Affirmative Action is dead

Should Affirmative Action be abolished?

  • Yes

    Votes: 4 44.4%

  • No

    Votes: 5 55.6%
  • Total voters
    9
Jimdamick

Jimdamick

Well-Known Member
WASHINGTON — The Trump administration will encourage the nation’s school superintendents and college presidents to adopt race-blind admissions standards, abandoning an Obama administration policy that called on universities to consider race as a factor in diversifying their campuses, Trump administration officials said.

The reversal would restore the policy set during President George W. Bush’s administration, when officials told schools that it “strongly encourages the use of race-neutral methods” for admitting students to college or assigning them to elementary and secondary schools.

I really don't know about this one
.
I believe in a merit system, but I also think that the usually disenfranchised Latino/Black/Native American communities that almost always had too face sub-standard school systems due to this bull shit, supposedly equal education for all system that the US supposedly has in place, (unless you happened to exist in a impoverished area), then it's tough shit, pull up your boot straps, and deal with it.

My wife is a teacher in an low income Black/Hispanic school district, and has too buy pencils for her students, whereas where I live, 30 miles away, each student gets their own computer.

Something is very wrong here, and it show's with crime and poverty

I think that the blacks and Native Americans especially, considering the experiences they have endured up to date, can use a break, and should.

What is your opinion?
 
SneekyNinja

SneekyNinja

Well-Known Member
Jimdamick said:
WASHINGTON — The Trump administration will encourage the nation’s school superintendents and college presidents to adopt race-blind admissions standards, abandoning an Obama administration policy that called on universities to consider race as a factor in diversifying their campuses, Trump administration officials said.

The reversal would restore the policy set during President George W. Bush’s administration, when officials told schools that it “strongly encourages the use of race-neutral methods” for admitting students to college or assigning them to elementary and secondary schools.

I really don't know about this one
.
I believe in a merit system, but I also think that the usually disenfranchised Latino/Black/Native American communities that almost always had too face sub-standard school systems due to this bull shit, supposedly equal education for all system that the US supposedly has in place, (unless you happened to exist in a impoverished area), then it's tough shit, pull up your boot straps, and deal with it.

My wife is a teacher in an low income Black/Hispanic school district, and has too buy pencils for her students, whereas where I live, 30 miles away, each student gets their own computer.

Something is very wrong here, and it show's with crime and poverty

I think that the blacks and Native Americans especially, considering the experiences they have endured up to date, can use a break, and should.

What is your opinion?
Click to expand...
I think the education system is fucked far beyond discussing affirmative action.

I do however broadly disagree with race based targets/quotas, even well meaning ones.

I wouldn't even allow any identifying information on the part of the college application used for admissions. Just objective fact related to high school grades, etc. with a reference number so the person can be identified after their application is considered on the basis of it's merits, not on the basis of the person's name, SE background or geographic location.

A sort of double blind approach to admissions I suppose, all we can provide is an equal opportunity to people, we can't ensure a positive outcome.

But I also think it should be taxpayer funded. Educated people pay more taxes until they retire than uneducated people, they'll repay it multiple times over.
 
ttystikk

ttystikk

Well-Known Member
Jimdamick said:
WASHINGTON — The Trump administration will encourage the nation’s school superintendents and college presidents to adopt race-blind admissions standards, abandoning an Obama administration policy that called on universities to consider race as a factor in diversifying their campuses, Trump administration officials said.

The reversal would restore the policy set during President George W. Bush’s administration, when officials told schools that it “strongly encourages the use of race-neutral methods” for admitting students to college or assigning them to elementary and secondary schools.

I really don't know about this one
.
I believe in a merit system, but I also think that the usually disenfranchised Latino/Black/Native American communities that almost always had too face sub-standard school systems due to this bull shit, supposedly equal education for all system that the US supposedly has in place, (unless you happened to exist in a impoverished area), then it's tough shit, pull up your boot straps, and deal with it.

My wife is a teacher in an low income Black/Hispanic school district, and has too buy pencils for her students, whereas where I live, 30 miles away, each student gets their own computer.

Something is very wrong here, and it show's with crime and poverty

I think that the blacks and Native Americans especially, considering the experiences they have endured up to date, can use a break, and should.

What is your opinion?
Click to expand...
I think you've touched on some fundamental problems with how our society is structured and you rightly question whether the window dressing of affirmative action is a sufficient response.

My grandfather put a lot of computers in classrooms in districts in Texas with lots of minority students, in his case mostly Hispanic. He even won awards for doing it.

A lot of those poor kids went to college, got degrees in tech and did very well because of him.

Yet what we are doing to our public school system nationwide these days is a disgrace and makes American education the laughingstock of the developed world.

The consequences to our future prosperity and standing in the world are incalculable. Human resources are the most valuable. Even our military has figured this out. WTF is wrong with Washington?
 
SneekyNinja

SneekyNinja

Well-Known Member
UncleBuck said:
the biggest recipients of affirmative action are white women
Click to expand...
That imo is also wrong.

And then conversely, some colleges are beginning to require that people of Asian descent get higher admission scores because they're becoming over-represented.
 
londonfog

londonfog

Well-Known Member
Lets see we had about 246 years of chattel slavery. About 89 years of "Jim Crow" bullshit.
Institutionalize racism is still prevalent and basically is the foundation of this nation, but yet we think it is time it get rid of Affirmative Action :shock::shock:
Some white people can be pure fucking evil. Must be that Neanderthal gene
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
Lord Kanti said:
Then race shouldn't matter. After all, isn't race just a social construct?




Indeed.
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race does matter

people like you made it matter by doing everything you could to keep black people segregated. not only from schools but everywhere else you could
 
UncleBuck

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
londonfog said:
Lets see we had about 246 years of chattel slavery. About 89 years of "Jim Crow" bullshit.
Institutionalize racism is still prevalent and basically is the foundation of this nation, but yet we think it is time it get rid of Affirmative Action :shock::shock:
Some white people can be pure fucking evil. Must be that Neanderthal gene
Click to expand...
the american council on education said they are gonna ignore trump's repeal so it's a meaningless move int he end.

trump lost the second he tried to play this game

it will fire up his racist AF base though. they are nazis
 
SneekyNinja

SneekyNinja

Well-Known Member
londonfog said:
Lets see we had about 246 years of chattel slavery. About 89 years of "Jim Crow" bullshit.
Institutionalize racism is still prevalent and basically is the foundation of this nation, but yet we think it is time it get rid of Affirmative Action :shock::shock:
Some white people can be pure fucking evil. Must be that Neanderthal gene
Click to expand...
For college admissions, do you not think a blind meritocracy would be more beneficial to everyone?
 
SneekyNinja

SneekyNinja

Well-Known Member
londonfog said:
If we lived in a world that was fair and equal to all. We do not.
Universities like Yale show this
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Well their system isn't blind.

They can see the person's name, address, etc now.

Id propose a system whereby the admissions people only see a reference number, grades and other relevant experience/qualifications before making their decision.

Could even just allow a computer system to do the whole thing tbh; input the data, it decides without bias, if accepted have it automatically print an acceptance/refusal letter, etc.

If no human is involved in the process, there cannot be bias shown.
 
londonfog

londonfog

Well-Known Member
SneekyNinja said:
Well their system isn't blind.

They can see the person's name, address, etc now.

Id propose a system whereby the admissions people only see a reference number, grades and other relevant experience/qualifications before making their decision.

Could even just allow a computer system to do the whole thing tbh; input the data, it decides without bias, if accepted have it automatically print an acceptance/refusal letter, etc.

If no human is involved in the process, there cannot be bias shown.
Click to expand...
I agree, but this is not the world we live in.
 
Jimdamick

Jimdamick

Well-Known Member
SneekyNinja said:
For college admissions, do you not think a blind meritocracy would be more beneficial to everyone?
Click to expand...
Nope.
Poverty and racial disparities should be considered, otherwise the playing field is tilted in favor of those that happened to be born white and privileged.
 
Jimdamick

Jimdamick

Well-Known Member
SneekyNinja said:
Just to remind both of you, I also think college should be free.
Click to expand...
I don't need reminding, seeing as I am in the process of figuring out how to pay for my son's admission into college next year.
He has good grades, but probably won't get many scholarship offers (doesn't play sports), and my income level doesn't meet the criteria needed for assistance.
So, here we go again, just another student that will walk out the door into America with a massive debt load that will take him (me) years too pay off.
This American higher educational system is fucked, the only winners are the banks that provide the loans, and the young men/women of America are the losers.
This actually is a national emergency, but we, it seems would rather focus on fucking immigration and the further build up of already the largest military in the world.
Will we fucking EVER get our priorities straight?
Ha ha ha
Fat fucking chance.
 
SneekyNinja

SneekyNinja

Well-Known Member
abandonconflict said:
Who needs AA when Betsy DeVos is making the education system great again?
Click to expand...
She reminds me of what Sarah Palin's retarded sister would be like, if she had one.

She might fuck it all up so badly we have to rebuild from the ground up.

Jimdamick said:
I don't need reminding, seeing as I am in the process of figuring out how to pay for my son's admission into college next year.
He has good grades, but probably won't get many scholarship offers (doesn't play sports), and my income level doesn't meet the criteria needed for assistance.
So, here we go again, just another student that will walk out the door into America with a massive debt load that will take him (me) years too pay off.
This American higher educational system is fucked, the only winners are the banks that provide the loans, and the young men/women of America are the losers.
This actually is a national emergency, but we, it seems would rather focus on fucking immigration and the further build up of already the largest military in the world.
Will we fucking EVER get our priorities straight?
Ha ha ha
Fat fucking chance.
Click to expand...
Feds:
"Fuck your kid, we need to give $2bill of YOUR money to weapon companies to arm teachers"
 
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