Soil VS Hydro- Whats cheaper

bangthangonme

Active Member
Im upgrading my 2x4x5 grow tent to at least a 4x4x7, and going from a 400w hps to a 1000w mh/hps combo for $189 on ebay(tell me if anyone thinks these are too cheap and will not be worth it in the long run, i know they are not cooled at all just cheap reflector like the one i have now.) Also if anyone knows the best type of cheap reflector to cover the most space please let me kno. My question is, is it cheaper in the short and long run to grow hydroponically or with soil indoors, with the cost of soil vs. the cost of hydro medium and so on? It seems like less and less people are growing using soil, and I spent almost $20 a bag for FFOF at the nearest grow shop.
 

hillbillybobb

Active Member
Im upgrading my 2x4x5 grow tent to at least a 4x4x7, and going from a 400w hps to a 1000w mh/hps combo for $189 on ebay(tell me if anyone thinks these are too cheap and will not be worth it in the long run, i know they are not cooled at all just cheap reflector like the one i have now.) Also if anyone knows the best type of cheap reflector to cover the most space please let me kno. My question is, is it cheaper in the short and long run to grow hydroponically or with soil indoors, with the cost of soil vs. the cost of hydro medium and so on? It seems like less and less people are growing using soil, and I spent almost $20 a bag for FFOF at the nearest grow shop.
i think if your growing in a tent you should consider using a air cooled hood. at HTG supply i got a aircooled hood for like $30 extra with my light. i know tent makers say they have the liner problems fixed but i still dont trust it. just my opinion. . i think the investment of a hydro system is one thing but the cost and time of maintence to run it is not for me. not knocking hydro in anyway i actually think hydro setups are cool as shit. i personally use soil because its simple, i grow organic for two, and ive developed a soil mix that allowes me to make a bag of quality organic soil for around $ 6- $9 a cubic foot. if your interested let me know i can post.
 

3lions

New Member
Cooling is often going to be the main issue so a lot depends on what system you have in place already. i.e can you run airecon? If heat isnt an issue you could use adjustawings and spreaders or something. Or as mentioned, aircoooled hoods.

As for costs, it again depends on your set up and what you wish to achieve? If it is about just yield then perhaps hydro may be slightly cheaper per grow, achieving perhaps, all things being equal a larger yield. If quality is more the concern and you are a connoisseur then it has to be bio soil grow

Just my 2 centimos
 

bangthangonme

Active Member
what should mix with FFOF other than perlite to get a good yet cheap mix,and should i add perlite to the bottom of the pot or all throughout the soil?
 

3lions

New Member
throughout the soil. A good mix will have it mixed in already! Ensure it is not time release nutes
 

hillbillybobb

Active Member
hillbillybob's soil mix
i made this mix using a combination of a base mix i found in a recipe from another site and some added things. the entire thread is at the bottom of this one if you want to check it out. like i said i have only used soil mix#1 with fertilizer recipe # 1 so i cannot say how good the other recipes work. anyways this is what i use and with great success.

(base mix)

peat moss
worm castings
perlite
dolomite lime



i found a soilless mix last year that i tried and had good texture but i didnt like the ratio of nutrients ( lc's soilless mix # 1 ) it called for :

5 parts coco-coir or sphagnum peat moss
3 parts perlite
2 parts worm castings
(1 cup of lime per cubic foot )

to make this base mix you use a 3 quart bowl or saucepan as parts and it equals 1 cubic foot each time you mix the 5 parts, 3 parts and 2 parts. you can add 1 cup of dolomite lime to each cubic foot to make it easy. their were different recipes for fertilizers but the recipe i used recipe # 1 had the wrong ratio of nutrients. i started having deficincies going into flowering using recipe #1 and this was supposed to be a just add water mix all the way to the end. so i decided to make a mix to get me 30 + days into veg which is all i veg for anyways, and then just use a complete bloom nute to finish. so this is what i came up with:

5 parts coco-coir or sphagnum peat moss
3 parts perlite
2 parts worm castings
1 cup powdered lime per cubic foot
4- 41/2 cups epsoma brand PLANT -TONE fertilizer
1- 2 tbsp of epsoma brand KELP MEAL
2 tbsp of rooters mycorrhizae
1- 2 tbsp of azomite ( optional but reccomended )

this is what i use. i mix all the peat, perlite, & castings together using a 3qt saucepan to make it an easy and even cu ft each time, add the powdered stuff. mix very well then water with mollasses water 2 tbsp per gallon using filtered, distilled or water that clorine has been dissolved. cover and let it set for a few weeks with the lid on cracking the lid and stiring now and then and your good. this mix works very well and it will get you 30 days + into veg no problem just water. using this i really dont use any N rich fertilizer at all. just get a good bloom fertilizer and maybe a tea like product like big bloom in case any deficinces or make your own tea, but that would cover you. you can supplement the worm castings with mushroom compost, regular compost , manure will even work but the worm castings would be best. the thing i like most about this mix is that it's well balanced, cheap to make, and available at most home depot or loews stores with the exception of the fungus and azomite which you can order anywhere on the internet.

you can also use this as a seedling / cutting mix:

5 parts coco-coir or sphagnum peat moss
3 parts perlite
2 parts worm castings
(1 cup of lime per cubic foot )
2 tbsp of rooters mycorrhizae

this is just the base without the ferts. this is great for seedlings and cuttings. i hope this helps you out or helps someone that reads this.



LC'S SOILLESS MIX



LC's Mix is great for any stage of growth. You can germ seeds in it, grow mothers in it, root clones in it as well as veg and flower in it.

LC’s Soiless Mix #1:
5 parts Canadian Spaghnam Peat or Coir or Pro-Moss
3 parts perlite
2 parts wormcastings or mushroom compost or home made compost
Powdered (NOT PELLETIZED) dolomite lime @ 2 tablespoons per gallon or 1 cup per cubic foot of the soiless mix.
...Wal-Mart now sells worm castings.

Or, if you use Pro Mix or Sunshine Mix...
LC's Soiless Mix #2:
6 parts Pro Mix BX or HP / Sunshine Mix (any flavor from #1 up)
2 parts perlite
2 parts earthworm castings
Powdered (NOT PELLETIZED) dolomite lime @ 2 tablespoons per gallon or 1 cup per cubic foot of the soiless mix.
If you use a 3 qt. saucepan as “parts” in the amounts given above, it equals about 1 cu. ft. of soiless mix and you can just dump in a cup of powdered dolomite lime.
But, a "part" can be anything from a tablespoon to a five gallon bucket. Just use the same item for all of the "parts".

Now for the plants organic food source

Choose one of these organic plant food recipes to add to LC's Soiless Mix.

RECIPE #1
If you want to use organic nutes like blood, bone and kelp...
Dry Ferts:
1 tablespoon blood meal per gallon or 1/2 cup per cubic foot of soil mix
2 tablespoons bone meal per gallon or 1 cup per cubic foot of soil mix
1-tablespoon kelp meal per gallon or 1/2 cup per cubic foot of soil mix or Maxicrop 1-0-4 powdered kelp extract as directed
1 tablespoon per gallon or 1/2 cup per cubic foot of Jersey Greensand to supplement the K (potasium) in the Kelp Meal and seaweed extract.
Mix all the dry ferts into the soiless mix well and wet it, but don't soak it with Liquid Karma and water @ 1 tbs./gal. Stir and mix it a few times a week for a week or two so the bacteria can get oxygen and break down the bone meal and make it available. And don't let the mix dry out, keep it moist and add water as needed. It'll also have time to get the humic acids in the Liquid Karma going and the dolomite lime will be better able to adjust the pH of a peat based mixture too.
With this recipe, all you need to do is add plain water until harvest.
When I'm working with seeds, I punch a hole in the bottom of 16 ounce cups and fill them with plain LC's Mix. Lightly wet the mix in the cups and germ one seed in each cup. At the same time I mix enough LC's mix along with the blood/bone/kelp to fill all the 3 gallon flower pots I'm going to use for the grow. After about two weeks, the seedlings and the blood/bone/kelp mix are ready. I transplant the seedlings into the 3 gallon pots and just add water until harvest.
When you go to flower and pull up the males, save the mix in the pots. It is ready to be used again immediately. Just remove the root ball and transplant another seedling into it.

RECIPE #2
If you want to use guano in your soil mix...
Bongaloid's Guano Mix.
Use all these items combined with one gallon of soil mix.
1/3C hi N Guano (Mexican Bat Guano)
1/2C hi P Guano (Jamaican or Indonesian Bat Guano)
1TBS Jersey Greensand
1TBS Kelp Meal


RECIPE #3 (My favorite)
If you want to use guano tea and kelp...

Guano Tea and Kelp:

Seedlings less than 1 month old nute tea mix-
Mix 1 cup earthworm castings into 5 gallons of water to make the tea.
Add 5 tbs. Black Strap Molasses.
Use it to water your seedlings with every 3rd watering.

Veg mix-
1/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano (PSG)
1/3 cup High N Bat Guano (Mexican)
1/3 cup Earth Worm Castings (EWC)
5 tsp. Maxicrop 1-0-4 powdered kelp extract
(That makes the "dry mix". You can make all you want and save it to use later.)
Mix with water @ 1 cup of dry mix into 5 gallons of water to make the tea.
To that 5 gallons of tea add:
5 tbs. Liquid Karma
5 tbs. Black Strap Molasses
Use it to water with every 3rd watering.

Flowering nute tea mix:
2/3 cup Peruvian Seabird Guano
2/3 cup Earth Worm Castings
2/3 cup High P Guano (Indonesian or Jamaican)
5 tsp. Maxicrop 1-0-4 powdered kelp extract
(That makes the "dry mix". You can make all you want and save it to use later.)
Mix with water @ 2 cups of dry mix into 5 gallons of water to make the tea.
To that 5 gallons of tea add:
5 tbs. Liquid Karma
5 tbs. Black Strap Molasses
Use it to water with EVERY watering.

You can use queen size knee high nylon stockings for tea bags. 3 pair for a dollar at the dollar store. Tell 'em you use them for paint strainers. Put the recommended tea in the stocking, tie a loop knot in it and hang it in your tea bucket. The tea should look like a mud puddle. Agitate the bag in the water vigorously. An aquarium pump and air stone will dissolve oxygen into the solution and keep the good bacteria (microherd) alive and thriving. Let it bubble a day or two before you use it. If you find you are making too much tea and having to throw it out, use 2 1/2 gallons of water and cut the nute amount by half.


RECIPE #4
Three Little Birds Method
40 gallons used soil
4 cups alfalfa meal
4 cups bone meal
4 cups kelp meal
4 cups powdered dolomite lime
30 pound bag of earthworm castings . . .
That’s the basic recipe . . .
However we also like to use
4 cups of Greensand
4 cups of Rock Phosphate
4 cups of diatomaceous earth


RECIPE #5
Fish and Seaweed (This is sooo easy)

For veg growth…
1 capful 5-1-1 Fish Emulsion
1 capful Neptune's Harvest 0-0-1 Seaweed or Maxicrop liquid
1 gallon H2O

For early flowering…
1 tbs. Neptune’s Harvest 2-3-1 Fish/Seaweed
1 gallon H2O

For mid to late flowering…
1 tbs. Neptune’s Harvest 2-4-1 Fish
1 gallon H2O

 

thomas12404

Active Member
I started out with soil, and really didn't get good growth. So I took my plants out of the soil, and started up a hydro system. I had the tote and lid. Went bought 3in net pots (.89c ea). pump ($20.00) went with a 60Gal for my 20Gal res. Nutes I found is a must, but you have to get them in order to get good growth with soil, so you just buy for hydro instead. The cost might be a little more expensive, but if you do a DWC system its cheap and the growth speed is so much more worth it. Go hydro and never look back.
 

3lions

New Member
The finest quality cannabis will always be produced without chemicals in soil.

Hydroponics systems with manufactured nutritional formulations may produce much better yields, but they will never touch the quality of the very best soil grown natural and organic cannabis. Besides the quality matter, there are plenty of factors to choose soil over hydroponics.

Soil grows are more eco friendly owing to the technique of fertilizer application; there are no reservoirs to dump down the drain or major leachate from rock wool running off into the natural environment. Plants grown in soil tend not to generate as much odour while growing as a hydro plant, due to the plants transpiring less.

This, along with the fact that there are usually no irrigation timers to breakdown, have given many a grower a much better night's snooze. How many days can an hydroponics unit keep your plants alive without electric power? A serious thing to consider if you are on a dodgy electric system ( like most of Spain appears to be)
 

Fuzzbutter

Active Member
Personally it depends on the whole set-up, but over-all I'd say that soil is cheaper than hydro simply because it takes more electricity to run hydro+lights than just the lights as it would be for soil. Considering though the hyro grows can take less time, then depending on what you're doing with your final product (selling..ect) hydro could make more sense.

I prefer hydro though, my cat seems to like eating my plants that are grown in soil, but she'll leave my ones in my Aerogarden alone...idk why...she's strange. Or she likes to add her own fertilizer to my soil plants...no thank you.
 

cerberus

Well-Known Member
I like dirt.

but

if your talking for business. money is an issue but so is everything else. labor and trash removal, dirt adds significantly where water does not. brining dirt to location and then disctretely removing it (especially if you have perlight in it)..
also hydro "feels" like it produces less stalk and stem, more waste..
something to think about
 

Banditt

Well-Known Member
The finest quality cannabis will always be produced without chemicals in soil.

Hydroponics systems with manufactured nutritional formulations may produce much better yields, but they will never touch the quality of the very best soil grown natural and organic cannabis. Besides the quality matter, there are plenty of factors to choose soil over hydroponics.

Soil grows are more eco friendly owing to the technique of fertilizer application; there are no reservoirs to dump down the drain or major leachate from rock wool running off into the natural environment. Plants grown in soil tend not to generate as much odour while growing as a hydro plant, due to the plants transpiring less.

This, along with the fact that there are usually no irrigation timers to breakdown, have given many a grower a much better night's snooze. How many days can an hydroponics unit keep your plants alive without electric power? A serious thing to consider if you are on a dodgy electric system ( like most of Spain appears to be)

blah blah blah blah. You soil guys are funny. Keep telling yourself that one day maybe it will become true. The fact of the matter is there is not much different in taste or quality between hydroponic and soil grown bud. People will try to tell you there is, but I guarantee if I put my hydro nugs against someone else's organic nugs in a blind taste test 99.9% of you wouldn't know the difference. So to each his own.
 
This whole idea that soil is capable of so much more taste makes no sense. The soil is just the medium. Provided with the exact same nutrients, why would anyone think that the less efficient delivery method would produce better results? If anything I would say that hydro has the potential for better taste because the level of control is so much higher.
 

cerberus

Well-Known Member
the proccess to an ending will always change the outcome of that ending. water will be different than dirt, because its a different proccess to come to the end.. I wont weigh in one which is better but rest assure they are not the same..
 

LightningMcGreen

Active Member
Soil is def cheaper...hydro you have water/air pumps + timers for them (that in itself is the more expensive part, but as far as power consumption the pumps dont really add much to the electric bill)...you will achieve quicker growth in hydro for sure, as you can really dial in the ppm of the nutes to optimal conditions (but hydro nutes cost a helluva lot more)

If lugging around soil and disposing of it is a hassle or problem, just do a hempy bucket grow (straight perlite buckets, with drainage holes 2 inches above the bottom of the bucket so the plants hav a mini-res to feed from as perlite doesnt retain a whole lot of water)...it's ph neutral and can be re-used over and over
 

mj123

Well-Known Member
Soil and it grow the best...........................................................................................................................Fing weed by far hydro is for comersh aka bunk weed.......................................................................................................................
 
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