DIY COBs and QBs - Are they actually cost effective?

420_Graze_It

420_Graze_It

Active Member
Looking for honest opinions from both those who have bought and those who have created their own LED lights. I am a bit biased as I have bought all my lights pre-assembled, but I have enough experience with electrical that I'm interested in making one. The only issue I have encountered is trying to find components that beat the price and performance of pre-made ones.

Right now I see 2 major players on the market after a bit of research:
  • Quantum Boards ( diodes such as LM561C, LM301B, LM301H, etc.)
  • COBs (CREE, Luminus CXBs, Citizen, etc.)

When buying, you (usually) need all or most of the following components:
  • LED chips/COBs
  • driver
  • Heatsink/fan (if running over ~50 or so watts - correct me if I'm wrong)
  • mounting brackets
  • aluminum frame
  • reflectors
  • shield/visor to protect the chips

I have put together a few builds, both on DigiKey and Alibaba. Alibaba seemed to beat Digi in price of course, until I saw the outrageous amount in shipping costs. The other thing I noticed is these chips, notably the COBs, max out around 150-175LM/w while Quantum Boards have easily surpassed 200-220LM/w and have similar or better PPFD.

Is there any point in still using COBs or even custom building your own QBs? There are vendors such as Meiju and Kingbrite sending 240w units for $120 pre-assembled. Most builds I've done online are more than that and you can't guarantee the quality of the parts (top bin, etc) or if they are vendor knockoffs. Not to mention you need to spend hours putting it together once you receive all these parts.


Am I missing something, or is there a huge cost savings /benefit hidden somewhere here? The only part I understand is learning about electronics for the newcomers to have fun assembling it, and maybe being able to choose your own lighting layout? I can't seem to find components that can beat 240w of prebuilt quantum board for $120, factoring in all the components and time it takes to assemble...


Cheers
 
1

1212ham

Well-Known Member
420_Graze_It said:
Looking for honest opinions from both those who have bought and those who have created their own LED lights. I am a bit biased as I have bought all my lights pre-assembled, but I have enough experience with electrical that I'm interested in making one. The only issue I have encountered is trying to find components that beat the price and performance of pre-made ones.

Right now I see 2 major players on the market after a bit of research:
  • Quantum Boards ( diodes such as LM561C, LM301B, LM301H, etc.)
  • COBs (CREE, Luminus CXBs, Citizen, etc.
Click to expand...
You left out strips, top quality lighting that is significantly cheaper if DYI. They give superb distribution of the light and heat and many require no heat sink. Popular strips are Samsung with the lm351c and lm301b, Bridgelux EB series gen-2 and gen-3, plus enhanced strip with far etc., from companies like Cutter and diyled.uk.

Linear Led Strip Boards | Cutter Electronics

www.cutter.com.au www.cutter.com.au
diyleduk.com

All DIY LED Grow light Components

A wide range of DIY light engine. Growmau5 Logic pucks, atreum ARA strips, samsung strips and a wide variety of quantum boards. All at great prices. UK
diyleduk.com
 
420_Graze_It

420_Graze_It

Active Member
1212ham said:
You left out strips, top quality lighting that is significantly cheaper if DYI. They give superb distribution of the light and heat and many require no heat sink. Popular strips are Samsung with the lm351c and lm301b, Bridgelux EB series gen-2 and gen-3, plus enhanced strip with far etc., from companies like Cutter.

Linear Led Strip Boards | Cutter Electronics

www.cutter.com.au www.cutter.com.au
Click to expand...
I'm not in Australia unfortunately so shipping = $$$$ :(

Do you have a parts list that I could research to see if its cost effective?

Cheers
 
R

Ryante55

Well-Known Member
420_Graze_It said:
Looking for honest opinions from both those who have bought and those who have created their own LED lights. I am a bit biased as I have bought all my lights pre-assembled, but I have enough experience with electrical that I'm interested in making one. The only issue I have encountered is trying to find components that beat the price and performance of pre-made ones.

Right now I see 2 major players on the market after a bit of research:
  • Quantum Boards ( diodes such as LM561C, LM301B, LM301H, etc.)
  • COBs (CREE, Luminus CXBs, Citizen, etc.)

When buying, you (usually) need all or most of the following components:
  • LED chips/COBs
  • driver
  • Heatsink/fan (if running over ~50 or so watts - correct me if I'm wrong)
  • mounting brackets
  • aluminum frame
  • reflectors
  • shield/visor to protect the chips

I have put together a few builds, both on DigiKey and Alibaba. Alibaba seemed to beat Digi in price of course, until I saw the outrageous amount in shipping costs. The other thing I noticed is these chips, notably the COBs, max out around 150-175LM/w while Quantum Boards have easily surpassed 200-220LM/w and have similar or better PPFD.

Is there any point in still using COBs or even custom building your own QBs? There are vendors such as Meiju and Kingbrite sending 240w units for $120 pre-assembled. Most builds I've done online are more than that and you can't guarantee the quality of the parts (top bin, etc) or if they are vendor knockoffs. Not to mention you need to spend hours putting it together once you receive all these parts.


Am I missing something, or is there a huge cost savings /benefit hidden somewhere here? The only part I understand is learning about electronics for the newcomers to have fun assembling it, and maybe being able to choose your own lighting layout? I can't seem to find components that can beat 240w of prebuilt quantum board for $120, factoring in all the components and time it takes to assemble...


Cheers
Click to expand...
If your time doesn't cost anything and you needed like 10 lights it would be cheaper to buy parts from Alibaba and build yourself the shipping hurts less if you buy the right amount its probably the same price to ship 10 boards as it is to ship 1 for small grows there no reason to diy unless you want to customize it or run an extra effecient setup. You also never know what diodes you get from those Chinese companies so building with strips or pcb boards ordered from a reputable dealer you know what you have as far as diodes. Cobs are more of a pain to build...well no so much now all you lucky guys can buy pre drilled heatsink we used to have to drill an tap everything for cobs and the heatsinks were stupid heavy before. Led tech is in a great place right now thanks to this forum pretty much everything got started here
 
Frank Nitty

Frank Nitty

Well-Known Member
The thing about those places I've noticed is that they are really designed for the commercial/large grower... If you buy in bulk then it's probably waaaayyyy cheaper all around... I don't need anything like that, so when I buy 1-2 lights,shipping and handling is MURDER!!!
 
Frank Nitty

Frank Nitty

Well-Known Member
Ryante55 said:
If your time doesn't cost anything and you needed like 10 lights it would be cheaper to buy parts from Alibaba and build yourself the shipping hurts less if you buy the right amount its probably the same price to ship 10 boards as it is to ship 1 for small grows there no reason to diy unless you want to customize it or run an extra effecient setup. You also never know what diodes you get from those Chinese companies so building with strips or pcb boards ordered from a reputable dealer you know what you have as far as diodes. Cobs are more of a pain to build...well no so much now all you lucky guys can buy pre drilled heatsink we used to have to drill an tap everything for cobs and the heatsinks were stupid heavy before. Led tech is in a great place right now thanks to this forum pretty much everything got started here
Click to expand...
I just said that same thing pretty much...
 
420_Graze_It

420_Graze_It

Active Member
Ryante55 said:
If your time doesn't cost anything and you needed like 10 lights it would be cheaper to buy parts from Alibaba and build yourself the shipping hurts less if you buy the right amount its probably the same price to ship 10 boards as it is to ship 1 for small grows there no reason to diy unless you want to customize it or run an extra effecient setup. You also never know what diodes you get from those Chinese companies so building with strips or pcb boards ordered from a reputable dealer you know what you have as far as diodes. Cobs are more of a pain to build...well no so much now all you lucky guys can buy pre drilled heatsink we used to have to drill an tap everything for cobs and the heatsinks were stupid heavy before. Led tech is in a great place right now thanks to this forum pretty much everything got started here
Click to expand...
Pretty much confirming what I thought.... not worth the time and effort any more. Thanks!
 
GBAUTO

GBAUTO

Well-Known Member
I use both in my grows. I built a pair of Vero cob arrays about 3 years ago. It was much more economical to build my own fixture rather than a pre=fabbed. I added a pair of Samsung F strips as outriggers to each array about a year later. The cobs need to be treated just like an HID light source-hi intensity directly under it. The strips are used as veg lights and as side supplements during flower.
I also use a assembled Meiju QB knock-off I picked up a few months ago. It uses lm301b and 660nm epi's(this is the truly unknown from some vendors) on a Meanwell 480 watt driver. $325 shipped to my door-DIY needs to be assembled and I cant match parts cost so it's a no brainer.
 
Frank Nitty

Frank Nitty

Well-Known Member
GBAUTO said:
I use both in my grows. I built a pair of Vero cob arrays about 3 years ago. It was much more economical to build my own fixture rather than a pre=fabbed. I added a pair of Samsung F strips as outriggers to each array about a year later. The cobs need to be treated just like an HID light source-hi intensity directly under it. The strips are used as veg lights and as side supplements during flower.
I also use a assembled Meiju QB knock-off I picked up a few months ago. It uses lm301b and 660nm epi's(this is the truly unknown from some vendors) on a Meanwell 480 watt driver. $325 shipped to my door-DIY needs to be assembled and I cant match parts cost so it's a no brainer.
Click to expand...
I've been having too many driver problems lately to feel comfortable buying another as a standalone... If I get it pre assembled I know that all parts will be tested...
 
Boatguy

Boatguy

Well-Known Member
I think of light building as more of a hobby. I probably havent saved a penny on anything.
I did have a high powered blurple light with added whites before there were any available, same with cobs.
Have been toying with building a strip setup.

Next week there may be a new fan favorite.
 
Frank Nitty

Frank Nitty

Well-Known Member
Boatguy said:
I think of light building as more of a hobby. I probably havent saved a penny on anything.
I did have a high powered blurple light with added whites before there were any available, same with cobs.
Have been toying with building a strip setup.

Next week there may be a new fan favorite.
Click to expand...
Exactly!!! Like my window screen frame!!!
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
Boatguy said:
I think of light building as more of a hobby. I probably havent saved a penny on anything.
I did have a high powered blurple light with added whites before there were any available, same with cobs.
Have been toying with building a strip setup.

Next week there may be a new fan favorite.
Click to expand...
oh yeah! its like building a PC.
You can get a prebuild for cheap doing its job, but custom build let you get what you really want.
Also, with the eb strips it is pretty cheap to build diy nowadays.
In the end a diy build can be more efficient on the electricity and offer you a better spread of the light, beside that you can tinker on your spectrum and optimize it to your grow enviroment.
 
Boatguy

Boatguy

Well-Known Member
The reality is that people that have stuck with Hids have probably spent less than those that constantly buy the newest most efficient light.
It take alot of usage and time for a led fixture to pay you back for its efficiency, taking into account initial price.
 
Frank Nitty

Frank Nitty

Well-Known Member
cobshopgrow said:
oh yeah! its like building a PC.
You can get a prebuild for cheap doing its job, but custom build let you get what you really want.
Also, with the eb strips it is pretty cheap to build diy nowadays.
In the end a diy build can be more efficient on the electricity and offer you a better spread of the light, beside that you can tinker on your spectrum and optimize it to your grow enviroment.
Click to expand...
Maybe I should try a strip build... something about them make think they get light deeper into the plant...
 
Horselover fat

Horselover fat

Well-Known Member
Boatguy said:
The reality is that people that have stuck with Hids have probably spent less than those that constantly buy the newest most efficient light.
It take alot of usage and time for a led fixture to pay you back for its efficiency, taking into account initial price.
Click to expand...
Well a cheap 600w HID set would cost about 150€ and an equivalent 420w LED (actually quite a bit better at 1074umol and a much better spread) can easily be built for 450€ so that's a 300€ difference. I think I pay 0.14€/kwh so running 12/12 I would save 110€ in electricity per year. HID would need new bulbs too, which would add 20-100€ per year depending on your bulb tastes and how often you change them.

I don't care about the costs though. Growing is a hobby for me.
 
cobshopgrow

cobshopgrow

Well-Known Member
Frank Nitty said:
Maybe I should try a strip build... something about them make think they get light deeper into the plant...
Click to expand...
to say it in your words.
YOU SHOULD !!!!!
:D
am really impressed so far, there is light from every angle and high intensity everywhere.
Biggest problem for me atm is to dial the light down so far that my plants root system can take all the light, there is no escape from it, haha.
 
rob333

rob333

Well-Known Member
420_Graze_It said:
Looking for honest opinions from both those who have bought and those who have created their own LED lights. I am a bit biased as I have bought all my lights pre-assembled, but I have enough experience with electrical that I'm interested in making one. The only issue I have encountered is trying to find components that beat the price and performance of pre-made ones.

Right now I see 2 major players on the market after a bit of research:
  • Quantum Boards ( diodes such as LM561C, LM301B, LM301H, etc.)
  • COBs (CREE, Luminus CXBs, Citizen, etc.)

When buying, you (usually) need all or most of the following components:
  • LED chips/COBs
  • driver
  • Heatsink/fan (if running over ~50 or so watts - correct me if I'm wrong)
  • mounting brackets
  • aluminum frame
  • reflectors
  • shield/visor to protect the chips

I have put together a few builds, both on DigiKey and Alibaba. Alibaba seemed to beat Digi in price of course, until I saw the outrageous amount in shipping costs. The other thing I noticed is these chips, notably the COBs, max out around 150-175LM/w while Quantum Boards have easily surpassed 200-220LM/w and have similar or better PPFD.

Is there any point in still using COBs or even custom building your own QBs? There are vendors such as Meiju and Kingbrite sending 240w units for $120 pre-assembled. Most builds I've done online are more than that and you can't guarantee the quality of the parts (top bin, etc) or if they are vendor knockoffs. Not to mention you need to spend hours putting it together once you receive all these parts.


Am I missing something, or is there a huge cost savings /benefit hidden somewhere here? The only part I understand is learning about electronics for the newcomers to have fun assembling it, and maybe being able to choose your own lighting layout? I can't seem to find components that can beat 240w of prebuilt quantum board for $120, factoring in all the components and time it takes to assemble...


Cheers
Click to expand...
take it from me i use to be mr hps look back on my threads i went as far as paying out on leds but honest the last 2 years have taken off i got invited to this led thing and had a good word to cutter.com now here i am with 2 qb boards and fucking loving it cost at first was pricey coming in round 600 but my first power bill i was like fuck and also the rate of growth smell and quality is diff to hps so i would say yes a good led light is worth it and pay big to start off u will not regret it do not lack out on shit leds
 
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