Switching from GH to powder nutrients - Stock tank questions

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spek9

Well-Known Member
I'm the type to do extensive research on pretty well everything. This week, after eight years of indoor growing, I'm finally delving deep into nutrients.

After a private discussion with another forum member, I'm switching from GH Flora series to powdered soluble. For my first test, I'm going with Jack's 5-12-26, which contains all the micro nutrients. I'll also use Calcium Nitrate, and MKP in flower.

I'm currently growing in Sunshine #4 peat-based medium. Veg is 2x4x5', 400W MH, humidity is ~50%. Flower is 4x4x6.5', 1000W HPS, humidity ~40%. Both tents run at 78F during lights on. I start clones/seeds in one gal pots, and put them in their final three gal pots at about week five of veg. In total, I veg for eight weeks in a perpetual, where I harvest plants every five weeks.

Currently, I use two 15 gallon drums to mix a veg and flower batch of GH. I'd like to stick to something similar with the new nutrients.

My understanding is that the CalNit shouldn't be mixed with the MKP in the stock tank due to precipitation. I'm wondering how long that takes to happen. For example, it usually takes me a little over a month to go through the 15 gallons of my flower GH mixture (a little longer for veg). Too long I'm sure?

If mixing the CaNit and MKP together isn't an option, I'll add a smaller third tank, mix the MKP in the small one, a large drum for veg and the other large for flower. When needed, I can supplement the flower mix with some of the MKP mix at time of use.

Does that sound logical?

Can anyone else who pre-mixes relatively larger batches of nutrients up front in stock tanks share some insight or tips on how they manage things?
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
spek9 said:
I'm the type to do extensive research on pretty well everything. This week, after eight years of indoor growing, I'm finally delving deep into nutrients.

After a private discussion with another forum member, I'm switching from GH Flora series to powdered soluble. For my first test, I'm going with Jack's 5-12-26, which contains all the micro nutrients. I'll also use Calcium Nitrate, and MKP in flower.

I'm currently growing in Sunshine #4 peat-based medium. Veg is 2x4x5', 400W MH, humidity is ~50%. Flower is 4x4x6.5', 1000W HPS, humidity ~40%. Both tents run at 78F during lights on. I start clones/seeds in one gal pots, and put them in their final three gal pots at about week five of veg. In total, I veg for eight weeks in a perpetual, where I harvest plants every five weeks.

Currently, I use two 15 gallon drums to mix a veg and flower batch of GH. I'd like to stick to something similar with the new nutrients.

My understanding is that the CalNit shouldn't be mixed with the MKP in the stock tank due to precipitation. I'm wondering how long that takes to happen. For example, it usually takes me a little over a month to go through the 15 gallons of my flower GH mixture (a little longer for veg). Too long I'm sure?

If mixing the CaNit and MKP together isn't an option, I'll add a smaller third tank, mix the MKP in the small one, a large drum for veg and the other large for flower. When needed, I can supplement the flower mix with some of the MKP mix at time of use.

Does that sound logical?

Can anyone else who pre-mixes relatively larger batches of nutrients up front in stock tanks share some insight or tips on how they manage things?
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i'm curious as to how the Jacks does vs GH. do you run the Jacks from start to finish with the same mix rate just vary the EC a bit? @TintEastwood i think is a Jacks guy and he has thorough spread sheets.
 
Gond00s

Gond00s

Well-Known Member
I was really looking at jacks, Im using gln mega and their shit I just don't like it much because of how much actual shit is in it. ive been wanting to switch to jacks will be watching this tho. because I usually make 30 gals at a time and their is like rocks in it I just don't know. but jacks is on my list tho
 
Gond00s

Gond00s

Well-Known Member
rkymtnman said:
i had horrible pH swings with Mega. i've got most of my bag still in the garage.
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mines not bad at all just I have annoying shit in my res that's like rocks and im getting annoyed of it. but my ph has been pretty stable just give it a few hours to stabilize in the res that's what I do before I change anything in it. or u talking soil ph swings?
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
Gond00s said:
mines not bad at all just I have annoying shit in my res that's like rocks and im getting annoyed of it. but my ph has been pretty stable just give it a few hours to stabilize in the res that's what I do before I change anything in it. or u talking soil ph swings?
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no, this was in a standalone hydro res. a few other members had the same exact results so i know it wasnt me. would be good for a bit, then in mid 6's and then would drop like a stone into the 4's.
 
Gond00s

Gond00s

Well-Known Member
rkymtnman said:
no, this was in a standalone hydro res. a few other members had the same exact results so i know it wasnt me. would be good for a bit, then in mid 6's and then would drop like a stone into the 4's.
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damn never had that happen but probably since im using a res then doing dtw could be the big difference maybe?
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
Gond00s said:
damn never had that happen but probably since im using a res then doing dtw could be the big difference maybe?
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i do dtw too. when they were advertisers here, they tried to help but never could figure it out. they thought it was my small waterfall that i had in the res to keep everything mixed/aerated.
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
sorry to hijack there @spek9 but doesn't Jacks use Epsom too? i thought it was the jacks, the cal nit and epsom? that not correct??
 
Gond00s

Gond00s

Well-Known Member
rkymtnman said:
i do dtw too. when they were advertisers here, they tried to help but never could figure it out. they thought it was my small waterfall that i had in the res to keep everything mixed/aerated.
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yea im not sure. if co2 is in the air and the waterfall is going thru co2 doesn't it add carbonic acid to the res since their is co2 in the air itself? idk. im not trying to hijack either this maybe is a nice place to have a discussion about this tho could help everyone. all types of soluble not just gln. but it could be from good microbes in the rez or feed nutrients chemically reacting or breaking down in the res? please correct me if im anywhere wrong still learning and I don't have great experience in those types of systems. :) bongsmilie
 
S

spek9

Well-Known Member
rkymtnman said:
sorry to hijack there @spek9 but doesn't Jacks use Epsom too? i thought it was the jacks, the cal nit and epsom? that not correct??
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Yes. I forgot to mention that, but I've got decent tap water out of a lake that's high in Mg to begin with, so I won't be adding any unless I need it. The Jack's also has some Mg already as well.

I've got a complete copy of my grow environment that I mentioned dedicated for pollen chucking and other experiments, so I'll be using test plants for the new nutrient solution until I dial it in.
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
spek9 said:
Yes. I forgot to mention that, but I've got decent tap water out of a lake that's high in Mg to begin with, so I won't be adding any unless I need it. The Jack's also has some Mg already as well.

I've got a complete copy of my grow environment that I mentioned dedicated for pollen chucking and other experiments, so I'll be using test plants for the new nutrient solution until I dial it in.
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i'm like you, my system is dialed in. all i've been messing with is nutes and NPK ratios.

and now that you mentioned the Mg in the lake, here is a ? i've never gotten a good answer yes or no:
so i've read that Ca in my well water (calcium carbonates) is too big a molecule to be used by the roots. have you ever heard that before? i also use a humic acid powder which i also read helps chelate the CaCO3 so it can be used. any thoughts to that?
 
S

spek9

Well-Known Member
rkymtnman said:
and now that you mentioned the Mg in the lake, here is a ? i've never gotten a good answer yes or no:
so i've read that Ca in my well water (calcium carbonates) is too big a molecule to be used by the roots. have you ever heard that before? i also use a humic acid powder which i also read helps chelate the CaCO3 so it can be used. any thoughts to that?
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Well, one thing I've learned during my research of nutrients here, is that Calcium carbonate isn't nearly as water soluble as other forms of Calcium (eg Calcium Nitrate), which is why the roots don't uptake it well, not because of the size of the particles (I'm pretty new to the low-level aspects of nutrients yet though, so take with pound of salt).

I'm too inexperienced yet to respond to the humic acid question. I haven't come across that so far.
 
rkymtnman

rkymtnman

Well-Known Member
spek9 said:
Well, one thing I've learned during my research of nutrients here, is that Calcium carbonate isn't nearly as water soluble as other forms of Calcium (eg Calcium Nitrate), which is why the roots don't uptake it well, not because of the size of the particles (I'm pretty new to the low-level aspects of nutrients yet though, so take with pound of salt).

I'm too inexperienced yet to respond to the humic acid question. I haven't come across that so far.
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don't worry, i've posted the same ? in a few posts over the last yr or so and nobody seems to have a definitve answer
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
I mix calcium nitrate and MKP together in a reservoir and don't get nutrient precipitation. I use a small pond pump to keep things stirred. You shouldn't have any issue with Jacks, calcium nitrate, and a little MKP.
 
S

spek9

Well-Known Member
xtsho said:
I mix calcium nitrate and MKP together in a reservoir and don't get nutrient precipitation. I use a small pond pump to keep things stirred. You shouldn't have any issue with Jacks, calcium nitrate, and a little MKP.
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That's great to know, thanks!

I've been toying with ideas in my head to make this as seamless as possible. Worst case scenario, I was going to still mix my veg and flower tanks, but with just CaNit and the micro blend in appropriate amounts in each tank, then a small tank containing a gallon of double dose MKP. I could have them used ~4 oz of the MKP in my watering jugs for flower, and fill the rest up with the main mixture.

The packages should be at my post box this morning. I'm quite excited to get playing around. I've got the perfect test environment, as I've always got both production plants, and experiment plants at all phases of growth at all times, so it's a wide test bed for testing various strengths.
 
ISK

ISK

Well-Known Member
@spek9

are you able to find Jacks locally or do you have to order it online?

I have looked for both Jacks and Dyno-Gro locally but have not found either
 
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