Ruwtz Maneuver Vol 1

[ruwtz]

Doubtful. That's called elephant's foot and what it means is that the plant is cut off from its nutrient supply.

I've saved some plants in the very early stages by liberally spraying the affected area with isopropyl alcohol to kill the pathogen.

Never heard of that name but I did suspect this is what is happening. The stem may have rotted in contact with constantly damp rock wool.

@ttystikk Can't find any info on "elephants' foot"... is it called something else?

I have studied the roots closely and it doesn't look like pythium to me, although its fair to say the conditions have been right for it, or any other pathogen.

 

[Wisher2]

Never heard of that name but I did suspect this is what is happening. The stem may have rotted in contact with constantly damp rock wool.

@ttystikk Can't find any info on "elephants' foot"... is it called something else?

I have studied the roots closely and it doesn't look like pythium to me, although its fair to say the conditions have been right for it.

even if it isnt pythium.....I would get it out of there....just in case that what ever it is spreads
you dont want to loose everything
cuttings and dispose
once the cuttings root and get dropped in coco.....things will take off quickly

 

[ruwtz]

even if it isnt pythium.....I would get it out of there....just in case that what ever it is spreads
you dont want to loose everything
cuttings and dispose
once the cuttings root and get dropped in coco.....things will take off quickly

That seems a little drastic at this stage. I think I can investigate further without cutting and tossing.

If anything, i'd rather do an H202 drench treatment and see how that goes.

 

[cat of curiosity]

That seems a little drastic at this stage. I think I can investigate further without cutting and tossing.

If anything, i'd rather do an H202 drench treatment and see how that goes.

i think it's still the not established enough syndrome. too much in the rw. gotta let them drain and dry....

i hate rw...

 

[ruwtz]

Here's a cross section of the basal stem, inside and out, the rot immediately visible where the plant was attached to the medium.





The rotted area sizzled when I added H2O2, as did further up the stem. I added the same to some of the roots in the cube and there was hardly any sizzling at all. Not a scientific test by any means, but I don't think i'm overrun by a pathogen just yet...

Roots aren't slimy or discolored (beyond what that brown GH cute will do) or falling apart. I think they're just choked.

 

[ruwtz]

i think it's still the not established enough syndrome. too much in the rw. gotta let them drain and dry....

i hate rw...

Yeah this cube i've ripped apart is totally saturated, sodden, no air at all. It really is wretched stuff...

I think I want to go ahead and pot them all up so i'm only feeding/watering the coco underneath. Hopefully the cube will dry out eventually at the same time as roots are laying down into something much more hospitable.

 

[ruwtz]

Also my res temps are up at 74F which I know restricts DO, but I can't afford a chiller right now. But its not like i'm flooding every day yet where this is the single cause of an anaerobic root zone, however it probably hasn't helped. Hopefully my use of Hydroguard makes up for this slightly high temp.

 

[ttystikk]

Never heard of that name but I did suspect this is what is happening. The stem may have rotted in contact with constantly damp rock wool.

@ttystikk Can't find any info on "elephants' foot"... is it called something else?

I have studied the roots closely and it doesn't look like pythium to me, although its fair to say the conditions have been right for it, or any other pathogen.

Stem rot. Once it's gone all the way around the stem, your plant is fucked.

 

[ttystikk]

Also my res temps are up at 74F which I know restricts DO, but I can't afford a chiller right now. But its not like i'm flooding every day yet where this is the single cause of an anaerobic root zone, however it probably hasn't helped. Hopefully my use of Hydroguard makes up for this slightly high temp.

Unless your roots are constantly bathed in the nutrient solution, you don't need a chiller.

You got zapped by soggy rockwool. Now you know why I hate it so much!

 

[ruwtz]

Stem rot. Once it's gone all the way around the stem, your plant is fucked.

Yeah i'm cutting this handful of girls down for clones only. Goodbye senoritas

 

[Wisher2]

Stem rot. Once it's gone all the way around the stem, your plant is fucked.

kinda why I said cut clones of all bad ones and toss the shit out
anything that has a stem like that....just needs to go....no reason for ductape
know what I mean

 

[Lucky Luke]

fk...SMH..I feel for ya ruwtz

 

[Wisher2]

Unless your roots are constantly bathed in the nutrient solution, you don't need a chiller.

You got zapped by soggy rockwool. Now you know why I hate it so much!

I talked to the botanicare guy a while back
we were talking about res and temp and whatnot
he told me to not even have an air stone in the res
he said for flood and drain as well as top feed there is no reason to oxygenate the solution...he said it is actually counterproductive causing evaporation which causes reverse osmosis as the solution hits the lid....the h2o drops back down as the minerals stay....which then build up on the lid
he said to just circulate the solution periodically to keep it suspended
but the dry cycles allow oxygen into the rhizosphere as well as the act of watering creates an oxygen rich enviroment
and temps only matter when it comes to pathogens and algae....and algae actually wont hurt anything....although it can cause ph flux

 

[ttystikk]

I talked to the botanicare guy a while back
we were talking about res and temp and whatnot
he told me to not even have an air stone in the res
he said for flood and drain as well as top feed there is no reason to oxygenate the solution...he said it is actually counterproductive causing evaporation which causes reverse osmosis as the solution hits the lid....the h2o drops back down as the minerals stay....which then build up on the lid
he said to just circulate the solution periodically to keep it suspended
but the dry cycles allow oxygen into the rhizosphere as well as the act of watering creates an oxygen rich enviroment
and temps only matter when it comes to pathogens and algae....and algae actually wont hurt anything....although it can cause ph flux

All of this is sound advice.

 

[cat of curiosity]

Also my res temps are up at 74F which I know restricts DO, but I can't afford a chiller right now. But its not like i'm flooding every day yet where this is the single cause of an anaerobic root zone, however it probably hasn't helped. Hopefully my use of Hydroguard makes up for this slightly high temp.

i hate hydrogaurd, just saying... good for you and others, just not my bag...

however, your res temp is easy. freeze a few 1g jugs (milk or drinking water) of water and toss one in twice a day. should get you below 70f 24 hours a day. easy fix, and cheap too!

 

[Wisher2]

i hate hydrogaurd, just saying... good for you and others, just not my bag...

however, your res temp is easy. freeze a few 1g jugs (milk or drinking water) of water and toss one in twice a day. should get you below 70f 24 hours a day. easy fix, and cheap too!

what type of bad experience have you had with hydroguard?
I have never experienced anything neg
my res is about 76 @ all times

frozen jugs are cheap yes.....but need to be replaced....within a day or so
kinda like you put ice in a drink and room temp is 72......about 15 min later your drink is all water
and within the hour your drink is now room temp

not very sustainable

but....whatever works right?

 

[ruwtz]

what type of bad experience have you had with hydroguard?
I have never experienced anything neg
my res is about 76 @ all times

frozen jugs are cheap yes.....but need to be replaced....within a day or so
kinda like you put ice in a drink and room temp is 72......about 15 min later your drink is all water
and within the hour your drink is now room temp

not very sustainable

but....whatever works right?

I could see it working with frozen jugs on rotation: new one in the res as one thawed comes out, no dilution if they are sealed and not adding liquid, effectively a cooler pack.

But I'm not gonna sweat res temps. I've just potted all the remaining healthy girls - pics to follow.

@cat of curiosity i wanna know your beef with Hydroguard too! Pretty inoffensive stuff so "hate" feels like strong words... C'mon kid tell us!

 

[ruwtz]

@Wisher2 interesting stuff from Mr Botanicare. My res is a 55g drum and water line is nowhere near the top so nothing is splashing. Still, it's an interesting thought.

 

[cat of curiosity]

what type of bad experience have you had with hydroguard?
I have never experienced anything neg
my res is about 76 @ all times

had a chemical reaction to my nutes, made a sludge that clogged my mister heads. by the time i caught the mechanical failure, i'd lost half my table. my bad, stuff is not meant to be used in conjunction with my formula.

frozen jugs are cheap yes.....but need to be replaced....within a day or so
kinda like you put ice in a drink and room temp is 72......about 15 min later your drink is all water
and within the hour your drink is now room temp

not very sustainable

but....whatever works right?

i mentioned one to two jugs a day in my post, and i did it without attitude.

it works. it also works well in an air cooled air-tight enclosure.

right?

 

[cat of curiosity]

@cat of curiosity i wanna know your beef with Hydroguard too! Pretty inoffensive stuff so "hate" feels like strong words... C'mon kid tell us!

i just said...