Dealing with Politics and Family

[mooray]

Some sad stuff in there. I remember when my buddy got sucked into a multi-level marketing scam and tried to pull all his friends and family into it. It was weird and brings up the same dizzying feelings of bewilderment when you find that you don't really know someone that you thought you knew really well.

 

[Fogdog]

Im no longer on speaking terms w a friend of 18 years due to him buying into the pedo ring conspiracy theories. Not by my choice.
I tried to understand where he got these beliefs, asked for links to facts
And such. Never could produce, only attack argue and gas lighting insults.
Went from a great chill guy to a paranoid racist over 4 years or so.
There's a lot of people that are new ish to tech and are eating up all these conspiracy theories and such. Normal people, your friends, family, peers and everyone in between.
Idk if they have been duped,
It's ok if we disagree on leaders and parties,
But this seems to be beyond that.
Brainwashing? Is that possible?
By following along online, are your views being altered over time.
Do you speak to your friends face to face the way some verbally assault each other's online?
We shouldn't be.
Not sure where I'm going w this, but it sucks and I know for sure there's more old friends that are now former friends just because they know we don't drink the same cool aid.

I don't have any ideas on what to do. I have family with the same issues. We mutually agree to not talk politics though I've had to cut my SIL short. She honors the agreement but sometimes slips.

We have drifted away from a large middle class in this society. Growing that demographic -- in a diverse and equitable way -- is the only answer I can come up with to address their fears of a "civil war". Too many people feel socially and economically insecure. Growing more and better jobs; giving people a real sense of social security are nonpartisan expectations we have for our political leaders. I think we need to see progress on that front or the crazies will get another shot at taking our democracy down. We need to keep them out of power or they will go back to their stupid regressive white nationalist BS that only makes things worse for most of us.

 

[hanimmal]

 

[hanimmal]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/06/08/joe-biden-live-updates/#link-PV45CERUFBBHTAET4T4337QOME

As the first wave of rioters breached the U.S. Capitol on Jan. 6, Capitol Police officer Eugene Goodman wielded a baton as a bearded man in a QAnon shirt chased him up a stairway — a moment captured in a now-famous video.

Now, Douglas Jensen, the man who prosecutors say chased Goodman, claims he was misled into joining the deadly insurrection by QAnon, an extremist ideology the FBI has deemed a domestic terrorism threat.

“Jensen became a victim of numerous conspiracy theories that were being fed to him over the internet by a number of very clever people,” his attorney, Christopher M. Davis, wrote in a court filing on Monday asking for the 41-year-old Iowan to be released until his trial. “Six months later, languishing in a DC Jail cell, locked down most of the time, he feels deceived, recognizing that he bought into a pack of lies.”

A Black officer faced down a mostly White mob at the Capitol. Meet Eugene Goodman.

But Jensen also argued that prosecutors have misconstrued his role in the riot. Although he admits to carrying a pocketknife while pursuing Goodman, Jensen also claims in the new filings that he was simply there to “observe” the riot — and even argues that he was “threatened” by Goodman, who was honored with a Congressional Gold Medal for his heroism.

Jensen is just the latest Capitol riot suspect to express remorse and to blame QAnon or former president Donald Trump for inciting the deadly insurrection. So far, those lines of argument have failed to sway the federal judges overseeing the cases, as The Washington Post has reported.

Capitol riot defendants facing jail have regrets. Judges aren’t buying it.

Among the hundreds now charged in the Capitol riots, though, few had as visible a role as Jensen thanks to the viral video of Goodman’s standoff and the plaudits the Capitol Police officer later received for goading the mob away from the Senate chambers.

Jensen, a Des Moines native, traveled to D.C. for the rallies hosted by Trump supporters as Congress worked to certify President Biden’s victory. As the crowd coalesced into a violent mob, prosecutors said, he was “among the first … to push his way inside the United States Capitol.”

As captured in the video, prosecutors said, Jensen “led the crowd toward [Goodman] in a menacing manner” and repeatedly ignored his demands to stop. He later told police that he purposely jumped to the front of the crowd because he wanted his QAnon T-shirt to be prominently seen on TV, so that “Q” would “get the credit” for the insurrection.

Jensen turned himself in on Jan. 9 back in Des Moines. After holding him on a number of counts, including assaulting officers and civil disorder, prosecutors later added elevated charges including entering a restricted building with a dangerous weapon.

But in his new filings seeking to be released from custody, Jensen’s attorney casts his actions on Jan. 6 in a different light.

Describing him as a “blue-collar union laborer,” Jensen’s attorney said he became a “true believer” in QAnon “for reasons he does not even understand today.”

“In any event, he fell victim to this barrage of internet sourced info and came to the Capitol, at the direction of the President of the United States, to demonstrate that he was a ‘true patriot,’” the filing says.

Jensen’s attorney disputed claims that he played a significant role in the deadly violence inside the Capitol.

“Jensen was not an intended part of any group or mob at any time that day,” the filing claims. “He was at the front of the crowd, but in no way leading anyone.”

He also argues that the video shows Jensen never touched “anyone in an aggressive manner.”

“Even when threatened by Officer Goodman, armed with his baton hoovering over Jensen’s head, Jensen simply states, ‘I will take it for my country,’ ” his attorney wrote.

In the filing, Jensen asks to be released so his wife can pick him up and return him to Des Moines where he would remain on house arrest while working to support his family, which “is now suffering extreme financial hardship.”

There’s no indication in court records when a judge will rule on Jensen’s request.

 

[schuylaar]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/06/08/joe-biden-live-updates/#link-PV45CERUFBBHTAET4T4337QOME
View attachment 4918866

this is going to be funny how they're trying to get out of this. QAnon Shaman cut all his hair and now looks like a cleaner version of Charles Manson. They're moving him here to Colorado Federal lock-up i wonder if he tried to make a break? it says psych eval and they have to move him that far? all the runners and tunnelers go to that place.

'QAnon Shaman' Jacob Chansley moved to federal prison for 'forensic evaluation'

NBC News reporter Scott MacFarlane reported Monday that the so-called "QAnon Shaman," Jacob Chansley, is being transferred from the jail in Alexandria, Virginia, to Colorado where he'll undergo a forensic evaluation, according to the Justice Department.Chansley, like many involved in the attack...

www.rawstory.com

PS those horns are a weapon too after all what do animals use them for?

 

[schuylaar]

Our prisons are full of people who were taken advantage of by people who do not have their best interests in mind.


I am pretty proud of how our capital police didn't end up killing lots of people. I think that it is how all Americans should be treated.

12 Americans will decide this guy future, and that is good enough for me with this guy.

As for all of the people that took advantage by scamming all of these vulnerable people by trolling them into insanity. They should not be able to get away with it. They are the real ones that deserve to have the law applied to them fully IMO. And if they are found to have been working with foreign governments, they should be treated just like anyone else that is working with any foreign organization to attack our nation's citizens, again IMO.

We will see what happens.

why did some cops take their lives afterwards? these people are not going away Hanimmal, they WANT to own black people again. They WERE Jim Crow- that was the 50s and 60s..just 100 years after.. this not a long time and they still have secret closets; secret meetings.

'the only way i can lose is if they cheated' that was early 2019 he started saying and repeating over and over and over..Twitter, FB and anyone who would have him. Retweet after retweet.

there is only one thing that will make him go away. he must go somewhere and not have access to us..he's like Hannibal the Cannibal, they're going to have to put him in a cage with rope around and you can't touch with a slide box to give him books.

 

[hanimmal]

you got all that right..why WAS there just fist fighting and not mowing them down on the steps? WHY? if it was even you or me?

why did some cops take their lives afterwards?

My guess is that the trauma was very real and living through it shook them up, but really who knows. It could be that they were as deep in the conspiracy theories and saw the worst of it come alive and it lost so they were devastated putting everything on the line for the turd who was POTUS.

It is easy to assume the worst, but that is not usually reality when dealign with actual people.

Attack the capitol in an act of insurrection with most of the government inside and they deserved to die. The capitol hill police failed in their duty by not using deadly force on the steps, if they had succeeded and killed the government (no one knew what would happen then), then Trump would have been the only government in the USA, mission accomplished. It's just dumb luck, stupidity on their part and lack of a plan that it turned out the way it did. It did turn out for the best, but that was just luck, dump people and nothing more.

If they try that shit during Trump's trial at the courthouse in NY city, the cops will shoot the fuckers rather than fight a pitched unarmed battle inside the courthouse, or even on the steps. That's just a courthouse, not the seat of nearly the entire government of the USA including the VP, who they wanted to hang!

That is the time of Wealthy Melanin-lite Heterosexual Human Male Only agenda type of thinking that got us here IMO.

I dont agree at all that the Capital police failed at their jobs. Those were American citizens most of which were conned by the POTUS to show up, if bullets start flying and those people were used as cover by the MAGA insurrectionists, it would have been far more horrifying than it was.

No elected or innocent citizens were harmed from what I have seen, and would point to that being why the Capital police succeeded in their job. It is the rest of the backup that should have been ordered by Trump or his political trolls that failed our nation.

 

[schuylaar]

i no longer have a Twitter or FB for just this reason; i didn't even hear about but Beau is correct you must fight with facts.

 

[schuylaar]

View attachment 4918893



My guess is that the trauma was very real and living through it shook them up, but really who knows. It could be that they were as deep in the conspiracy theories and saw the worst of it come alive and it lost so they were devastated putting everything on the line for the turd who was POTUS.

It is easy to assume the worst, but that is not usually reality when dealign with actual people.


That is the time of Wealthy Melanin-lite Heterosexual Human Male Only agenda type of thinking that got us here IMO.

I dont agree at all that the Capital police failed at their jobs. Those were American citizens most of which were conned by the POTUS to show up, if bullets start flying and those people were used as cover by the MAGA insurrectionists, it would have been far more horrifying than it was.

No elected or innocent citizens were harmed from what I have seen, and would point to that being why the Capital police succeeded in their job. It is the rest of the backup that should have been ordered by Trump or his political trolls that failed our nation.

they could've let a few go in the air to back the crowd up and didn't but do you remember this spoiled child and what they did to everyone including Media?

the peaceful protesters.


the spoiled child- i wonder if he had 2 scoops of chocolate on his cake that day to celebrate..you know he looked at everyone else's plate to make certain he was the only one who got 2.

 

[hanimmal]

they could've let a few go in the air to back the crowd up and didn't but do you remember this spoiled child and what they did to everyone including Media?

the peaceful protesters.
View attachment 4918924

the spoiled child- i wonder if he had 2 scoops of chocolate on his cake that day to celebrate..you know he looked at everyone else's plate to make certain he was the only one who got 2.

View attachment 4918923

Supposedly they had the gear for it, but it was locked up in a bus and they couldn't get it? I haven't read that part yet, but was mentioned on MSNBC, so it might just be me talking out of my ass.

No need to fire a gun imo, they had everything else, but Trump was ready for all those people to die in the capital so he could seize power.

He failed.

Because he sucks at life, or at least everything that he has gotten handed to him falling apart is evidence of his failure at life.

The Republican's decades long work to secure power is now utterly exposed because of Trump hijacking their power, as is the Republican treason, and it is all due to the utter incompetence of Trump. Who we have because the (at least) the Russian military attacked our citizens and brainwashed them into the Trump supporters we see today by hacking all the roots the Republicans had in the evangelical/2nd Amendment/Racist demographics.


Because of that, I would not ever want to see our police open fire on any American citizen when they did not have to. The Capital Police did a remarkable job. Even if it makes it harder for them to arrest the ones doing harm.

Because that is what these domestic terrorists have been doing. They have been using our family and neighbors, as shields to do violence.

They have been doing it all summer long too.

 

[Obepawn]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2021/06/08/joe-biden-live-updates/#link-PV45CERUFBBHTAET4T4337QOME
View attachment 4918866

This is what happens when you don’t question everything and investigate. This is what happens when you’re not a critical thinker.

 

[hanimmal]

https://www.rawstory.com/lost-to-facebook-lies/

Reacting to an interview Facebook founder Mark Zuckerberg gave on CBS Thursday morning, where he attempted to defend his social media platform from accusations about allowing COVID misinformation to proliferate, MSNBC contributor Mike Barnicle related a story about a close friend he lost because they went down the Facebook rabbit hole of "crazy, crazy theories."

Speaking with host Joe Scarborough, Barnicle admitted he doesn't "even know" the unnamed friend anymore.

"Their algorithms still encourage the most controversial, craziest posts to share," host Scarborough offered. "And they just simply are not putting a big enough investment into getting more people to scan their own website to find this information.

"Joe, we will cover and talk about no sadder story than the story we're talking about right now. those children in Mississippi -- Mississippi is led by a governor who refuses to acknowledge, really, the extent of the dangers involved in covid," Barnicle began before getting personal.

"The roots of the misinformation, you're right, it's Facebook," he continued. "I'm not on Facebook, but a friend of mine who I've known for a long time, is on Facebook. and I no longer know this person because he has been so victimized by the level of misinformation that he's been absorbing each and every day now for over a year about the variants, about the virus, about the vaccinations."

"I no longer know this person, he's a captive to the information. The information and misinformation that he reads each and every day is addictive and supports his crazy, crazy theories about the dangers of the vaccination," he continued. "You multiply that by hundreds of millions of all people in this country and around the world, and Facebook is an active accomplice in the rising scale of fear and deaths due to the virus."

"There's no doubt about it, none, zero, no matter what Mark Zuckerberg says. None," he added.

 

[hanimmal]

 

[hanimmal]

 

[injinji]

I looked for this thread earlier today to post that video, but couldn't find it. lol

 

[mooray]

So good.

 

[hanimmal]

https://www.thedailybeast.com/the-power-of-false-war-propaganda-divides-families

Vladimir Putin and Donald Trump have a lot in common. But here’s one similarity you probably haven’t thought of: A lot of their supporters trust Putin and Trumpmore than they trust their own families.

Let’s start with Vlad. In case you missed it, Sunday’s New York Times reported that some Ukrainians are facing “backlash from family members in Russia, who refuse to believe that Russian soldiers could bomb innocent people, or even that a war is taking place at all.”

One Russian father told his son, who actually lives in Ukraine, “There are Russian soldiers there helping people. They give them warm clothes and food.” And one Russian woman told her sister, who lives in Ukraine, that “No one is bombing Kyiv, and you should actually be afraid of the Nazis, whom your father fought against.”

Who are you going to believe: Something your dad saw on Putin’s state TV or your own lying eyes?

For Ukrainians fighting for their lives, these are not esoteric political disagreements between two family members with a similar claim to the truth. In this case, one group is getting its news from Russian propaganda outlets, while the other group is getting news firsthand—in the form of bombs, bullets, and rockets.

But hey, gotta hear both sides, right?

Of course, for American readers, the elephant in the room has orange hair and a comb-over. At the risk of conflating an authoritarian state where there is no independent media with Fox News viewers in the U.S., this New York Times piece reads like a giant subtweet.

Trump is never mentioned, and yet, there is an unspoken subtext. After all, a lot of us live in a world where a significant number of our friends and family still believe (often, despite pleas from family) that Donald Trump won the election and that Democrats are operating a vast pedophile ring.

And—as Ukrainians may soon learn—sometimes our refusal to endorse these delusions leads to familial estrangement.

“My dad’s cousins sent me a petition—a certified letter—saying they disowned me because I’m in ‘the devil’s army’ now,” Rep. Adam Kinzinger disclosed last year in an interview last year with Anthony Fisher (now my editor at the Beast). “It’s been crazy, when you have friends—that you thought were good friends that would love you no matter what—that don’t.”

Kinzinger, one of the few GOP members of Congress to resist Trump’s attempts to overturn the election, represents an extreme example. But numerous Americans have a similar story.

I’m not a congressman, but I, too, was stunned back in 2016 when most of my extended family started moving toward Trump. Then, days before the 2016 election, and after I told my mom that I feared Trump’s authoritarian tendencies, she voted for him.

I love my mom, but I was perplexed. If your family member worked in politics or journalism and personally knew many of the players, would you take his or her warnings to heart? Would you trust the lived experience of your flesh-and-blood relative (assuming he or she is a decent person who shares your general values) who has expertise regarding the topic over that of complete strangers on TV or radio?

After four years of Trump, my mom and one of her sisters decided to sit out the 2020 presidential election—unlike most of my large extended family, who happily pulled the lever again for Trump.

The main difference between mom and the rest is that she doesn't watch Fox News.

“The Fox News effect” is real. A few years ago, author Luke O’Neil interviewed people whose families were changed by Fox News.

One story involved a man who watched his Puerto Rican uncle “becoming a Fox News junkie, and turning on his own people,” as he put it, in the aftermath of Hurricane Maria. “He was literally sitting in the dark and still defending Trump,” the nephew said. This story reminds me of the people who would rather die of COVID than betray their Trumpy politics by getting vaccinated.

As I write this, millions of people in Ukraine are enduring a brutal assault by one of the most powerful armies in the world, and some can’t get their Russian parents to believe it is even happening. The lesson here is that propaganda is powerful, and nobody is completely immune.

In the past, I thought the inability to distinguish truth from falsehoods occurred rarely, and only in delusional minds or cult members who needed to be deprogrammed. But this phenomenon is so pervasive that I am inclined to believe that simply preventing our own brainwashing may be the greatest individual responsibility of the modern media age.

Eventually, you are what you see and hear.

Now that Putin has shut down any trustworthy media outlets in the country, the people of Russia can be forgiven for believing misinformation.

What’s our excuse?

 

[Rob Roy]

Tell Lie Vision is a primary tool of brain washing and propaganda. Putin isn't the only to use it for his motives.

The real war is and has been over who gets to control what money is and isn't. You won't see or hear that on the idiot box.

If your family members get most of their "news" from television, they are not likely to understand reality and you may have to dumb down your conversations with them or limit conversations to polite surface level things at family gatherings. "Hey, how about them Red Sox" "Pass the gravy please Aunt Sarah", "heard it's gonna snow this weekend".

 

[hanimmal]

Tell Lie Vision is a primary tool of brain washing and propaganda. Putin isn't the only to use it for his motives.

The real war is and has been over who gets to control what money is and isn't. You won't see or hear that on the idiot box.

If your family members get most of their "news" from television, they are not likely to understand reality and you may have to dumb down your conversations with them or limit conversations to polite surface level things at family gatherings. "Hey, how about them Red Sox" "Pass the gravy please Aunt Sarah", "heard it's gonna snow this weekend".

TV is big no question, but it is really just one directional. The ability to have a black box response to every insane thing that someone says online that nudges them into truly thinking that they are onto something, with the constant feedback is truly a powerful tool to brainwash people with.

As for the money thing, businesses and people accepting it for goods and services are deciding what it is worth. All those billions of transactions everyday with our dollar as the method of exchange is why it is so stable. And even the trolling of the Fed about them buying/selling existing treasuries (to impact interest rates up or down to keep the economy stable) depends on large businesses that are made up of citizens buying those treasuries in the first place. So at the end of the day I don't agree with 'the real war' being about who gets to control what money is/isn't. Unless you just mean humanity, then sure, humans do conduct war. Shit I guess you could get really down the rabbit hole and think about how other animals/lifeforms too conduct wars, generally over resources or territories, which could be defined as 'money'.

 

[Rob Roy]

I don't agree with 'the real war' being about who gets to control what money is/isn't.

So the "who benefits" from the creation of fiat currency from thin air is a nonissue then ? Has no correlation to wars, assassinations ?