2012: Do Jews Believe in Predestination?

BongTokinAlcoholic420

Well-Known Member
Many do. Ever hear the words “it was baschert“?
But maybe the better question should be:
Should Jews believe in predestination, in God’s foreordaining of what is to be in our lives?
2012
You have probably heard about the “December 21, 2012 – Doomsday” the day when the world is prophesized to come to an end. (My kids have seen the movie – they don’t recommend it.) The excitement stems from the ancient Mayan calendar which states that the world will end in December 21, 2012.

The calendar states that on December 21, 2012, the sun will rise on the dark rift of the center of the milky way which is referred to as a black hole, a galactic event which takes place only once every 25,800 years! -
Something big is predestined to happen! Some claim it will be end of the world.
What do Jews think about this notion of predetermination?
The Sale of Yosef
Immediately after revealing his true identity to his brothers (Parashat Vayigash – last week) Yosef tells them the following:
I am Yosef your brother! You sold me to Egypt. Now don’t worry or feel guilty because you sold me. Look! God has sent me ahead of you to save lives! There has been a famine in the area for two years, and for another five years there will be no plowing or harvest. God has sent me ahead of you to insure that you survive in the land and to keep you alive through extraordinary means. Now it is not you who sent me here, but God. He has made me Pharaoh’s vizier, director of his entire government, and in charge of all of Egypt. (Genesis 44:4-8)
No less than three times, Yosef assures his brothers that essentially they had nothing to do with the current situation. It was “meant to be” – baschert – predestined – and at the very most, the brothers were but pawns in the realization of God’s plans. “Do not feel guilty,” he encourages them – it was not them, but the benevolent hand of the Almighty working in mysterious ways.
I personally have a problem with these words, with this approach.
Should the brothers really bear no guilt for their actions, for their deceptions and lies?
In this week’s Torah reading (Parashat Vayechi), after the death and burial of father Yakov, the brothers send word to Yosef, in their father’s name, saying that prior to his death he asked that they be forgiven for the sin they committed, for the evil they had done to Yosef years ago.
It seems that Yosef’s little speech from “last week” was not convincing, and either they still felt guilty, or they feared revenge now that Yakov their father is out of the picture. Once again Yosef assures them that all is well – that they need not fear vengeance. However, this time Yosef’s words of assurance are a bit different. He does not say that they are free of guilt. Paying close attention to his words at that time, here is what he says:
Don’t be afraid. Shall I take the place of God? You might have meant to do me harm, but God made it come out good. He made it come out as it actually did, where the life of a great nation has been preserved. (Genesis 50:19-20)
In other words, the way I understand Yosef at this point is that he is acknowledging their guilt, their sin, but stating that it is not his place to stand in judgement. In addition, although they did harm him, although they did take action that was not in any way pardonable, nonetheless God never abandoned Yosef. He blessed him so that he could provide for the salvation of the great nation of Egypt(based on the interpretation 0f Seforno).
This is not predestination. Rather, I suggest that this is the meaning of blessing.
When God blesses a person or a nation,that does not mean that God micromanages, determining what is to happen to them; rather, God maintains a closeness with that person or nation, a closeness or presence that opens up opportunities for them; however, what happens is not predestined – not programmed ahead of time by God.
In a book I have recently completed entitled Where’s My Miracle (that will soon be published by Gefen), I include a powerful teaching of Rabbi Hayim David HaLevy, former chief rabbi of Tel Aviv:
This way of thinking is far removed from the masses who see in every occurrence without exception the hand of God. This approach has been handed down to us by Arab fatalism, a way of thinking that interprets everything that happens to a person and to humanity as decreed from the beginning, and that there is no escaping or preventing it from happening. Other religions have adopted that way of thinking, and have tied it to the will of God, Who decrees all.
This is not the way of thought of our holy Torah…. When we know for certain the specific cause of a human tragedy, there is no need to search for divine decrees or punishments….[1]
I am a great believer that the State of Israel is a modern-day miracle.
However, it did not fall into our laps – God blessed us at that hour, and we took advantage of the opportunities, of the doors that opened up before us.
Perhaps at the heat of the moment, when he revealed himself to his brothers, Yosef needed to assure his brothers that all was meant to be, that they should not feel guilty, so as not to allow them to dwell too much on the issue and to move forward, bringing their father and families to Egypt in order to save them from the famine. He wanted to assure them that they would not be thrown into prison, they would not suffer punishment – that all of that was behind them – a little exaggeration for the greater good.
However, years later, when they again bring up the issue, Yosef tells them what he really thinks. They did sin, they are guilty, but he is not their judge.
He remains thankful for the blessings in his life, for the ever-presence of God Who has given him the strength and the wisdom to save the lives of so many, Who has endowed him with the insight to turn lemons into lemonade.
 
you guys freak me out with this crap man....if it does happen you better believe ima roll up the biggest blunt of the skunkiest bud I can find sit back in a lawn chair and kiss my ass goodbye haha I hate even thinking about that stuff....creepy
 
Im sorry but.....Y2K!!!!! OMG EVERYTHINGS GONNA GO HAYWIRE AND THE WORLDS GONNA END!!!!!!!! OMG STOCK YOUR BASEMENTS LOAD YOUR GUNS!!!!! hahaha you guys need to lay off the MJ for awhile
 
the signs dont point to anything but another financial collapse in 10 years time.

if the world ends on 2012, its gonna be surprising as fuck.

besides, that 2012 is just the End of the mayan calendar, if they had lasted any longer, they would have made a new one, just wasnt any point making more then, hundreds of years till it ran out for them.

and hey, the mayan civilazation ended, so how good could their predictions have been,really?

think about it.
 
im still on the edge...I think it scares me too much to believe that it could happen. I hope it doesn't, Imagine the freaking cannabis that'll be grown in like 2060? FUCKIN FIIIIRE!!! hahaha
 
i studied the paranormal for years, predictions and whatnot.

im about as worried about 2012 as i was about y2k.

absolutely not at all (i know computers too and found the whole thing preposterous)

in fact, i do see rather hope for the future, many signs point to that.
there might be a great change coming, but i think it will be a good one.

might also just happen really slowly or not at all, or a great boom overnight.

but thats the future and this is now.

and the thing about great changes, you cant really prepare for them, they tend to be as surprising as fuck.

besides, even if things turned for the worst, we could handle that better than most as growers.
and someone once said that mj growers are probably the best growers on the planet and most cutting edge.

and plants are basically food and what else do you really need if things go in the worst way?

goes any worse and you wont have to worry about a thing anyway, just enjoy the afterlife.
 
I think only cali and surrounding areas will suffer the effects of 2012, based on predictions from hopi's and nostradamus.

nostradamus also didn't belive the end of the world would happen till i belive 3037...


I want to know what Myrddin had to say on the subject...
 
i studied the paranormal for years, predictions and whatnot.

im about as worried about 2012 as i was about y2k.

absolutely not at all (i know computers too and found the whole thing preposterous)

in fact, i do see rather hope for the future, many signs point to that.
there might be a great change coming, but i think it will be a good one.

might also just happen really slowly or not at all, or a great boom overnight.

but thats the future and this is now.

and the thing about great changes, you cant really prepare for them, they tend to be as surprising as fuck.

besides, even if things turned for the worst, we could handle that better than most as growers.
and someone once said that mj growers are probably the best growers on the planet and most cutting edge.

and plants are basically food and what else do you really need if things go in the worst way?

goes any worse and you wont have to worry about a thing anyway, just enjoy the afterlife.

all the bold is true.
 
i studied the paranormal for years, predictions and whatnot.

im about as worried about 2012 as i was about y2k.

absolutely not at all (i know computers too and found the whole thing preposterous)

in fact, i do see rather hope for the future, many signs point to that.
there might be a great change coming, but i think it will be a good one.

might also just happen really slowly or not at all, or a great boom overnight.

but thats the future and this is now.

and the thing about great changes, you cant really prepare for them, they tend to be as surprising as fuck.

besides, even if things turned for the worst, we could handle that better than most as growers.
and someone once said that mj growers are probably the best growers on the planet and most cutting edge.

and plants are basically food and what else do you really need if things go in the worst way?

goes any worse and you wont have to worry about a thing anyway, just enjoy the afterlife.
If your beliefs are not at all based on recent revolutions, then I believe you.
 
I think only cali and surrounding areas will suffer the effects of 2012, based on predictions from hopi's and nostradamus.

nostradamus also didn't belive the end of the world would happen till i belive 3037...


I want to know what Myrddin had to say on the subject...

yes i think because marijuana will be legalized "completely" and that will hurt their economy...
 
I dont think there economy would be hurt by one single crop, well i mean one thats already not taxed, i mean. unless they tax it all and then stop. if anything making it legal might help, you could grow your own, thus spending money you might have spent on buying weed on other things stimulating the economy, buy a big screen, and save your state. lol I dont know im no economist or anything..

its highly likely cali will not exist forever, science has "proven" it will sink/flood, when it will happen is up for grabs could be this year could be in a million, they could just be plain wrong... but alot of predictions about that area from both science and mystical sources belive 2012 will be the beggining of the end for the west coast. I just know i want some of that arizona beach front property that will exist after words lol

PROVEN BY SCIENCE MEANS SHIT
 
well, i base it on a study of the past (it sucked far more than you can imagine)

and the now. (enlightenment is far more widespread than you would believe)
 
I am just going to put this here.
I have nothing against Israelites

Jews, without a shadow of doubt will start the next world war.

[video=youtube;WwG9pDNSAXA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WwG9pDNSAXA[/video]

:)
 
Back
Top