your plant. think about that, its pretty inefficient, dont ya think?

Its very inefficient, to say the least.
Using a soilless grow or a hydro grow using salt based nutes,
you can eliminate alot of that and use the roots to feed your
plant directly, why because (in simple terms) the salt based
nutes are more easily digested by the plant, hence the increase
in yeild. Which can be dramatic.

I hear people refer to salt based nutrients as "using chemicals"
this is not a good term (chemical)
a better term would be "element"
just my opinion
Click to expand...
No that's not accurate though because you're not using Pure Elements. Elements can Not be broken down further by chemical processes. So all those chemicals CAN be broken down and extract the Exact elements out.

And if we go to the Websters 1828 definition of Element we find the current definition but also a Lot more really interesting take a look
http://webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/Element but in that it says which was Always believed for hundreds of years that, "5. In popular language, fire, air, earth and water, are called the four elements, as formerly it was supposed that these are simple bodies, of which the world is composed. Later discoveries prove air, earth and water to be compound bodies, and fire to be only the extrication of light and heat during combustion."

So if anything "elemental" gardening in my opinion would be using the Pure Basics of Nature. Water. Earth. Fire. And Wind. BASIC! Interesting though...
 
Rrog

Rrog

Well-Known Member
It's also not accurate on other levels. Common in these arguements is to remove microbes from the discussion. Lol

In this day and age, surely everyone understands the vital role of microbes in our bodies.
 
cannakis

cannakis

Well-Known Member
Rrog said:
It's also not accurate on other levels. Common in these arguements is to remove microbes from the discussion. Lol

In this day and age, surely everyone understands the vital role of microbes in our bodies.
Click to expand...
Hahaha exactly! We can't just Ignore Facts. Though some argue microbes still thrive with chems... But what do I know!?!
 
Rrog

Rrog

Well-Known Member
Lol. Microbes don't do well in your body when you're exposed to chems. The normal microbe profile gets changed and we suffer

Same with plants. You feed ferts, you change the whole soil dynamic. Guys will keep their heads in the sand and say microbes are microbes, but this just isn't so
 
qwizoking

qwizoking

Well-Known Member
help me understand this concept.

what is a chemical to you?

to me water is a chemical

also, do you have any studies that support your claim about fertilizer and soil life? or in what way we suffer in regards to the human body
 
Rrog

Rrog

Well-Known Member
All sorts of studies show your gut / surface bacteria changes as you use lotions,etc or change to a fast food diet, etc. not surprising, really.

I'm assuming that there's no arguement that we need gut bacteria right?

Same in soil. Microbes are involved on so many levels. But there's a relationship with the plant that changes when we flood the medium with nutrients

We know that some fungi retreat in high P levels, cause there not needed. Just an example
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
Rrog said:
All sorts of studies show your gut / surface bacteria changes as you use lotions,etc or change to a fast food diet, etc. not surprising, really.

I'm assuming that there's no arguement that we need gut bacteria right?

Same in soil. Microbes are involved on so many levels. But there's a relationship with the plant that changes when we flood the medium with nutrients

We know that some fungi retreat in high P levels, cause there not needed. Just an example
Click to expand...
They still use fecal transplants to this day.
Think about that one.
Install some of YOUR shit, in my guts, to make me healthy....
Thank you antibiotics
--whenever anyone asks about cycling or aging their organic soil, I mention the human digestive system.---
 
greasemonkeymann

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
cannakis said:
No that's not accurate though because you're not using Pure Elements. Elements can Not be broken down further by chemical processes. So all those chemicals CAN be broken down and extract the Exact elements out.

And if we go to the Websters 1828 definition of Element we find the current definition but also a Lot more really interesting take a look
http://webstersdictionary1828.com/Dictionary/Element but in that it says which was Always believed for hundreds of years that, "5. In popular language, fire, air, earth and water, are called the four elements, as formerly it was supposed that these are simple bodies, of which the world is composed. Later discoveries prove air, earth and water to be compound bodies, and fire to be only the extrication of light and heat during combustion."

So if anything "elemental" gardening in my opinion would be using the Pure Basics of Nature. Water. Earth. Fire. And Wind. BASIC! Interesting though...
Click to expand...
ahhh now that's some dungeon's and dragon's logic man.
The periodic table of elements...
 
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