Defoliation

FermentedThought · May 10, 2019

struggling with humidity in my little 3x3 tent (400w HPS), day 21 flower on these fem OG Kush. had herm issues on the last run of these seeds. So I'm torn between heavy defoliation to get more airflow or doin some light striping (5 leaf's every week or so) I don't want to stress them and herm them or slow them down (strict deadline, gottta move) 66% rh when lights come on. and it gets to about 55% on hot days. I notice dew on the leaf's in the morning. also recently got a small dehumidifier. gonna use that and see where the humidity goes. not a lot of hope though it was only $30.

Mr.Goodtimes · May 10, 2019

I’d go for a good defoliation if it were me. Makes it easier to see the little ball sacks without all those leaves in the way if they do start to herm.

At home I try to take all the big leaves once every week then pick the ball sacks by hand. At work we clean the plant heavy so we can spot the banana sacks and pull the strain if we need to.

Also it will increase airflow so it’ll cut the PM/mold likely hood a bit.

FermentedThought · May 10, 2019

Thanks for the fast response m8! ill do that when they wake up.

Should I strip a majority of the leaves? what's to much?

Mr.Goodtimes · May 12, 2019

Up to you really.

I like to clean a little bit each week. Just taking the bigger fan leaves and leaves blocking light.

Thundercat · May 12, 2019

Those plants look nice just the way they are. The RH you described is not that high, look up VPD. Plants need the right RH to balance with temps in order to transpire correctly. Put a fan under the canopy if you need more air flow, but you already have light making its way down to your soil and the leaves aren't that dense.

Leaves are what absorb the light you are giving. If you remove them you remove the plants method of generating food to fuel growth. I will remove a leaf here and there if there is major light blockage, but otherwise the plant grows leaves because it needs them. Why do you think people have to keep defoliating or trimming off more leaves.....because the plant puts energy into regrowing them after you remove them.

I'm all for some selective PRUNING. Intentionally removing some lower branches and bud sites that won't get good growth or light.

FermentedThought · May 13, 2019

Thundercat said:
Those plants look nice just the way they are. The RH you described is not that high, look up VPD. Plants need the right RH to balance with temps in order to transpire correctly. Put a fan under the canopy if you need more air flow, but you already have light making its way down to your soil and the leaves aren't that dense.

Leaves are what absorb the light you are giving. If you remove them you remove the plants method of generating food to fuel growth. I will remove a leaf here and there if there is major light blockage, but otherwise the plant grows leaves because it needs them. Why do you think people have to keep defoliating or trimming off more leaves.....because the plant puts energy into regrowing them after you remove them.

I'm all for some selective PRUNING. Intentionally removing some lower branches and bud sites that won't get good growth or light.

that's very reassuring to hear, ill look up VDP. I had bud rot last round so I'm a little paranoid. iv read a lot of opinions on pruning (defoliation is a shit way to describe it, sorry) but im all for more leaves= more better

thanks for the info m8!

Kingrow1 · May 13, 2019

Not sure how your restricting airflow, looks pretty open and free for air tyo flow everywhere to me :-)

coreywebster · May 13, 2019

Add another oscillating monkey fan lower down to blow up at canopy.
Those dehumidifiers are shit , I have one, you will be lucky to shave off 2%.

FermentedThought · May 13, 2019

coreywebster said:
Add another oscillating monkey fan lower down to blow up at canopy.
Those dehumidifiers are shit , I have one, you will be lucky to shave off 2%.

yeahhhh the dehumidifier is pretty shit, its averaging closer to 60% now though. might be because its drying up here in So-Cal. I'm sure when It rains it'll shoot back up. my main concern is bud rot. Any prevention methods? I was told by someone that the "The Amazing Doctor Zymes Eliminator" will help? anyone else have an opinion on this?

Thundercat · May 13, 2019

Air flow is great. A fan like Corey said aiming from the bottom. It doesn't need to blow hard it just needs to blow

. I have only had rot issues very late in flower on very dense large buds. The strains I have now make smaller frostier buds and (knock on wood) they don't mold or rot if I keep air moving. I try to gently check them periodically through late flower just to be safe though.

FermentedThought · May 13, 2019

Thundercat said:
Air flow is great. A fan like Corey said aiming from the bottom. It doesn't need to blow hard it just needs to blow . I have only had rot issues very late in flower on very dense large buds. The strains I have now make smaller frostier buds and (knock on wood) they don't mold or rot if I keep air moving. I try to gently check them periodically through late flower just to be safe though.

nxsov180db said:
Are you sure you're 21 days into flower? I don't see any bud sites.. You should remove fan leaves that are laying on top of each other and big fan leaves at the bottom not getting any light will use up more energy than they provide. Also any fan leaf directly covering a bud should be removed.

Day 25 from flip, vegged them for 21 days from seed so maybe they had a late start on flower. also I went out of town the first 5 days of flower and my neighbor watched and watered them, I gave her some rules but maybe she came in when the lights where off on accident or something. (came back and one plant was growing into the monkey fan, totally my fault leaving it low) ill post updates

kratos015 · May 13, 2019

Good rule of thumb for my indoor plants is to strip the bottom 1/4 to 1/3 of the plant, depending on size and strain.

You should have defoliated a bit more before entering flower, but you can still do it a bit in flower. Strip leaves and small bud sites. Do it all at once instead of over time. Easier for the plant to heal over a single large defoliation than to deal with it constantly.

And don't worry about the stress. Defoliation isn't likely to cause enough stress to cause hermies. However, those tiny buds your getting rid of will cause bananas in some finicky strains. The bananas are more likely to appear on the popcorn fluff on the bottom of the plant, this is because the popcorn buds aren't getting enough light and that can be just enough stress to cause them to straw throwing bananas out depending on the strain.

FermentedThought · May 13, 2019

nxsov180db said:
Are you sure you're 21 days into flower? I don't see any bud sites.. You should remove fan leaves that are laying on top of each other and big fan leaves at the bottom not getting any light will use up more energy than they provide. Also any fan leaf directly covering a bud should be removed.

I didn't find any female parts for the first 14 days almost. saw what looked like some sacks but no titties :-?

definite female now

Thundercat · May 13, 2019

nxsov180db said:
Are you sure you're 21 days into flower? I don't see any bud sites..

While I can't agree with your advice to remove lots of leaves. I do agree with this about flower days.

I neglected to post about that in my first comment and had ment to. It looks like this plant is just now starting to push bud sites out. So this plant is just now starting to flower. I would probably even wait a couple more days before I would call it started honestly, but thats niether here or there.

FermentedThought said:
Day 25 from flip, vegged them for 21 days from seed so maybe they had a late start on flower. also I went out of town the first 5 days of flower and my neighbor watched and watered them, I gave her some rules but maybe she came in when the lights where off on accident or something. (came back and one plant was growing into the monkey fan, totally my fault leaving it low) ill post updates

Flowering begins when the plant starts to form flowers, not instantly at 12/12 flip. It takes time for plants to transition from veg into flower mode. In your case it seems to have taken a little longer, and I would guess that it is because you only vegged for 21 days from seed. Most plants take between 4-8 weeks of veg time to be mature enough to start flowering. You can switch the lights whenever you want, but the plant won't start flowering until its mature enough. Thats why if you grow a plant under 12/12 from seed that it still takes several weeks to begin flowering.

If you had a plant outside you wouldn't say it was flowering until it started forming flowers. You wouldn't pick an arbitrary number and decide it instantly started flowering on that day. You would observe the plant and watch the signs it gives you.

FermentedThought · May 13, 2019

Thundercat said:
While I can't agree with your advice to remove lots of leaves. I do agree with this about flower days.

I neglected to post about that in my first comment and had ment to. It looks like this plant is just now starting to push bud sites out. So this plant is just now starting to flower. I would probably even wait a couple more days before I would call it started honestly, but thats niether here or there.

Flowering begins when the plant starts to form flowers, not instantly at 12/12 flip. It takes time for plants to transition from veg into flower mode. In your case it seems to have taken a little longer, and I would guess that it is because you only vegged for 21 days from seed. Most plants take between 4-8 weeks of veg time to be mature enough to start flowering. You can switch the lights whenever you want, but the plant won't start flowering until its mature enough. Thats why if you grow a plant under 12/12 from seed that it still takes several weeks to begin flowering.

If you had a plant outside you wouldn't say it was flowering until it started forming flowers. You wouldn't pick an arbitrary number and decide it instantly started flowering on that day. You would observe the plant and watch the signs it gives you.

I couldn't agree more, I had a big time constraint this run

FermentedThought · May 13, 2019

I'm also considering taking two of the three plants out and just keep one in there. I can scrog one out so it can breath better. should I? :confused:

Kingrow1 · May 13, 2019

If your meters are in direct or indirect light or wind they aint reading right :-)

FermentedThought · May 13, 2019

Kingrow1 said:
If your meters are in direct or indirect light or wind they aint reading right

Never heard that m8 Where should I put the sensor?

Mr.Goodtimes · May 13, 2019

FermentedThought said:
I'm also considering taking two of the three plants out and just keep one in there. I can scrog one out so it can breath better. should I?

I wouldn’t I don’t think. Just clean them up a bit. Clean the bottom 1/3ish of the plant and the upper larger fan leaves blocking light from lower sites.

Unless you think you’ll hit a problem with height. Then keep your best one and scrog.

IMO

FermentedThought · May 13, 2019

Mr.Goodtimes said:
I wouldn’t I don’t think. Just clean them up a bit. Clean the bottom 1/3ish of the plant and the upper larger fan leaves blocking light from lower sites.

Unless you think you’ll hit a problem with height. Then keep your best one and scrog.

IMO

Not really a height problem, I was thinking the extra space would bypass the need to prune

Defoliation

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