neversummer's 2nd Grow: Cabinet DWC - Super Lemon Haze, White Widow, Master Kush

[neversummer28]

cool cool and yea that master kush looks amazing, how was the smoke? u said u already cut some?

as for the 36 hours of dark before flower, i wouldnt bother with that, just put them in flower

at the end of flower put them in 36 hours(or more) of darkness, trick them into thinkin its the end of the world and apparently they produce crazy resin, never tried it myself.

the master kush from my first grow was great, it was really potent but it was a bit fluffy. and really great yield. i think you are referring to the topping, which was done to get 4 main trunks. just started flowering today so not even close to having any bud to try yet.

and yeah, i ended up skipping on the 36 hours. just couldn't find any hard evidence showing that it actually does anything. thanks man.

 

[neversummer28]

NS... I'm with you being wary of HCO products... just go small.

I've now sucessfully used the Bushmaster twice, and the Gravity twice as well. Patience is key.

You got the mix I use off my journal? If not I can reproduce it here. Works like a charm.

As for the plan it sounds good. You might want to stop them with a few inches to go... just to be safe. Otherwise sounds awesome.

Looking forward to the progress my friend.

yeah, i will def be going small with the HCO stuff. i really don't have a problem going even less than what HCO recommends. i'm sure i read your mix, but i totally forget it. could you post it up here and even help out other RIU'ers. as always, thanks jigs.

 

[jigfresh]

yeah, i will def be going small with the HCO stuff. i really don't have a problem going even less than what HCO recommends. i'm sure i read your mix, but i totally forget it. could you post it up here and even help out other RIU'ers. as always, thanks jigs.

I used it like this: Added 2 mL/ gal. Bushmaster, plus my Dutch Master Zone and DM Max Grow. Zone is root condtioner stuff, Max is additive to help nute uptake. I ran this mix for 24 hours only. The ppm is around 150-200. When I changed the rez after 24 hours, I filled back up with weak Flower nutes... My opinion is that the BM is still working and I don't want to burn anything. The flower mix is around 750-800 ppm. Using this on two different grows and 3 different strains I have had great luck.

Simply Bushmaster 2 mL/ Gal. for 24 hours.

 

[HookedOnChronic]

the master kush from my first grow was great, it was really potent but it was a bit fluffy. and really great yield. i think you are referring to the topping, which was done to get 4 main trunks. just started flowering today so not even close to having any bud to try yet.

and yeah, i ended up skipping on the 36 hours. just couldn't find any hard evidence showing that it actually does anything. thanks man.

yea did u look into the 36 hours of darkness for the end of your flowering period??

and just so u kno im not retarded i meant your harvest when i said u already chopped some, not referring to toppin lol

 

[neversummer28]

I used it like this: Added 2 mL/ gal. Bushmaster, plus my Dutch Master Zone and DM Max Grow. Zone is root condtioner stuff, Max is additive to help nute uptake. I ran this mix for 24 hours only. The ppm is around 150-200. When I changed the rez after 24 hours, I filled back up with weak Flower nutes... My opinion is that the BM is still working and I don't want to burn anything. The flower mix is around 750-800 ppm. Using this on two different grows and 3 different strains I have had great luck.

Simply Bushmaster 2 mL/ Gal. for 24 hours.

So jigs, you used Bushmaster w/o any nutes? Just those supplements? Or can I just add the bushmaster into the res w/ the nutes? I still have have some before I throw in the bushmaster, so I have some time to figure this all out. Appreciate your help.

 

[neversummer28]

yea did u look into the 36 hours of darkness for the end of your flowering period??

and just so u kno im not retarded i meant your harvest when i said u already chopped some, not referring to toppin lol

well i didn't figure you were retarded... really REALLY high maybe, haha. but yeah, i grew the master kush in my first grow and it was wicked.

i haven't looked hard into the 36 hours of darkness at the end of flowering yet, but i will. i've read it before and the logic behind it kind of makes sense. basically light deteriorates THC. so when your plant is flowering, it builds up THC at night and therefore is most potent when the sun first comes up/lights first come on. so i'm thinking the mentality is that the 36 hours of darkness just encourages the plant to keep producing some additional THC before harvest. that's my understanding about it, at least.

 

[neversummer28]

A lot has happened over the last several days. The girls all continue growing at a rapid rate, and the day-to-day stretching is really starting to take off now. The biggest news? All three girls are... well they're all girls! All three have started growing some whiskers, just 4 days into 12/12 lighting. Gotta love it.

The Master Kush seems to be favoring one main trunk out of the four. This trunk is larger and taller than the others.

The Super Lemon Haze also seems to be favoring one main trunk, but it looks like I'll have three main trunks for her. I also performed some surgery on her over the weekend. For the main original growth, I clipped the awkward growth in hopes that it will direct all it's energy to the last node it grew. I wanted the plant to stop spending its energy growing it's unique growth, and instead, to start going vertical. Check out the pics below.

I also built my homemade carbon filter. Since my grow box is stealth, I made the filter stealthy too. It simply looks like two boxes stacked on top of my cabinet. I use carbon and netting bought from Petsmart. It is definitely working like a champ! Check out the pics below.

I switched the res again today and went with 10 ml of each of the GH nutes. pH is at about 5.9 and ppm is at around 1200.

Temp right now is in the low 70s with the lights on and low 60s with the lights off.

So question, I totally forget, but when exactly do people consider the start of flowering? When whiskers first show or after?

Pics:
1. All three tonight
2. Homemade carbon filter
3. Exhaust fan before adding the filter
4. Exhaust fan after adding the filter
5. Close-up of SLH's unusual growth
6. SLH after surgery. The small arrow points to where the unusual growth (originally the top of the plant) was growing. The big arrow points to the branch I hope the plant will divert its energy.
7. Master Kush roots
8. Super Lemon Haze roots
9. White Widow roots
10. The girls after the res change... next to some 5 gallon jugs

 

[HookedOnChronic]

personally i consider when the light cycle changes from veg to 12/12 as flower, unless of course your plants started to flower in veg (seen it before) which in that case would be the whiskers, hairs, w/e u wanna call em (i call em pre flowers cause i kno buds are comin)

very nice plants, those root balls are huge lol

 

[jigfresh]

So jigs, you used Bushmaster w/o any nutes? Just those supplements? Or can I just add the bushmaster into the res w/ the nutes? I still have have some before I throw in the bushmaster, so I have some time to figure this all out. Appreciate your help.

I Would Not add bushmaster with nutrients. Clean slate, RO + Bushmaster for 24 hours. In my opinion the plants have enough nutes stuck to their roots to keep them going for 24 hours in just RO. The Bushmaster and it's sister products dramatically increase nutrient uptake so the 24 hours is no problem.

Even when I use gravity, I think I keep the ppm around 300-400 in the 5th week of flowering. That's down from 750-850 before and after the gravity use.

This method has worked like a charm, and I have never nute burned my plants. Also, I've not had to raise my light at all using gravity... I don't know what that is attributed to.

As for flowering... I personally consider the flowering time to begin when you see preflowers, or whiskers. I have been bashed by many for thinking this way... the popular answer is when you switch to 12/12.

I beleive it starts at preflowers for two reasons. One internal and one external. I looked up on two different seed company websites that when they say 8-10 weeks finishing time for a strain, they are starting counting when preflowers show. However, I found another seed company site that said the opposite. The first two seemed to be the most reputable. I don't remember what the sites were... if you really want me to find them again I can.

The internal reason I beleive the preflower idea is this. I feel like the mj plant is not a machine. It seems improbable there is an internal switch in a plant that at one instant switches. In a natural setting a plant would slowly transition through grow cycles with the seasons. In our closet grows we do have a switch (or timer) that changes season in an instant (the instant we reset the timer). I don't beleive the plant knows we do this. I think the first time there is 12 hours of darkness the plant says to itself, "huh... guess it's a long night"... the next 12 hours of darkness it might say "well, I guess it's fall already, that's strange". Then after a few days to a couple weeks the plant has settled in to the fact that all of a sudden it's fall. This is when it starts working on flowering... and this is when I start counting my plant as flowering.

This is also the point I start giving the plant strictly bloom nutrients. As the time between 12/12 and preflowers the plant is still stretching some, still wanting some veg nutes. So the time between is what I call a transition.

I give the plants 36 hours of darkness going into 12/12 to jolt their system. Make them think that 36 hours is when late summer and early fall came and went. Then when the next darkness lasts 12 hours they say "huh, guess that long period of darkness meant it's fall now". I hope they are getting the message faster.

I know I can make things to complicated sometimes, but I enjoy it... and isn't that the point in life. To enjoy it.

Thanks for asking about the BM. And about the flower thing.

 

[neversummer28]

personally i consider when the light cycle changes from veg to 12/12 as flower, unless of course your plants started to flower in veg (seen it before) which in that case would be the whiskers, hairs, w/e u wanna call em (i call em pre flowers cause i kno buds are comin)

very nice plants, those root balls are huge lol

thanks man, sounds like i won't get a 100% agreed-on answer here since you and jigfresh each believe in each of the different school of thoughts.

the roots balls monstrous, aren't they? hahaha. the roots just keep growing but they want to keep growing downwards towards the bottom... problem is, they already reached the bottom weeks ago... gave me a good laugh when i pulled changed the reservoirs last night.

 

[neversummer28]

I Would Not add bushmaster with nutrients. Clean slate, RO + Bushmaster for 24 hours. In my opinion the plants have enough nutes stuck to their roots to keep them going for 24 hours in just RO. The Bushmaster and it's sister products dramatically increase nutrient uptake so the 24 hours is no problem.

Even when I use gravity, I think I keep the ppm around 300-400 in the 5th week of flowering. That's down from 750-850 before and after the gravity use.

This method has worked like a charm, and I have never nute burned my plants. Also, I've not had to raise my light at all using gravity... I don't know what that is attributed to.

As for flowering... I personally consider the flowering time to begin when you see preflowers, or whiskers. I have been bashed by many for thinking this way... the popular answer is when you switch to 12/12.

I beleive it starts at preflowers for two reasons. One internal and one external. I looked up on two different seed company websites that when they say 8-10 weeks finishing time for a strain, they are starting counting when preflowers show. However, I found another seed company site that said the opposite. The first two seemed to be the most reputable. I don't remember what the sites were... if you really want me to find them again I can.

The internal reason I beleive the preflower idea is this. I feel like the mj plant is not a machine. It seems improbable there is an internal switch in a plant that at one instant switches. In a natural setting a plant would slowly transition through grow cycles with the seasons. In our closet grows we do have a switch (or timer) that changes season in an instant (the instant we reset the timer). I don't beleive the plant knows we do this. I think the first time there is 12 hours of darkness the plant says to itself, "huh... guess it's a long night"... the next 12 hours of darkness it might say "well, I guess it's fall already, that's strange". Then after a few days to a couple weeks the plant has settled in to the fact that all of a sudden it's fall. This is when it starts working on flowering... and this is when I start counting my plant as flowering.

This is also the point I start giving the plant strictly bloom nutrients. As the time between 12/12 and preflowers the plant is still stretching some, still wanting some veg nutes. So the time between is what I call a transition.

I give the plants 36 hours of darkness going into 12/12 to jolt their system. Make them think that 36 hours is when late summer and early fall came and went. Then when the next darkness lasts 12 hours they say "huh, guess that long period of darkness meant it's fall now". I hope they are getting the message faster.

I know I can make things to complicated sometimes, but I enjoy it... and isn't that the point in life. To enjoy it.

Thanks for asking about the BM. And about the flower thing.

you have me rolling over here. don't think i'll look at my plants the same way again.

thanks for the info on the BM. okay, so one last question for you... they say that BM not only stops vertical growth, but forces the plant into flowering. well uhhhh... what happens when you use BM and your plant is already flowering?

oh and for everyone else, you have to check out jigfresh's vertical grow journal. you will be blown away, i promise you.

 

[jigfresh]

what happens when you use BM and your plant is already flowering?

Maybe nothing. But it's only a few mL and a rez change, so no loss.

If they are still stretching it will stop that. Otherwise, it may just be a fun experiment.

Glad I could entertain. And thankyou for the endorsment. I am having quite a good time with the vert setup. I can't wait for the buds to develop.

 

[Bucket head]

looking good bro...

 

[Paranoid420]

NS looking really good my man! Have I been away that long? Dont even ask why Im going to start another grow soon as well. Smoked all my stash already it was about 2.5 oz's and went way too fast. The second plant sucked bad. It went hermie but didnt make too many seeds just never got the resin production the first one gave me. It was harsh and tasted like shit. man things will be different this time around I can tell ya!!

 

[neversummer28]

AAAAAAND I'M BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!

Man, I disappear for 9 days and RIU has a whole new look. Well not whole new look, but different enough to throw me off.

Been really busy with work, got sucked into Modern Warfare 2 and just got back from a business trip. The Master Kush and Super Lemon Haze are now 3 ft tall while the White Widow is merely 2 ft. So let's go over what's happened in the last two weeks.

The girls have remained in transitioning nutes. Before my trip, the girls were growing around two inches a day. At one point, I accidentally let the reservoir drop too low and the MK and SLH both got a little nute burn.

With the rapid growth, I had to prepare the whole set-up to anticipate the growing girls... didn't really want to have the girls grow into the lights and burn my place town. To prevent the water level from falling too low and to slow down the growth of the girls, I added about an extra gallon of pH adjusted water to each res... essentially lowering the ppm of the water. I also raised the lights and the fan.

Well, I came home tonight and first thing I did was check on the girls and it worked perfectly. The girls only grew about 1" a day and the reservoirs weren't too low.

I have about 5-10" inches left for the SLH and MK. So my plan is to let the reservoirs drop a little more, increasing the ppm to speed up the growth a bit for two days. On Sunday, I will be replacing the reservoirs with water containing only HCO's Bushmaster. On Monday, I will then replace the reservoirs with flowering nutes.

For the White Widow, I will just go straight to flowering nutes. This girl is considerably smaller so I'd like her to keep growing.

This new set-up is hard to get full pictures with the angle.

 

[neversummer28]

looking good bro...

thanks buckethead! been a while.

NS looking really good my man! Have I been away that long? Dont even ask why Im going to start another grow soon as well. Smoked all my stash already it was about 2.5 oz's and went way too fast. The second plant sucked bad. It went hermie but didnt make too many seeds just never got the resin production the first one gave me. It was harsh and tasted like shit. man things will be different this time around I can tell ya!!

yo yo yo 'noid, welcome back. dude, you already smoked 2.5 oz's? daaaaaaaaaaamn. you rolling philly's over there?

so what are you going to grow now? be sure to let me know about the journal.

 

[neversummer28]

All three girls are flowering big time, especially the Master Kush and Super Lemon Haze.

The MK and SLH have about 3-6 inches left of vertical height. Both are about 40" tall. Last night, I drained the reservoirs for the two and filled with pH adjusted water with 2 ml per gal. of HCO's Bushmaster. Ran Bushmaster for 24 hours. The White Widow is a short one so no Bushmaster needed.

Tonight, I changed the reservoirs for all three. The nute soup consisted of 5 ml (per gallon) of Gro, 10 ml of Micro and 15 ml of Bloom. Also still using Hygrozyme, 8 ml per gallon.

The WW received the full strength nute. With the MK and SLH, I diluted the soup to about 1/3 strength. As the girls drink up the water, I will replace the water with the remainder of the nute soup, essentially raising the ppm.

Over the past few nights, I've been clipping away at some of the undergrowth. Not lollipopping, but just removing some of the lower insignificant growth. This way, the girls can direct their growth at the larger branches.

Temp in the cabinet remains in the high 60's. What's scaring me is that the humidity hovers around 70%. I never realized how high the humidity remains during this time of the year. I'm hoping I won't have any problems with mold.

I'll get some pictures up soon.

 

[jweedy]

beautiful setup!!! NICE plants bro!

 

[HookedOnChronic]

wicked job NS! hope the removal of the undergrowth works wonders for ya

another things is you should move any large fan leaves out of the way of bud sites, if your buds dont get direct light they will be tiny and fluffy, thats why a lot of people do trim the undergrowth right off id imagine, although tucking the leaves behind branches works great too which is what i recommend u try.

 

[neversummer28]

The Bushmaster seems to have worked. The MK and SLH's vertical growth has slowed drastically, growing about an in inch in the past day.

Something I kept forgetting to mention. "Uncle Ben's" topping method didn't quite work in growing four main trunks. The MK decided to favor one trunk, I'm thinking because it was closest to the HID. The WW favored two trunks, no idea why those two and not the other. So the method didn't work for me, but it still provided several main points of growth.

No other major updates today, just some pics I promised yesterday.

1. All three girls
2. Head-on view of MK (left) and SLH (right)
3. Head-on view of WW (right) and SLH (left)
4. MK in full bloom
5. Artistic shot of SLH's flower
6. WW just starting to bloom