FBI Raids Manafort residence.

[greg nr]

Actually, no he isn't. So long as the individual is on U.S. soil, his pardon is absolute. That person though can never leave the jurisdiction of the United States, or he takes his life in his own hands.

That's not a pardon, it's sanctuary. It would violate dozens of treaties depending on which country tried to extradite.

And a US state court could still extradite a person back to their state for trial. A presidential pardon couldn't prevent that.

 

[TacoMac]

Again, it doesn't matter. In the end, once a verdict is given, Trump can pardon and it's all for nothing.

 

[SneekyNinja]

LOL!

Panic more.

Fact is, they have at best enough material to make 8. Maybe 10. But they have no rocket to deliver them, not even close. About the farthest they can reach right now is MAYBE mainland Japan, and that would be iffy...and in all likelihood totally inaccurate.

Are you retarded or something, they only tested a long range missile last week or the week before.

Based on its maximum altitude reached (apoapsis), speed and the angle of launch you can reliably predict it's range.

It was launched at an extremely acute angle and came down at another sharp angle so as to remain in NK territory, but numerous tracking services around the world got enough that from that to reliably predict it's potential range.

You can keep wishing it's not happening but it's happening and Trump sabre rattling does absolutely nothing to prevent that and if anything provides a reason for NK expediency.

 

[SneekyNinja]

It will likely be a pre-emptive (surprise) attack by the US. NK probably can't hit the us with a missile at this point unless it's sub launched, and I'm guessing their subs can probably be tracked from port to sea very easily; I'm surprisede they haven't started to go missing at sea.

More likely they would try to hit a military base like guam or a civilian center like Soul. Either of those would make trump wildly popular as he wraps himself in a flag and claims to be defending the world.

We probably know where they keep their toys. The military probably has a pretty good threat assessment and has had plans on the shelf for years. They would hit the bases/labs/launch/command/control sites and try to take out the ability to launch in a first wave. Probably with underground or battlefield level nukes.

The messy part would be ground forces trying to pour over the border.

It just takes a maniac to order one of those plans with tactical nukes to be used.

Pre-emtive strikes don't work unless you reliably destroy ALL enemy launch sites in the first strike.

Even then, they'll probably just launch as soon as we do because it's nearly impossible to hide a large scale ICBM launch.

 

[TacoMac]

That's not a pardon, it's sanctuary.

It's both.

When Nixon pardoned Calley for mass murder among other things, that didn't stop Vietnam from wanting him extradited to stand trial for War Crimes. They've tried even through the Hague. But so long as that asshole never leaves the States, there is nothing they can do.

 

[greg nr]

Pre-emtive strikes don't work unless you reliably destroy ALL enemy launch sites in the first strike.

Even then, they'll probably just launch as soon as we do because it's nearly impossible to hide a large scale ICBM launch.

Are you saying NK has satellites that can detect a launch? Or that they are in a 24 hour state of readiness? Or that they have anything approaching a resilient command and control system?

Just a guess, but I'm thinking it takes them weeks to prepare a launch. They aren't using truck based launchers. They can't move them around easily.

This isn't russia or china. The land mass is small and we have been watching it for a very long time. While I wouldn't take the risk, if trump were given a probability of knocking everything out in the range of 50-60%, he would probably order it.

That's all I'm saying. I'm not a military guru, or a tactical expert. Just taking hunches. He'd probably take far more risks than anyone sane.

 

[TacoMac]

Are you retarded or something, they only tested a long range missile last week or the week before.

Based on its maximum altitude reached (apoapsis), speed and the angle of launch you can reliably predict it's range.

It was launched at an extremely acute angle and came down at another sharp angle so as to remain in NK territory, but numerous tracking services around the world got enough that from that to reliably predict it's potential range.

You can keep wishing it's not happening but it's happening and Trump sabre rattling does absolutely nothing to prevent that and if anything provides a reason for NK expediency.

That is written by idiots that have absolutely no clue how an ICBM works.

It's not a fucking bottle rocket. You don't just tilt it and that's where it goes and all is well. It doesn't work that way AT ALL.

First off, you have to launch vertical. You can't launch at an angle because the rocket will never survive. The stress will rip it apart.

An ICBM goes vertical until it reaches the upper atmosphere before it starts to angle at all. By that time the air is thin enough so the rocket can withstand the stress. As it reaches it's upper limits it then begins it's angled decent to the target.

At this point, about as far as their EMPTY ROCKET THEY HAVE BEEN TESTING can reach is about half way across the Atlantic.

IT STILL HAS NO WARHEAD ON IT.

By the time they mount a useable warhead, which they don't have, it's going to double the weight of the rocket. That's going to make them double the amount of fuel, which will again increase the weight of the rocket, which is going to cut its useable range by 75% or thereabouts.

That means that even if they somehow shit a re-entry vehicle (which they don't have) and a useable warhead (which they don't have just yet) about as far as they can make it is Japan.

But the problem gets worse: North Korea doesn't have an outer orbit guidance satellite. So they will, quite literally, be guessing where the damn thing is going to hit if it hits at all.

Right now, they'll be launching with about the same accuracy as Germany had with the V2. At best.

 

[greg nr]

It's both.

When Nixon pardoned Calley for mass murder among other things, that didn't stop Vietnam from wanting him extradited to stand trial for War Crimes. They've tried even through the Hague. But so long as that asshole never leaves the States, there is nothing they can do.

Well, it's not like we had an extradition treaty with vietnam. And soldiers have always been a special case. But, it is still sanctuary from international law. He was pardoned for any US violations of law, but that doesn't mean he couldn't be tried in another country. Of course he would never be extradited to serve, but it wouldn't be an international pardon.

 

[SneekyNinja]

That is written by idiots that have absolutely no clue how an ICBM works.

It's not a fucking bottle rocket. You don't just tilt it and that's where it goes and all is well. It doesn't work that way AT ALL.

First off, you have to launch vertical. You can't launch at an angle because the rocket will never survive. The stress will rip it apart.

An ICBM goes vertical until it reaches the upper atmosphere before it starts to angle at all. By that time the air is thin enough so the rocket can withstand the stress. As it reaches it's upper limits it then begins it's angled decent to the target.

At this point, about as far as their EMPTY ROCKET THEY HAVE BEEN TESTING can reach is about half way across the Atlantic.

IT STILL HAS NO WARHEAD ON IT.

By the time they mount a useable warhead, which they don't have, it's going to double the weight of the rocket. That's going to make them double the amount of fuel, which will again increase the weight of the rocket, which is going to cut its useable range by 75% or thereabouts.

That means that even if they somehow shit a re-entry vehicle (which they don't have) and a useable warhead (which they don't have just yet) about as far as they can make it is Japan.

But the problem gets worse: North Korea doesn't have an outer orbit guidance satellite. So they will, quite literally, be guessing where the damn thing is going to hit if it hits at all.

Right now, they'll be launching with about the same accuracy as Germany had with the V2. At best.

Lol, are you fucking kidding me?

You don't EVER launch a rocket intended for orbit straight up, only the very initial stage is "straight up"...

Google the term "gravity turn/zero lift turn" and get back to me.

 

[TacoMac]

only the very initial stage is "straight up"..

Which is exactly what I said, idiot.

Let's review:

An ICBM goes vertical until it reaches the upper atmosphere before it starts to angle at all. By that time the air is thin enough so the rocket can withstand the stress.

And there you have it.

One it hits thin air of the upper atmosphere (around 40,000 to 50,000 feet) it can then angle usually to around 35 to 40 degrees. It carries that out into space, then reenters on a similar downward trajectory.

All the fear mongering idiots did is say, "Well, their rocket traveled X number of miles up and down, so if we stretch that out flat they could make it to California."

It doesn't work that way. That is the point.

 

[twostrokenut]

Lol, are you fucking kidding me?

You don't EVER launch a rocket intended for orbit straight up, only the very initial stage is "straight up"...

Google the term "gravity turn/zero lift turn" and get back to me.

he's right. the purpose of the missle is to deliver a warhead. they're not even substituting weights for the warhead in testing. it's posturing as usual.

 

[londonfog]

Again, it doesn't matter. In the end, once a verdict is given, Trump can pardon and it's all for nothing.

Mannafort will lose every fucking thing he has. Trump can do nothing about that

 

[londonfog]

he's right. the purpose of the missle is to deliver a warhead. they're not even substituting weights for the warhead in testing. it's posturing as usual.

the asian peninsula is what Trump and friends would like this war to start and end. Trump is pretty dumb

 

[Jimdamick]

Gotta love Grand Juries and subpoenas, seeing as they need probable cause to issue a search warrant. I can't wait for the next 2 shoes to drop, one on Kusners head, and the other on Trump Jr's ball sack.

 

[Jimdamick]

That is written by idiots that have absolutely no clue how an ICBM works.

It's not a fucking bottle rocket. You don't just tilt it and that's where it goes and all is well. It doesn't work that way AT ALL.

First off, you have to launch vertical. You can't launch at an angle because the rocket will never survive. The stress will rip it apart.

An ICBM goes vertical until it reaches the upper atmosphere before it starts to angle at all. By that time the air is thin enough so the rocket can withstand the stress. As it reaches it's upper limits it then begins it's angled decent to the target.

At this point, about as far as their EMPTY ROCKET THEY HAVE BEEN TESTING can reach is about half way across the Atlantic.

IT STILL HAS NO WARHEAD ON IT.

By the time they mount a useable warhead, which they don't have, it's going to double the weight of the rocket. That's going to make them double the amount of fuel, which will again increase the weight of the rocket, which is going to cut its useable range by 75% or thereabouts.

That means that even if they somehow shit a re-entry vehicle (which they don't have) and a useable warhead (which they don't have just yet) about as far as they can make it is Japan.

But the problem gets worse: North Korea doesn't have an outer orbit guidance satellite. So they will, quite literally, be guessing where the damn thing is going to hit if it hits at all.

Right now, they'll be launching with about the same accuracy as Germany had with the V2. At best.

Read the news, and learn

North Korea has successfully produced a miniaturized nuclear warhead that can fit inside its missiles, according to a confidential July assessment from the Defense Intelligence Agency, The Washington Post reports. The Japanese Ministry of Defense also believes North Korea has achieved miniaturization. It is unclear whether North Korea has tested the miniaturized weapon.

 

[TacoMac]

Mannafort will lose every fucking thing he has. Trump can do nothing about that

No he wont. Nobody has any standing for a civil suit.

 

[TacoMac]

Read the news, moron

North Korea has successfully produced a miniaturized nuclear warhead that can fit inside its missiles, according to a confidential July assessment from the Defense Intelligence Agency, The Washington Post reports. The Japanese Ministry of Defense also believes North Korea has achieved miniaturization. It is unclear whether North Korea has tested the miniaturized weapon.

The operative words are "THINKS, MAY HAVE, BELIEVES, COULD HAVE and POSSIBLY" in those articles.

To date, as fact, they don't. And again, even if they did they have no reentry system, no guidance system, and it's doubtful the current rocket could carry it any further than mainland Japan.

 

[londonfog]

No he wont. Nobody has any standing for a civil suit.

You think you keep money you made by ill-gotten means ? They about to take money and property. You don't issue a fucking FBI search warrant without probable cause. Stay tune

 

[srh88]

You think you keep money you made by ill-gotten means ? They about to take money and property. You don't issue a fucking FBI search warrant without probable cause. Stay tune

All over Twitter people are posting something big is happening Friday.. Louise mensch and another dude posted about it and Louise hasn't been wrong once yet about anything she's posted so far. Ready to see what this one's about

 

[TacoMac]

You think you keep money you made by ill-gotten means ? They about to take money and property. You don't issue a fucking FBI search warrant without probable cause. Stay tune

First off, as far as Mannafort is concerned, his taking money from Russians isn't a crime. It was a legitimate payment for his services. The crime isn't the money. The crime is collusion. They would have to prove that Russia paid him the money for the sole purpose of colluding with them against the Clinton campaign rather than a legitimate counseling service.

That is going to be an impossible burden to prove as both are word of mouth and only the particulars are privy to that information.

About the worst they can get him for at this point is obstruction and even that is a reach. Trump will give him a full pardon for it, he'll be out his legal fees (which will no doubt be substantial) but that's about it.