crossing strains

[charface]

I have been reading a bit lately and I just need to know I`m on the right track.

I have two strains that are stable and enjoyable.

I want to herm one of them and seed the other with it.
Should the bi-product of that be stable and contain traits from both strains?

Hermie the Afwreck to seed the Bubba.

Or if I hermied the Bubba to seed the Afwreck
would it turn out the same as above?

My original goal is to seed the afwreck with itself and the crossing was an after thought but if anyone can tell me if it would work I would appreciate it.
Even if it is a correct start I can start learning about what comes next.

 

[dr.greenthumbbb]

How would you go about causeing them to hermie, and useing one for a hermie would be different from the other one as a hermie becasue of the traits that they would pass. and depending on how u plan to casue them to hermie it will cause the seed u get from them to be 50% hermie and 50% feminized according to some articles from my high times.......

 

[charface]

I have decided to try and see for myself.
But colloidal silver is the rout I plan to take for the hermie.
That way I can be selective about what hermies and what does not.
Then collect the pollen and dust a few clones with it.

Starting with these two strains that I know to be stable as far ar heriming goes will allow me to see if the offspring hermie.
From what I have been reading unless one of the two was predisposed to being a hermie you are good.
I think the bad breeders people bitch about are the ones who pass around seeds from genetics that were predisposed.

 

[dr.greenthumbbb]

I am unfamilair with this techinque but will research so im up to par with your vocab and from what i can take from your post it sounds quite the reliable methode and will speak more with you on this subject because i too plan on doing some breeding this grow (i already have pollen from a male plant i grew over the summer)

 

[charface]

Check back in a few and I will post a link to the thread I have been reading. It tells ya how to make the silver and all.

 

[dr.greenthumbbb]

will do and ive been doing some reading and every1 says it works great for feminized seeds and it looks quite simple to produce.....

 

[Ringsixty]

Fun and Exciting Experiment
CS works fine. I will assume you will be buying the CS or making it yourself.
The DIY method does require you to use Fine Silver 99.9%. If that is an issue. I know for a fact you can use Sterling Silver 925. Just let the other Metals that leached out settle and only use the top part of the solution.

I got balls on my donor plant and my girls are horney.
Just waiting for the Bananas to open and pollinate my girls.
I'm doing:
Purple Train Wreck + Afgoo
Purple Train Wreck + ICE
Purple Train Wreck + White Widow
Purple Train Wreck + Aurora Borialis
Purple Train Wreck +Purple Train Wreck

Don't know what I'm going to get.. But, it's fun

I did an Xcel work sheet, breaking down the strains to see. What common strains were used to create the original strains. Just a way to see what traits may become dominate in their offspring.
But, yah know, true info on the strains can be unreliable.
So, I will just harvest the seeds and pop them and see what I get... LOL

Good Luck on you CS/ Fem experiment

 

[charface]

Thanks, I have grown purple wreck in the past and it really has a ton of trichs and an almost deadly smell. I did not get much for yeild but I would like to try it again and see if I can do better.

I`m going to make the silver solution with the 12v dc 600ma power supplyand .9999 silver BUT if anyone wants to buy it I read that the oxymin brand 50mg per litre should work fine. I found it for 36 bucks for 500ml..

I really like the Afwreck
(Afghan x Train wreck) all around performer.
Sounds like you have all the makings to try it. Check my sig for pics of it.

EDIT: OI can not find the link but it was page after page. There is a lot of info here though.

 

[dr.greenthumbbb]

NICE....its alright ive been doin some readings and think im pretty well up to par (well, enough to follow this and understand what more experienced persons might post such as yourself and ringsixty)

 

[charface]

Do not confuse with a more experienced person. I`m more of a parrot. lol
Good luck man

 

[Pipe Dream]

You can definitely create a cross but what the outcome will be is really unknown. Being as the strains in question are hybrids they will not breed true and you would likely get a variety of different phenotypes. I honestly don't think it would matter which plant you chose to reverse because the chromosomes they can give would not change. If you want to find more indica plants use the bubba, if you want to find more extreme sativa phenotypes, just cross the afreck by herself and you will have f2s (assuming afreck is afgani x trainwreck)

 

[dr.greenthumbbb]

Do not confuse with a more experienced person. I`m more of a parrot. lol
Good luck man

Indeed, but nuntheless you have the knowledge in your mind and are going to execute the plan.....but thx for the tips and for the wish of luck and the same goes back to ya,,in my high times there is a bottle of spray that you can buy from a feller that does the same thing as what your doing and i think its only like 10-20 bucks for a 1oz bottle (which only teats 1 branch of a plant)

 

[dr.greenthumbbb]

You can definitely create a cross but what the outcome will be is really unknown. Being as the strains in question are hybrids they will not breed true and you would likely get a variety of different phenotypes. I honestly don't think it would matter which plant you chose to reverse because the chromosomes they can give would not change. If you want to find more indica plants use the bubba, if you want to find more extreme sativa phenotypes, just cross the afreck by herself and you will have f2s (assuming afreck is afgani x trainwreck)

which of the too crosses would you find to be more suitable for your particular smoking preference

 

[charface]

I`m thinking of just seeding a clone that is very small so I wont need much.

 

[Ringsixty]

Do not confuse with a more experienced person. I`m more of a parrot. lol
Good luck man

Same Here

 

[charface]

You can definitely create a cross but what the outcome will be is really unknown. Being as the strains in question are hybrids they will not breed true and you would likely get a variety of different phenotypes. I honestly don't think it would matter which plant you chose to reverse because the chromosomes they can give would not change. If you want to find more indica plants use the bubba, if you want to find more extreme sativa phenotypes, just cross the afreck by herself and you will have f2s (assuming afreck is afgani x trainwreck)

Thank you. I wondered about the hybrid part as that is a lot of
genetics. So as long as I found a good pheno of my cross and made it a mother I should still get a clone only strain that is predictable yes?

 

[Ringsixty]

I`m thinking of just seeding a clone that is very small so I wont need much.

That's what I did...Just flowered some clones early. Only need a few or dozen seeds from each cross.

 

[charface]

I guess it is a whole other subject but seed viability comes into play here too. So I guess I will need to do this every few years to ensure I have good backup seeds around.

 

[Kite High]

do it dude...I do and absolutely love the results...whichever ones smell and taste you prefer use the silver on...I uses sts...heres how:

The following is a safe, inexpensive, and successful method for reversing the sex of female cannabis plants. Individual plant responses may vary based upon strain, but I can verify that this process is fully effective in stimulating profuse staminate flower production.


This process can be used to:
A: create new feminized seeds from solitary prize mothers that you currently have
B: create interesting feminized-seed hybrids from different prize strains that you currently have
C: create feminized seeds for optimum outdoor use
D: accelerate the "interview" phase of cultivation, in searching for interesting new clone-mothers
E: reduce total plant numbers- great for medical users with severe plant number restrictions
F: increase variety, by helping to create stable feminized seedlines to be used as an alternative to clones

At the bottom of this post are some specific details about the chemicals used, their safety, their cost, and where to get them.

It is important to educate yourself about cannabis breeding theory and technique prior to using a method like this one. [removed dead link]

It is also important to use basic safety precautions when mixing and handling these chemicals, so read the safety data links provided. The risk is similar to mixing and handling chemical fertilizers, and similar handling procedures are sufficient.

Remember: nothing will ever replace good genetics, and some of your bounty should always go back towards the professional cannabis breeders out there... the ones who have worked for many generations to come up with their true-breeding F1 masterpieces. Support professional breeders by buying their seeds. [removed link to shut down bank]

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Preparation of STS:
First, a stock solution is made. It consists of two parts (A and B) that are initially mixed separately, then blended together. Part A is ALWAYS mixed into part B while stirring rapidly. Use distilled water; tap water may cause precipitates to form.

Wear gloves while mixing and using these chemicals, and mix and use in a properly ventilated area. A mask will prevent the breathing of any dust, which is caustic. STS is colorless and odorless, and poses minimal health risks if used as described here. (See material safety data sheet links below). Note that silver nitrate and STS can cause brown stains upon drying, so spray over newspaper and avoid spilling.

Part A: .5 gram silver nitrate stirred into 500ml distilled water
Part B: 2.5 grams sodium thiosulfate (anhydrous) stirred into 500ml distilled water

The silver nitrate dissolves within 15 seconds. The sodium thiosulfate takes 30-45 seconds to dissolve.

The silver nitrate solution (A) is then mixed into the sodium thiosulfate solution (B) while stirring rapidly. The resulting blend is stock silver thiosulfate solution (STS).

This stock solution is then diluted at a ratio of 1:9 to make a working solution. For example, 100ml of stock STS is added to 900ml of distilled water. This is then sprayed on select female plants.

Both the stock STS and the working solution should be refrigerated after use, as well as the powdered chemicals, to avoid activity loss. Excess working solution can be safely poured down the drain after use (with ample running water) with negligible environmental impact. It's pretty cheap.

Each liter of stock STS will make ten 1-liter batches of working solution of STS. With the minimum amount of base chemicals ordered from Photographer's Formulary (see link below), this means that each 1-liter bottle of working solution STS costs less than 9 cents, and can treat 15-20 mid-sized plants. That's 200 1-liter batches of STS for $18. Note that the distilled water costs far more than the chemicals.

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Application:
The STS working solution is sprayed on select female plants until runoff. Do the spraying over newspaper in a separate area from the flower room. You probably won't smell anything, but ventilate anyway. You now have what I call a "F>M plant"; a female plant that will produce male flowers.

After the F>M plant dries move it into 12/12 immediately. This is usually done three to four weeks prior to the date that the target (to be pollinated) plants will be ready to pollinate. Response times may vary slightly depending upon the strain. More specific times can be determined by trial with your own individual strains. In my trials it took 26 days for the first pollen. 30-35 days seems optimum for planning purposes.

So, assuming that a target plant needs 3-4 weeks to produce fully mature seeds, a strain that takes 8 weeks to mature should be moved into flower at about the same time as the female>male plant. A target plant that finishes flowering in 6 weeks needs to be moved into flower later (10 days or so) so that it doesn't finish before the seeds can fully mature.

A seeded individual branch can be left to mature on a plant for a bit longer, while harvesting the other seedless buds if they finish first. Just leave enough leaves on for the plant for it to stay healthy.

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Effects:
Within days I noticed a yellowing of the leaves on the F>M plants. This effect persisted for two weeks or so; after this they became green again, except for a few of the larger fans. The plants otherwise seemed healthy. No burning was observed. Growth stopped dead for the first ten days, and then resumed slowly. No stretch was ever seen. After two weeks the F>M plants were obviously forming male flower clusters. Not just a few clusters of balls, but complete male flower tops. One plant still formed some pistillate flowers, but overall it was predominantly male.

It is strange indeed to see an old girlfriend that you know like the back of your hand go through a sex change. I'll admit that things were awkward between us at first.

When the F>M plants look like they may soon open and release pollen, ( 3-1/2 to 4 weeks) move them from the main flower room into another unventilated room or closet with lighting on a 12/12 timer. Don't worry too much about watts per square foot; it will only be temporary.

When the pollen flies, move your target plants into the closet and pollinate.

A more controlled approach is to isolate the F>M plants in a third remote closet (no light is necessary in this one, as they are releasing pollen now and are nearly finished anyway). In this remote other closet the pollen is very carefully collected in a plastic produce bag or newspaper sleeve and then brought back to the lighted closet, where the target plants are now located. If this is done, be careful to not mix pollen types by letting the F>Ms dust each other. Avoid movement, or use yet another closet.

Take special care to not let pollen gather on the outside of this bag- a static charge is sometimes present. Drop small open clusters of blooms inside and then close the bag at the mouth and shake. Important: next, step outside and slowly release the excess air from the bag, collapsing it completely, so that pollen doesn't get released accidentally. Points downwind; don’t let it get on your hands or clothes.

This collapsed pollinated bag is now very carefully slipped over only one branch and is then tied off tightly at the mouth around the branch stem with a twist tie or tape, sealing the pollen inside. Let the bag inflate slightly with air again before sealing it off, so the branch can breathe. This technique keeps the entire plant from seeding. Agitate the bag a bit after tying it off to distribute the pollen. Don't forget to label the branch so you know which seeds are which. Other branches on this same plant can be hit with different pollen sources.

If no lighted closet is available, the plant can be moved back into the main room, but- be very careful: pollen is sneaky. After 4-5 days, the bag is gently removed and the plant completes its flowering cycle.

Yet another method has worked well for me. I position the target plants in a non-ventilated lighted closet, and then I collect pollen on a piece of mirror or glass. This is then carefully applied to the pistils of one pre-labeled branch by using a very fine watercolor paintbrush. Care is taken to not agitate the branch or the pollen. No sneezing. The plant needs to be in place first; moving it after pollination can shake pollen free and blow this technique.

Regardless of technique, at completion you will have feminized seeds. Let them dry for 2-4 weeks.

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About the chemicals:
Silver nitrate is a white crystalline light-sensitive chemical that is commonly used in photography. It is also used in babies' eyes at birth to prevent blindness. It can cause mild skin irritation, and it stains brown. Avoid breathing. I didn't notice any smell or fumes, but ventilation is recommended. Be sure to wash the spray bottle well before you use it elsewhere; better yet: devote a bottle to STS use. A half gram is a surprisingly small amount; it would fit inside a gel capsule.

Where to get the chemicals:
photoformulary.com http://www.photoformulary.com

silver nitrate: 10 grams: $10
sodium thiosulfate (anhydrous): 100 grams: $3.95
Postage runs around $4. Fast service. [verified!]

Have fun experimenting with this technique. Use it responsibly. There are a few good threads here at CW that goes into the pros and cons of transsexual agents and feminized seeds. Read them. And most importantly, use STS with quality F1 strains developed by professional breeders for the most consistent results

 

[Ringsixty]

Thanks, I have grown purple wreck in the past and it really has a ton of trichs and an almost deadly smell. I did not get much for yeild but I would like to try it again and see if I can do better.

I`m going to make the silver solution with the 12v dc 600ma power supplyand .9999 silver BUT if anyone wants to buy it I read that the oxymin brand 50mg per litre should work fine. I found it for 36 bucks for 500ml..

I really like the Afwreck
(Afghan x Train wreck) all around performer.
Sounds like you have all the makings to try it. Check my sig for pics of it.

EDIT: OI can not find the link but it was page after page. There is a lot of info here though.

Yep, Purple Train Wreck does not produce big yields. But, I like the smoke.