First bubbleponics grow
- Thread starter hb2727
- Start date
Roseman
Elite Rolling Society
Topping Off the Tank's Reservoir
To address this, I am going to post it twice to be sure I explain it. You will need to read both explanations.
After the nutes are added to the tank and the pH is balanced, the plants start eating, consuming the food. Logically, the larger the tank, the more water there is, and the more nutes you need. Logically, the larger the plants, the more they will eat from the tank. Logically, the more plants that are in the tank, the more they will eat. And Logically, the more they eat, the more nutes that you need in the tank. The amount of nutes provided is in relationship to the amount of water, NOT the amount of plants. It is the Ratio or Proprotion in the water that is important. The amount of nutes added to the tank are measured by we commonly call a PPM Meter, PPM meaning parts per million.
The Instructions on the nutrients contain the proper amount of nutes to add to the water, usually determined by "per gallon", and not by "per plant" or "size of plants". In the beginning, we start with 1/4 dose of nutrients, because a full dose is meant for full grown plants. If we use a ppm meter, we seek a ppm of 150 to 250 ppms on average for small young sprouts, it varies from nutrient to nutrient. As the plants grow, we then slowly and gradually increase the nutrients fed to them, and consequently we increase the ppm. By the time the plants are over a foot tall, we will be in the neighborhood of a ppm of 600, then 800 on up to 1200 ppm. Some growers risk even higher ppms, watching the leaves tips for yellowing, to know when to back off with feedings. And as we add more food, the plants grow and eat more, indicated by them also drinking more water. As a rule of thumb, we figure if they drank half of the water, they then must of ate half the food. That is close to being right, but not precisely. If the grow room was exceptionly HOT, they can drink more water without eating more food. And consequently, some days, they eat more, some days they eat less, regardless of the amount of the water missing.
As they eat, they do not eat all of the delivered nutes at the same rate, or same proportion, and that changes the pH and the ppm. It also changes what they call the RNC, or RELATIONSHIP OF NUTRIENT CONCENTRATION. That CHANGE is not easy to calculate or measure, like the ppm or pH is easy to measure.
When the nutrients are first introduced or added, the RNC is perfect, or properly proportioned. In other words, there are specific amounts or precise amounts of each needed nutrient. The exact amount of needed Nitrogen, Phosphorous, and Potash, also commonly called Potassium are present and available for food for the plants.
BUT, as the plants eat, they do not eat all of the nutrients in a perfect proportion or at a perfect rate or equal rate. Some days, they want what grows longer roots, some days, they want what makes more leaves. The plants actually nibble at some nutrients in the mix each day, and gobble down some others. Some of the nutrients are not hardly eaten at all, some are absorbed very quickly. This creates an IMBALANCE of the mix. If you add more water and nutes daily to replace the eaten nutes, (CALLED TOPPING OFF) the IMBALANCE INCREASES. If you only add plain water daily, again, Top It Off, you still get the imbalance. AND the nutes not eaten, or the nutes that are increased daily cause a build up of nutes, and that creates a BAD imbalance of the RNC.
When this happens, the water becomes TOXIC and unusable even tho the ppm meter says there is a proper amount of nutrients. The plants say I AM NOT HAPPY WITH THE BUFFET and like a spoiled child unhappy at the dinner table, they suddenly refuse to eat anything. This is called NUTRITIONAL LOCKOUT. This happens even tho the ppm meter says there are plenty of parts per million in the water. The ppm meter does not indicate if the nutrients are balanced or at a toxic level. It just indicates there is plenty of food on the table.
THIS IS WHY WE MUST WEEKLY DUMP IT ALL AND START ALL OVER.
THIS IS WHY WE MUST DRAIN AND REPLINISH WEEKLY, regardless of whether we TOP OFF with plain water, or TOP OFF with water and a fractional dose of nutes.
Changing the water weekly maintains the proper RNC.
To address this, I am going to post it twice to be sure I explain it. You will need to read both explanations.
After the nutes are added to the tank and the pH is balanced, the plants start eating, consuming the food. Logically, the larger the tank, the more water there is, and the more nutes you need. Logically, the larger the plants, the more they will eat from the tank. Logically, the more plants that are in the tank, the more they will eat. And Logically, the more they eat, the more nutes that you need in the tank. The amount of nutes provided is in relationship to the amount of water, NOT the amount of plants. It is the Ratio or Proprotion in the water that is important. The amount of nutes added to the tank are measured by we commonly call a PPM Meter, PPM meaning parts per million.
The Instructions on the nutrients contain the proper amount of nutes to add to the water, usually determined by "per gallon", and not by "per plant" or "size of plants". In the beginning, we start with 1/4 dose of nutrients, because a full dose is meant for full grown plants. If we use a ppm meter, we seek a ppm of 150 to 250 ppms on average for small young sprouts, it varies from nutrient to nutrient. As the plants grow, we then slowly and gradually increase the nutrients fed to them, and consequently we increase the ppm. By the time the plants are over a foot tall, we will be in the neighborhood of a ppm of 600, then 800 on up to 1200 ppm. Some growers risk even higher ppms, watching the leaves tips for yellowing, to know when to back off with feedings. And as we add more food, the plants grow and eat more, indicated by them also drinking more water. As a rule of thumb, we figure if they drank half of the water, they then must of ate half the food. That is close to being right, but not precisely. If the grow room was exceptionly HOT, they can drink more water without eating more food. And consequently, some days, they eat more, some days they eat less, regardless of the amount of the water missing.
As they eat, they do not eat all of the delivered nutes at the same rate, or same proportion, and that changes the pH and the ppm. It also changes what they call the RNC, or RELATIONSHIP OF NUTRIENT CONCENTRATION. That CHANGE is not easy to calculate or measure, like the ppm or pH is easy to measure.
When the nutrients are first introduced or added, the RNC is perfect, or properly proportioned. In other words, there are specific amounts or precise amounts of each needed nutrient. The exact amount of needed Nitrogen, Phosphorous, and Potash, also commonly called Potassium are present and available for food for the plants.
BUT, as the plants eat, they do not eat all of the nutrients in a perfect proportion or at a perfect rate or equal rate. Some days, they want what grows longer roots, some days, they want what makes more leaves. The plants actually nibble at some nutrients in the mix each day, and gobble down some others. Some of the nutrients are not hardly eaten at all, some are absorbed very quickly. This creates an IMBALANCE of the mix. If you add more water and nutes daily to replace the eaten nutes, (CALLED TOPPING OFF) the IMBALANCE INCREASES. If you only add plain water daily, again, Top It Off, you still get the imbalance. AND the nutes not eaten, or the nutes that are increased daily cause a build up of nutes, and that creates a BAD imbalance of the RNC.
When this happens, the water becomes TOXIC and unusable even tho the ppm meter says there is a proper amount of nutrients. The plants say I AM NOT HAPPY WITH THE BUFFET and like a spoiled child unhappy at the dinner table, they suddenly refuse to eat anything. This is called NUTRITIONAL LOCKOUT. This happens even tho the ppm meter says there are plenty of parts per million in the water. The ppm meter does not indicate if the nutrients are balanced or at a toxic level. It just indicates there is plenty of food on the table.
THIS IS WHY WE MUST WEEKLY DUMP IT ALL AND START ALL OVER.
THIS IS WHY WE MUST DRAIN AND REPLINISH WEEKLY, regardless of whether we TOP OFF with plain water, or TOP OFF with water and a fractional dose of nutes.
Changing the water weekly maintains the proper RNC.
Roseman
Elite Rolling Society
Daily Maintenance of the reservoir is mostly keeping the pH at the proper level, and keeping the same level of water in the tank as it is used or evaporates. It is also keeping the nutrient mix or nutrient solution at a proper level, a level that is NOT toxic or too strong.
In the day to day course of maintaining the tank two problems occur. Remember how we discussed ppm, parts per million? Then we discussed RNC, RELATIONSHIP OF NUTRIENT CONCENTRATION. Well, we also need to discuss TDS, Total Disolved SOLIDS (Salts). As the water evaporates or is consumed, the concentration of TDS becomes stronger, to the point of being Toxic. The TDS increase as the amount of water decreases. This creates the need to replinish the water, to replace the water. As we replace that missing water, we create an IMBALANCE. Hydroponic grown plants eat what they need, as they need it and they leave some nutes to build up and accumalate into a posionious or toxic level.
This creates the need to daily TOP IT OFF. I have already discussed starting Feedings and Draining and Replinishing in this thread twice. It is simple enough, daily replace what you estimate is gone, consumed, eaten, and absorbed.
But weekly, you need to clear the buffet table and start all over with fresh foods. This gives the plant not only a well balanced buffet table to eat from, but also supplies it with FRESH Food that has not been altered by the plants being picky and choosey.
And, there is the Growth Spurt you will get during the Drain, as the roots get a 5 to 15 mintues air bath. It also gives you the opportunity to look for crimped air hoses, scrub the air stones clean and look for debris and trash in the tank that messes with the pH balance.
Also, as the water ages, undesirable harmful microbes appear and grow in the water. You also take the chance of insect larvae and algae appearing, and weekly draining the tank helps prevent those problems too.
In the day to day course of maintaining the tank two problems occur. Remember how we discussed ppm, parts per million? Then we discussed RNC, RELATIONSHIP OF NUTRIENT CONCENTRATION. Well, we also need to discuss TDS, Total Disolved SOLIDS (Salts). As the water evaporates or is consumed, the concentration of TDS becomes stronger, to the point of being Toxic. The TDS increase as the amount of water decreases. This creates the need to replinish the water, to replace the water. As we replace that missing water, we create an IMBALANCE. Hydroponic grown plants eat what they need, as they need it and they leave some nutes to build up and accumalate into a posionious or toxic level.
This creates the need to daily TOP IT OFF. I have already discussed starting Feedings and Draining and Replinishing in this thread twice. It is simple enough, daily replace what you estimate is gone, consumed, eaten, and absorbed.
But weekly, you need to clear the buffet table and start all over with fresh foods. This gives the plant not only a well balanced buffet table to eat from, but also supplies it with FRESH Food that has not been altered by the plants being picky and choosey.
And, there is the Growth Spurt you will get during the Drain, as the roots get a 5 to 15 mintues air bath. It also gives you the opportunity to look for crimped air hoses, scrub the air stones clean and look for debris and trash in the tank that messes with the pH balance.
Also, as the water ages, undesirable harmful microbes appear and grow in the water. You also take the chance of insect larvae and algae appearing, and weekly draining the tank helps prevent those problems too.
Roseman
Elite Rolling Society
Starting Nutes
The VERY FIRST TIME, at set-up, put SIX gallons of water in the tank, and adjust the water's PH, in the tank then. (you will never adjust the pH in the tank again) Take a black magic marker and mark a line inside the tank at the 6 gallon water line level. Use that line to know how much water is needed in the tank.
Start the seeds in the cubes, or use the wet papertowel germination method.
Then, a day later, you pH test the water, and add pH UP or pH DOWN to a half gallon of water and add that half of gallon of water to the tank. Then remove a half gallon, leaving 6 gallons.
When your seeds have germinated or sprouted or cracked, or been added to the tank,
then about a week later, 6 to 7 days, you will have your first node of leaves. A "node of leaves" means two opposing leaves, one across from the other.
Add 1/4 packet or 1/4 dose of nutes (Grow and Micro nutes) to a gallon of water, pH adjust that one gallon and add it to the tank. If you are way over 6 gallons, remove some water. New born babies are born hungry, but not ready for a full meal deal.
Once a day, every day, you check the water level and pH. It will be 2, maybe 3 weeks before they start drinking a half gallon a day, that needs to be replaced.
As they grow, about every other day to every 2 days during the second week, you add another 1/4 packet, until you have used a full dose or full packet of nutes.
After the first 14 days, drain out 5 gallons, and add one gallon at a time, that is pH balanced, adding 5 gallons back. In the 5th gallon, add one full packet of GROW and MICRO nutes, shake and stir it good, before adding it.
After 3 weeks, they will start drinking one half gallon a day. Around the 4th to 5th week, they will be drinking a full gallon a day.
Every 7 to ten days, you DRAIN AND REPLINISH. I prefer every 7 days to give the roots that much needed air bath that they love. If I find extra time, I do it every 4 days, but I put the drained water back in the tank on that EXTRA Drain.
FEEDING IF YOU DO NOT HAVE A PPM METER.
You will daily add one gallon of pH water TO REPLACE THE ONE GALLON MISSING. (Or 1/2 gallon daily earlier in the grow, clsoe to the 3rd or 4th week) If the water in the tank tests a pH of 7.0 (too high for example) and you know you want it lower, make one gallon of 5.0 water, and it will make the tank about 6.0 or in that neighborhood. ALSO, in that one gallon of water added daily, add 1/6 packet or dose of new nutes. One gallon or 1/6 of the tank was drank, so you need to replace 1 gallon of water and 1/6 of the nutes.
Or in other words, if they drank 1/6 of the tank's water, they ate 1/6 of the nutes, so you need to replace that 1/6 that was consumed.
IF the grow area is VERY HOT, add back a little less than 1/6 nutes, the plant is just drinking and needing lots of water.
If the grow room is cool, or NOT VERY HOT, use the full 1/6 dose.
DRAINING AND REPLINISHING
First two grows I did, I syphoned the water out into a 5 gallon bucket with an Aquarium syphon hose. That was really a chore!
Then I learned to prop the lid open about three or 4 inches, STILL LEAVING THE LID ON THE TANK, BUT PROPPED UP ON ONE END and I reach in and take the Irrigation Hub off of the pump. Then with a 1/2 or 3/4 inch hose, I use my fist as a coupling, I sit my fist on the upward pump tube with the hose half way in my fist, on top of the pump, and let the pump.....pump the water out into a 5 gallon bucket. It works good for me.
You can also use a WET-VAC, or a small Dril Pump to drain it.
A drill pump (you attach it to an electric drill) is $10 to $15 at Lowes, Home Depot or the Hardware Store.
Let me add here again, I can not emphasis enough, that Roots love the AIR BATH they get during a Drain and Replinish. This is a very important step. The more often you can do it, the faster the plants will grow.
Remember what I am telling you here.
Pot plants sprout with two round leaves, called
cotyledons . Do NOT count those as leaves, they are really the inside of the seed.
AFTER 2 to 4 full leaves appear, tiny as they are, use 1/4 dose of nutes.
When you start a new grow, and AFTER the seeds have sprouted, and you have done one feeding, you do a Drain and Replinish at 10 to 14 days, then every 7 to 10 days.
AFTER the first week, the water is still fresh, and you may have only added 1/4 packet of nutes or 1/4 dose of nutes to the tank at the end of the first week IF you saw two full leaves, besides those FIRST two round ones, the cotyledons .
During the 2nd week, you probably added 1/4 DOSE OF NUTES 2 more times 3 or 4 days apart.
AFTER 14 days from germination, you do the first DRAIN AND REPLINISH. Then, again, every 7 to ten days you DRAIN AND REPLINISH. I do a complete DRAIN AND REPLINISH weekly, every Saturday afternoon.
BUT, every Wednesday, half way through the week and if I have the extra time, I drain the tank into a bucket, pH test the bucket and adjust it, and then, after ten minutes of having an empty tank AND LETTING THE ROOTS GET AN AIR BATH, I add it right back to the tank. That way I did not use ANY EXTRA NUTES or too many nutes, but I did give the roots an air bath.
You will see a RAPID GROWTH SPURT the very next day.
Let me say this again.
IF you do not have a ppm meter...........
and you do a DRAIN and REPLINISH........Try to think in term of SIXTHS. You got 6 plants, and 6 gallons of water in the tank. AFTER ABOUT the first two weeks, you are going to come home from work one day and find the plants drank half a gallon of water, and need to add half a gallon of water back. Half a gallon is half a SIXTH, so add back half a sixth of a packet of nutes back and half gallon of pH adjusted water.
Later, AFTER about three or 4 weeks, you will check the plants and they will have drank one whole gallon of water in one day. ONE gallon is 1/6 of the tank's water, and if 1/6 of the water is gone, then 1/6 of the nutes are gone, so add back one gallon of pH adjusted water and 1/6 does of nutes.
AFTER 3 or 4 weeks, you will find they drank two gallons in one day. Then add two gallons of water, (1/3 of the tank's water) so also add 1/3 packet of nutes.
IF you got the drain plugs, (little black faucets for the tank) make sure you use some plumbers glue or teflon tape or they will leak. The problem with using the DRAIN PLUGS is most of us have to sit our tanks on the floor, making it very difficult to drain the tank that way.
I'm often asked do I drain it out 100%? NO, I don't, I always leave about 1 inch of water or half a gallon. I'm too lazy to get it all, and it doesn't seem to matter.
I'm often asked do I clean the tank when I drain it?
No, I don't let it get dirty to start with. I do not use nutes that color the water or roots, until about the last few weeks, I do use some Liquid Karma the last 2 or 3 weeks as a catalyst. But I still do not let trash or any thing foreign into the tank to have to clean it out.
The VERY FIRST TIME, at set-up, put SIX gallons of water in the tank, and adjust the water's PH, in the tank then. (you will never adjust the pH in the tank again) Take a black magic marker and mark a line inside the tank at the 6 gallon water line level. Use that line to know how much water is needed in the tank.
Start the seeds in the cubes, or use the wet papertowel germination method.
Then, a day later, you pH test the water, and add pH UP or pH DOWN to a half gallon of water and add that half of gallon of water to the tank. Then remove a half gallon, leaving 6 gallons.
When your seeds have germinated or sprouted or cracked, or been added to the tank,
then about a week later, 6 to 7 days, you will have your first node of leaves. A "node of leaves" means two opposing leaves, one across from the other.
Add 1/4 packet or 1/4 dose of nutes (Grow and Micro nutes) to a gallon of water, pH adjust that one gallon and add it to the tank. If you are way over 6 gallons, remove some water. New born babies are born hungry, but not ready for a full meal deal.
Once a day, every day, you check the water level and pH. It will be 2, maybe 3 weeks before they start drinking a half gallon a day, that needs to be replaced.
As they grow, about every other day to every 2 days during the second week, you add another 1/4 packet, until you have used a full dose or full packet of nutes.
After the first 14 days, drain out 5 gallons, and add one gallon at a time, that is pH balanced, adding 5 gallons back. In the 5th gallon, add one full packet of GROW and MICRO nutes, shake and stir it good, before adding it.
After 3 weeks, they will start drinking one half gallon a day. Around the 4th to 5th week, they will be drinking a full gallon a day.
Every 7 to ten days, you DRAIN AND REPLINISH. I prefer every 7 days to give the roots that much needed air bath that they love. If I find extra time, I do it every 4 days, but I put the drained water back in the tank on that EXTRA Drain.
FEEDING IF YOU DO NOT HAVE A PPM METER.
You will daily add one gallon of pH water TO REPLACE THE ONE GALLON MISSING. (Or 1/2 gallon daily earlier in the grow, clsoe to the 3rd or 4th week) If the water in the tank tests a pH of 7.0 (too high for example) and you know you want it lower, make one gallon of 5.0 water, and it will make the tank about 6.0 or in that neighborhood. ALSO, in that one gallon of water added daily, add 1/6 packet or dose of new nutes. One gallon or 1/6 of the tank was drank, so you need to replace 1 gallon of water and 1/6 of the nutes.
Or in other words, if they drank 1/6 of the tank's water, they ate 1/6 of the nutes, so you need to replace that 1/6 that was consumed.
IF the grow area is VERY HOT, add back a little less than 1/6 nutes, the plant is just drinking and needing lots of water.
If the grow room is cool, or NOT VERY HOT, use the full 1/6 dose.
DRAINING AND REPLINISHING
First two grows I did, I syphoned the water out into a 5 gallon bucket with an Aquarium syphon hose. That was really a chore!
Then I learned to prop the lid open about three or 4 inches, STILL LEAVING THE LID ON THE TANK, BUT PROPPED UP ON ONE END and I reach in and take the Irrigation Hub off of the pump. Then with a 1/2 or 3/4 inch hose, I use my fist as a coupling, I sit my fist on the upward pump tube with the hose half way in my fist, on top of the pump, and let the pump.....pump the water out into a 5 gallon bucket. It works good for me.
You can also use a WET-VAC, or a small Dril Pump to drain it.
A drill pump (you attach it to an electric drill) is $10 to $15 at Lowes, Home Depot or the Hardware Store.
Let me add here again, I can not emphasis enough, that Roots love the AIR BATH they get during a Drain and Replinish. This is a very important step. The more often you can do it, the faster the plants will grow.
Remember what I am telling you here.
Pot plants sprout with two round leaves, called
cotyledons . Do NOT count those as leaves, they are really the inside of the seed.
AFTER 2 to 4 full leaves appear, tiny as they are, use 1/4 dose of nutes.
When you start a new grow, and AFTER the seeds have sprouted, and you have done one feeding, you do a Drain and Replinish at 10 to 14 days, then every 7 to 10 days.
AFTER the first week, the water is still fresh, and you may have only added 1/4 packet of nutes or 1/4 dose of nutes to the tank at the end of the first week IF you saw two full leaves, besides those FIRST two round ones, the cotyledons .
During the 2nd week, you probably added 1/4 DOSE OF NUTES 2 more times 3 or 4 days apart.
AFTER 14 days from germination, you do the first DRAIN AND REPLINISH. Then, again, every 7 to ten days you DRAIN AND REPLINISH. I do a complete DRAIN AND REPLINISH weekly, every Saturday afternoon.
BUT, every Wednesday, half way through the week and if I have the extra time, I drain the tank into a bucket, pH test the bucket and adjust it, and then, after ten minutes of having an empty tank AND LETTING THE ROOTS GET AN AIR BATH, I add it right back to the tank. That way I did not use ANY EXTRA NUTES or too many nutes, but I did give the roots an air bath.
You will see a RAPID GROWTH SPURT the very next day.
Let me say this again.
IF you do not have a ppm meter...........
and you do a DRAIN and REPLINISH........Try to think in term of SIXTHS. You got 6 plants, and 6 gallons of water in the tank. AFTER ABOUT the first two weeks, you are going to come home from work one day and find the plants drank half a gallon of water, and need to add half a gallon of water back. Half a gallon is half a SIXTH, so add back half a sixth of a packet of nutes back and half gallon of pH adjusted water.
Later, AFTER about three or 4 weeks, you will check the plants and they will have drank one whole gallon of water in one day. ONE gallon is 1/6 of the tank's water, and if 1/6 of the water is gone, then 1/6 of the nutes are gone, so add back one gallon of pH adjusted water and 1/6 does of nutes.
AFTER 3 or 4 weeks, you will find they drank two gallons in one day. Then add two gallons of water, (1/3 of the tank's water) so also add 1/3 packet of nutes.
IF you got the drain plugs, (little black faucets for the tank) make sure you use some plumbers glue or teflon tape or they will leak. The problem with using the DRAIN PLUGS is most of us have to sit our tanks on the floor, making it very difficult to drain the tank that way.
I'm often asked do I drain it out 100%? NO, I don't, I always leave about 1 inch of water or half a gallon. I'm too lazy to get it all, and it doesn't seem to matter.
I'm often asked do I clean the tank when I drain it?
No, I don't let it get dirty to start with. I do not use nutes that color the water or roots, until about the last few weeks, I do use some Liquid Karma the last 2 or 3 weeks as a catalyst. But I still do not let trash or any thing foreign into the tank to have to clean it out.
Roseman
Elite Rolling Society
When I first got started with this grow, I started with 1/4 dose nutes to be safe. A day or two after I saw the second node or 4th leaf, (two sets of two leaves, not counting those first two round leaves), I introduced 1/4 strenght nutes. I increased them to half strenght, or a 2nd dose of 1/4 strenght nutes two days later when I saw the 3rd node. I could safely do this with the Stealth Hydro Nutes. They are not too strong to cause damage at that strenght, especially using CFLS to grow. HID light users can use higher NPK nutes, or stronger strenght nutes.
A day or two later, I saw a 4th node, and increasing the strenght of the nutes again by adding another 1/4 dose, bringing me to FULL-Strenght nutes.
That is when I measured my ppm, but by then, the plants were eating the nutes too. My ppm was only 200 then, and 75 to 100 of that was my well water. In no way am I saying that is what your ppm should be too. I am just telling you what mine was. I was trying for a weaker strenght feeding to make sure I did not burn them up and be emabarrassed. In past grows, I did use more nutes, strongers doses, more often.
After ten days passed, I did a Drain and Replinish. I added back a full dose of nutes and my ppm was 280 that day, telling me my target ppm to stay at the same level during the early VEG or GROW cycle.
As I daily added a half of gallon of water, and a 1/12 packet of nutes, my ppm grew to 330, or bounced between 220 and 340 as they ate. (Before the feeding, it was 220, after the feeding it was up to 340)
By the time I was in my 3rd week, and they were drinking a full gallon of water a day, and I was adding back 1/6 dose of nutes, my ppm was between 360 to 440 daily. But that number is not important to me or you. What is important is tracking it, writing it down daily, to determine how much more nutes I should add or not add.
Let me rephrase this.
Do not worry about the exact number, or any number from a chart or from me and my grow. Instead watch, record, and track how it rises or falls from day to day. The differences between what you have in there on one day, and the readings you get the next day will tell you how much your plants are eating. Of course, you do this daily, at the same time of day.
And remember, just because a gallon of water is gone, does not mean they also ate 1/6 of the nutes. Maybe you had HIGH HEAT and they were very thirsty but not as hungry.
First, determine the ppm of your water sourse. Say it is 100 ppm. Then fill the tank with the proper amount of water and a complete dose of nutes and read the ppm. Say it is 350 for example. If tomorrow a gallon of water is gone, and the ppm says higher than 350, or is still close to 350, then they did not eat and they do not need more nutes, they only need more water. Your reservoir's water and nute solution is more concentrated, telling you to add more water only.
If the ppm went down to say 250 from 350, and a gallon of water is gone, they need a gallon of water, plus enough additonal nutes to bring the ppm back up to 350. And that is the real purpose and use of a ppm meter, to determine that need and how much.
No one can tell you what your ppm should be. It will vary from garden to garden, and vary from different nutrients too.
If your plants are very happy, and drinking and eating at the same level, then the ppm will remain the same daily.
If for example, 1/8 of the water is gone, and 1/8 the nutes are gone, then the concentration remains the same and the ppm will remain the same.
I would like to offer a ppm chart as a rule of thumb or ball park target ppm, but each grow or garden is going to be different.
These numbers are based on EC readings, .500 readings, TDS readings converted from EC or the common Hannah Chart:
Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250
Early Vegging 300 to 400
Full Vegetation 450 to 700
Early Blooming 750 to 950
Full Mature Blooms 1000 to 1600
(this excludes the ppm of your water)
According to the chart, I am under feeding them and my grow could handle a stronger dose of nutes. But I am playing it safe as an example and as a demonstration.
A day or two later, I saw a 4th node, and increasing the strenght of the nutes again by adding another 1/4 dose, bringing me to FULL-Strenght nutes.
That is when I measured my ppm, but by then, the plants were eating the nutes too. My ppm was only 200 then, and 75 to 100 of that was my well water. In no way am I saying that is what your ppm should be too. I am just telling you what mine was. I was trying for a weaker strenght feeding to make sure I did not burn them up and be emabarrassed. In past grows, I did use more nutes, strongers doses, more often.
After ten days passed, I did a Drain and Replinish. I added back a full dose of nutes and my ppm was 280 that day, telling me my target ppm to stay at the same level during the early VEG or GROW cycle.
As I daily added a half of gallon of water, and a 1/12 packet of nutes, my ppm grew to 330, or bounced between 220 and 340 as they ate. (Before the feeding, it was 220, after the feeding it was up to 340)
By the time I was in my 3rd week, and they were drinking a full gallon of water a day, and I was adding back 1/6 dose of nutes, my ppm was between 360 to 440 daily. But that number is not important to me or you. What is important is tracking it, writing it down daily, to determine how much more nutes I should add or not add.
Let me rephrase this.
Do not worry about the exact number, or any number from a chart or from me and my grow. Instead watch, record, and track how it rises or falls from day to day. The differences between what you have in there on one day, and the readings you get the next day will tell you how much your plants are eating. Of course, you do this daily, at the same time of day.
And remember, just because a gallon of water is gone, does not mean they also ate 1/6 of the nutes. Maybe you had HIGH HEAT and they were very thirsty but not as hungry.
First, determine the ppm of your water sourse. Say it is 100 ppm. Then fill the tank with the proper amount of water and a complete dose of nutes and read the ppm. Say it is 350 for example. If tomorrow a gallon of water is gone, and the ppm says higher than 350, or is still close to 350, then they did not eat and they do not need more nutes, they only need more water. Your reservoir's water and nute solution is more concentrated, telling you to add more water only.
If the ppm went down to say 250 from 350, and a gallon of water is gone, they need a gallon of water, plus enough additonal nutes to bring the ppm back up to 350. And that is the real purpose and use of a ppm meter, to determine that need and how much.
No one can tell you what your ppm should be. It will vary from garden to garden, and vary from different nutrients too.
If your plants are very happy, and drinking and eating at the same level, then the ppm will remain the same daily.
If for example, 1/8 of the water is gone, and 1/8 the nutes are gone, then the concentration remains the same and the ppm will remain the same.
I would like to offer a ppm chart as a rule of thumb or ball park target ppm, but each grow or garden is going to be different.
These numbers are based on EC readings, .500 readings, TDS readings converted from EC or the common Hannah Chart:
Seedlings, Early Sprouts 100 to 250
Early Vegging 300 to 400
Full Vegetation 450 to 700
Early Blooming 750 to 950
Full Mature Blooms 1000 to 1600
(this excludes the ppm of your water)
According to the chart, I am under feeding them and my grow could handle a stronger dose of nutes. But I am playing it safe as an example and as a demonstration.
Roseman
Elite Rolling Society
Feeding Without a PPM Meter
I did half a dozen grows without a ppm ppm meter, enough that I do not rely on it now that I do have one. You have to just use common sense.
I often read "you need a 1200 ppm nutritonal solution
during VEG". Well, how does that 1200 ppm take into consideration what the ppm of my plain water is? If I have 7.6 pH water out of the faucet, and it is 100 ppm out of the faucet, and I add a half a teaspoon of pH Down and now it is 200 ppm, do I just add 1000 ppm of nutes? What if I use Distilled water that is 6.0 pH and 20 ppm, do I add 1180 ppm of nutes? And the person, book or chart that recommended the 1200 ppm has no idea what nutrients I am using to start with, whether they are high ppm chemical solids or low ppm liquid organics.
Again, you have to just use common sense.
When it is time to start the first feeding, you will see the seed germinate and show you the first two round leaves. Disregard them, and after you see 4 new leaves, start 1/4 dose of recommended nutes, for 6 small sprouts in the tank. After I see a total of 8 new leaves, I add 1/4 dose again. I want to be cautious not to get nute burn by over feeding. I wait two days and add a 3rd 1/4 dose, and wait two more day, (usually the 7th to 9th day, and add the last 1/4 dose, looking at plants that are little bushes about 4 inches tall.
AFTer 7 to ten days later, I Drain and Replinish with a full packet or full dose of nutes.
By then, they are drinking half a gallon a day, and EVERY OTHER DAY, I add 1/6 packet when I add a half gallon of water. Then, after two weeks, into the 4th week, I am seeing them drink a full gallon daily, and when I add a gallon back, I add 1/6 packet. I watch the tips and if I see any yellow tips on the upper 1/3 of the plant's leaves, (not the lower ones) I skip two days of nutes. I stay on the schedule of adding 1/6 every day to every other day, depending on if the six plants drink a full gallon. After about 5 weeks of VEG, I am adding 1/6 daily almost every day, but ocasionally skipping a day.
Then I start 12/12, the Flowering Cycle. . I stay on VEG nutes for two days and start replacing them as they are eaten and drank with the BLOOM nutes, adding 1/6 packet daily.
WHEN I remove 3 males, and only have 3 female plants remaining, I back off and reduce feedings. It is just common sense. 3 plants eat less and need less than 6 plants.
If and when I have 3 large plants, say over 18 inches tall, I can still feed a full packet. I adjust the nutes to the number of plants and size. After I have some larger plants, say over 24 to 26 inches tall, I might add a packet and 1/6 extra, and watch them closely. If I see yellow tips, I remove a gallon and replace it with plain water AND skip two days of feeding.
UNDERFEEDING is much better than OVER FEEDING.
AFTER A WHILE, YOU JUST GET A FEEL FOR IT, watching for those yellow tips. Again, it is better to under feed, than over feed.
IF you have some giants, like 3 Flowering, add a little extra and watch them closely. If you only have two plants, do not use a full packet. It is just common sense and getting a feel for it.
I did half a dozen grows without a ppm ppm meter, enough that I do not rely on it now that I do have one. You have to just use common sense.
I often read "you need a 1200 ppm nutritonal solution
during VEG". Well, how does that 1200 ppm take into consideration what the ppm of my plain water is? If I have 7.6 pH water out of the faucet, and it is 100 ppm out of the faucet, and I add a half a teaspoon of pH Down and now it is 200 ppm, do I just add 1000 ppm of nutes? What if I use Distilled water that is 6.0 pH and 20 ppm, do I add 1180 ppm of nutes? And the person, book or chart that recommended the 1200 ppm has no idea what nutrients I am using to start with, whether they are high ppm chemical solids or low ppm liquid organics.
Again, you have to just use common sense.
When it is time to start the first feeding, you will see the seed germinate and show you the first two round leaves. Disregard them, and after you see 4 new leaves, start 1/4 dose of recommended nutes, for 6 small sprouts in the tank. After I see a total of 8 new leaves, I add 1/4 dose again. I want to be cautious not to get nute burn by over feeding. I wait two days and add a 3rd 1/4 dose, and wait two more day, (usually the 7th to 9th day, and add the last 1/4 dose, looking at plants that are little bushes about 4 inches tall.
AFTer 7 to ten days later, I Drain and Replinish with a full packet or full dose of nutes.
By then, they are drinking half a gallon a day, and EVERY OTHER DAY, I add 1/6 packet when I add a half gallon of water. Then, after two weeks, into the 4th week, I am seeing them drink a full gallon daily, and when I add a gallon back, I add 1/6 packet. I watch the tips and if I see any yellow tips on the upper 1/3 of the plant's leaves, (not the lower ones) I skip two days of nutes. I stay on the schedule of adding 1/6 every day to every other day, depending on if the six plants drink a full gallon. After about 5 weeks of VEG, I am adding 1/6 daily almost every day, but ocasionally skipping a day.
Then I start 12/12, the Flowering Cycle. . I stay on VEG nutes for two days and start replacing them as they are eaten and drank with the BLOOM nutes, adding 1/6 packet daily.
WHEN I remove 3 males, and only have 3 female plants remaining, I back off and reduce feedings. It is just common sense. 3 plants eat less and need less than 6 plants.
If and when I have 3 large plants, say over 18 inches tall, I can still feed a full packet. I adjust the nutes to the number of plants and size. After I have some larger plants, say over 24 to 26 inches tall, I might add a packet and 1/6 extra, and watch them closely. If I see yellow tips, I remove a gallon and replace it with plain water AND skip two days of feeding.
UNDERFEEDING is much better than OVER FEEDING.
AFTER A WHILE, YOU JUST GET A FEEL FOR IT, watching for those yellow tips. Again, it is better to under feed, than over feed.
IF you have some giants, like 3 Flowering, add a little extra and watch them closely. If you only have two plants, do not use a full packet. It is just common sense and getting a feel for it.
Roseman
Elite Rolling Society
pH
Page 2 Post # 13 and 14
Page 4 # 38
Page 5 # 42
Page 51, # 507
IN THIS THREAD:
Roseman's DIY Bubbleponics Tutorial - Marijuana Growing
Page 2 Post # 13 and 14
Page 4 # 38
Page 5 # 42
Page 51, # 507
IN THIS THREAD:
Roseman's DIY Bubbleponics Tutorial - Marijuana Growing
Roseman
Elite Rolling Society
You said you got aphids in the water.
Take the lid with the platns to the bathtub and rinse the roots , and spray them with 3 tablespoons of 3% peroxide in a quart of water. let it drip off.
Then Add exactly 3 tablespoons of 3% peroxide per gallon of water to the water in the tank. Wait 4 hours and Drain and Replenish with two tablespoons of 3% peroxide in the water to stay in the water.
Take the lid with the platns to the bathtub and rinse the roots , and spray them with 3 tablespoons of 3% peroxide in a quart of water. let it drip off.
Then Add exactly 3 tablespoons of 3% peroxide per gallon of water to the water in the tank. Wait 4 hours and Drain and Replenish with two tablespoons of 3% peroxide in the water to stay in the water.