War

Roger A. Shrubber

Roger A. Shrubber

Well-Known Member
DIY-HP-LED said:
Nope, they will try to give that honor to the Ukrainians, it's a big part of nation building and keeping the bear at bey for a generation. If they do it themselves and at this point, I think they want to and deserve the right, since we are now at the "punishment" phase of the war. They should do the punishing until the Russians get the fuck out. That would be nation building, just arms and intelligence help required, our (Russia's) money and their blood, their feast at the end too.
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nation building is generally frowned upon by the international community. this isn't really about doing anything FOR the Ukrainians, except helping them to defend themselves against a larger aggressor, who had designs on other non NATO nations in Europe as well.
We have an agenda, to get rid if russia as a world power. we've pretty much achieved that goal. the agenda doesn't include re-engineering the Ukrainian government to suit ourselves, or redesigning their society to better integrate with ours...those decisions are theirs to make, and if we even try to influence that, then we're just as manipulative as the russians.
Zelensky has stated goals, to join the EU, to join NATO...but those goals will require a lot of reform in the Ukrainian government. right before the war, Zelensky was already working on the problem, but they weren't being seriously considered for either body for years, possibly decades, while they worked on the corruption that was holding them back.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Roger A. Shrubber said:
nation building is generally frowned upon by the international community. this isn't really about doing anything FOR the Ukrainians, except helping them to defend themselves against a larger aggressor, who had designs on other non NATO nations in Europe as well.
We have an agenda, to get rid if russia as a world power. we've pretty much achieved that goal. the agenda doesn't include re-engineering the Ukrainian government to suit ourselves, or redesigning their society to better integrate with ours...those decisions are theirs to make, and if we even try to influence that, then we're just as manipulative as the russians.
Zelensky has stated goals, to join the EU, to join NATO...but those goals will require a lot of reform in the Ukrainian government. right before the war, Zelensky was already working on the problem, but they weren't being seriously considered for either body for years, possibly decades, while they worked on the corruption that was holding them back.
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It is achieving the goal of getting rid of Vlad and removing Russia as a player on the world stage. The nation building and confidence is a byproduct of winning the war against a much larger adversary. Ironically Vlad helped a lot with corruption in Ukraine by providing the people with an example of its destructive effects on Russia. Make no mistake, the veterans of this war will run Ukraine for decades and they didn't fight for that. Zelenskiy's arguments have been made for him by events and his hand is strengthened a lot, the oligarchs who were aligned with Russia were the first victims of the war and their power in Ukraine has been broken by it.

Wars accelerate social and technological change and patriotic war veterans take a dim view of corruption and selling out the country at any level, they will be organized into legion branches too and their support will be critical. Look what corruption did for the Russians seem to be the major political lesson learned here, along with the value of liberal democracy and it's nice and beneficial to be a part of that global community of nations. They say nations don't have friends, they have interests, but in this day and age with so much communication and information, that is not strictly true. Public support is not swayed by interests but by emotion, like the crimes Russia committed in Bucha caused outrage and politicians responded with arms.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Bagginski said:
Go, go, end-of-administration WORKATHON!
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Joe and the allies have been sending weekly pay checks to Ukraine regularly and performance bonuses lately! It appears to be a labor of love, or hate, just give them the weapons and they will finish the fuckers off or they will get out of Ukraine. Leave or be buried here, as they say. :lol:
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
Lots of this going on in Ukraine, it wasn't America or Europe before the war and was Europe's poorest country, so people know how to get by, especially the rural and town people. There is plenty of wood rubble from demolished buildings and one of these in your basement in the suburbs can keep your house warm and the pipes from bursting. They have plenty of coal too and that gives 3 times more heat than wood. These are for soldiers, but anybody with a welder and some scrap laying around can produce them and there is plenty of scrap laying around that can be DIYed and adapted. I figure the Ukrainians will do alright this winter, the Russians not so much.

After the AA systems go in to deal with the missiles, the serious issues with the grid will be addressed to make it more robust. They have the resources of 40 countries power systems to draw on for spares and equipment like trucks for linemen and substation transformers. They are already integrated into the European grid at least the western part is. Free for the army and for sale to civilians, not everybody fights in uniform, this is a national war and involves all levels of society working together in a struggle for existence.


Free for the army: Ukrainian volunteers make potbelly stoves for the Armed Forces of Ukraine

Potbelly stoves for the front for Ukrainian servicemen - for almost 4 months, brothers-volunteers from the Kharkiv region have been making stoves. They started production in the spring at home from used gas cylinders, now they have already organized a full-fledged workshop for production - but now potbelly stoves are created from pipes. They called their project “Give Warmth to a Soldier”. Their potbelly stoves have become so popular that they are now sent to units across the front lines. Read more in the report of Natalia Belokudry.
 
DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member
One reason why I don't think the war in Ukraine will be the end of it there, the more of Vlad's army and economy that is destroyed the better their chances.


'Preparing an army': The Belarusians fighting for Ukraine with one eye on home • FRANCE 24 English

1,054 views Nov 17, 2022
Among the soldiers fighting the Russian invasion of Ukraine are a number of volunteers from neighbouring Belarus, the firm Moscow ally from where the invasion was partly launched. Called the Kalinowski Regiment, they claim to number around 2,000. After defending Ukraine, they are hoping to help bring about change in their homeland, where a series of protests and opposition movements have failed to dislodge strongman leader Alexander Lukashenko.
 
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DIY-HP-LED

DIY-HP-LED

Well-Known Member

Ukrainian Artillerists Battle For Control Of Key Luhansk Highway

14,782 views Nov 17, 2022
The Ukrainian Army is using heavy artillery and drones to try and take control of the Svatove-Kreminna highway inside Ukraine's Luhansk region. Ukrainian artillerists spoke to RFE/RL just across the border in the Kharkiv region about their efforts to break through enemy lines.
 
xtsho

xtsho

Well-Known Member
Did anyone catch the press conference with Secretary of Defense Lloyd Austin and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff General Milley? It was mostly about Ukraine but did deter into China and Taiwan.

I cheered when Milley said this:

"Right now, the United States military is -- without question, despite whatever criticisms people have, the United States military is the most lethal warfighting machine on Earth, bar none. The United States military is number one and we intend to stay number one.

And our task -- militaries only have two tasks. We have a single purpose, really, which is to -- either to prepare for war or to fight a war, and we are laser-focused on that. And we intend to stay number one.

China is not going to be a better military than the United States military is but they're going to try but they're not going to get there. We will be number one five years from now, 10 years from now, and 50 years from now. We are not going to let China take number one."

Check out 40:30

www.defense.gov

Austin, Milley Hold Press Conference on Ukraine

Secretary of Defense Lloyd J. Austin III and Joint Chiefs of Staff Chairman Army Gen. Mark A. Milley brief the news media following a virtual meeting of the Ukraine Defense Contact Group. The group
www.defense.gov

Full transcript:

www.defense.gov

Secretary of Defense Lloyd J. Austin III and Army General Mark A. Milley, Chairman, Joint

Secretary of Defense Lloyd J. Austin III and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff General Mark A. Milley held a press conference following the Ukrainian Defense Contact Group meeting.
www.defense.gov
 
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