Good bulbs vs cheap bulbs (hid lighting)

howsitgrowin420 said:

you are quite amazing. No, you didn't bring up PAR ratings, I did and you still must not have seen that post. let me re-cap and then you can run out to the bar to consume alcohol with PSUAGRO, fucking drinkers are the problem with the world - they never get motivated to change anything because they can just blunt themselves with government approved retard juice. I basically said "I bought Ushios because they had a higher PAR rating at the edges compared to not only the cheap bulbs tested, but the other bulbs tested" and you basically said "cheap bulbs are every bit as good as expensive bulbs, but inexperienced growers buy expensive bulbs because manufacturers: 1) make false claims about performance and 2) create stories of fire hazards so that those inexperienced growers will buy them" Did you not imply that inexperienced growers buy expensive bulbs? You are not very familiar with deduction or logic, are you? Ah, the grammar gave that away.

You can go back and read your responses to my posts and if you still don't think that you completely ignored the available data in favor of "I didn't see a difference"..... Hobbyist, now I understand why we are not on the same page. No, I'm not a hobbyist you fucking toolbox. Go grow a 1oz plant and call it a good day, meanwhile I'll keep pulling 4 oz per plant out of a perpetual harvest at 4 plants every 2.5 weeks. The cost of bulbs is fractional for experienced growers. Better yet, go punch a clock to get someone else rich and then dull yourself at the bar - by no brainer he meant that drinkers have no brains, right?

You can spew this Low T, I wasn't trying to be a prick, bullshit all day long bud, I can read and I can comprehend.

If you want to compare bud photos, I posted what my bulbs produce and you posted what your bulbs produce - I'll keep buying my bulbs and recommend that anyone who is serious about growing not by anything but construction materials from Home Depot.

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What a twit. @howsitgrowin420 you need to moderate yourself before others do it for you. Your taking this way to far. You need to simmer down. Personal attacks are not tolerated on this forum. Whatever I said has nothing directly to do with the video or any related content. Why would anyone pay any attention to you with the way your reacting? Actually, the problem is people like you go around accusing others of things they never explicitly said, and then attempt to demean fellow members. Sounds like a personal issue to me.
Because everyone who drinks is a good for nothing alcoholic...? hahah Retard juice? Now you are really making yourself out to be a twit. Maybe it's a good idea you don't drink! No one here cares about your personal beliefs.
Cool, good for you. There you go again! I never said "cheap bulbs are every bit as good as expensive bulbs" nor did I state "you" were a hobbyist. Lets get one thing straight going into the future. Unless I explicitly tag you in my post I am not directly referring to you @howsitgrowin420 so stop taking offense! Your taking everything too literal and out of context. Some growers buy products because they are sold on certain notions like that.
"Go grow a 1oz plant and call it a good day, meanwhile I'll keep pulling 4 oz per plant out of a perpetual harvest at 4 plants every 2.5 weeks." what a douchy thing to say. Let me guess, you drive one of those massive raised 4x4 trucks with the plastic nuts hanging from the bumper! haha.
Why would anyone in their right mind involve themselves with you with the way your acting!? Who wants to waste their time involving themselves with a overly aggressive character like yourself. I pity who ever has to deal with that in person!
It is a waste of time responding to these irrelevant posts.
My grammar? Your one to talk @howsitgrowin420 lol! In case you weren't aware this is a cannabis forum not a grammar class. #Troll

greasemonkeymann said:

I believe ALL hid growers should have either a camera that reads light intensity or a light meter.
Old bulbs suck badly, the spectrum changes, the lumens change, it all goes downhill quite fast.
Every three harvests I change the bulb, I may even be going longer than I should.

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I agree, that is why I am investing in one. It arrives this friday
I believe serious indoor growers should own one as well if they care about maintaining any degree of efficiency.

Krash382 said:

Hey all i thought i would share this. I recently swapped out my 600w plantmax hps bulb for a hortilux eye, and i cannot stress enough how much of a difference it made. Im not trying to start a war on which is the best bulb, just sharing my personal experience. Flower density/ weight has came really close to doubling with the bulb swap, along with crystal production. So for all the inexperienced growers like myself, USE GOOD BULBS lol that is all

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Approximately how many harvests and or hours did you have on the Plantmax bulb before swapping it out for the Hortilux bulb?

piecemasta said:

Try using Amazon for affordable bulbs. They have name brand bulbs by the same manufactures who make the digital ballasts. I think $26 for a light bulb is expensive compared to others you might buy for your house. I have never had a issue with any light bulb posing a fire hazard. Odds are no else has either if they are handling the bulbs properly and using them with the correct digital ballast. Maybe if your inexperienced and believe it is okay to mismatch bulbs and ballast then you might be more mind full but if someone is doing that they are still a novice. Some individuals think that since they have a dimmable ballast they can use lower wattage bulbs. This assumption is partly true as it might cause your bulbs to fail prematurely. But even then the odds of it somehow creating a fire are slim to none. Claims that cheap bulbs are more likely to catch fire etc are tactics used by expensive bulb manufacturers to get inexperienced growers to fork over double or even triple the amount of money just to provide a false piece of mind. And they likely do because they do not know any better!

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piecemasta said:

Do you measure the output rating of your bulbs or do you just take the manufactures word for it? I'm always skeptical of what manufactures claim especially if they are trying to sell me something that I can easily buy for half the cost. If my harvest had only an eighth of a difference from pervious harvests I would usually attribute that to improved training techniques such as lollipopping/ topping etc. Maybe if you replaced a worn out bulb a grower might see some noticeable difference in yield but most home growers reuse their bulbs for at least 2-3.

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These are the two posts where you communicated with me directly. I had said nothing to you. When I write "you", I mean the person to which I am responding, but now I'm a little more clear on how to follow your type of writing.

If you are going to argue with people, then have a backbone. I could care less about your grammar....unless you decide to start acting like you know something. How many people choose to argue with someone and then write your instead of you're? Find an instance where I've criticized someone who writes "when your first starting...." but when they say "maybe if your inexperienced" while using a low T backhanded insult where the thing they are actually trying to say is the contrapositive, that's when I respond accordingly.

piecemasta said:

Happy to hear your grow is going well! But, I'm rather skeptical to believe that the yield doubled simply by swapping out the lightbulb. Was your previous lightbulb even working properly? How did you calculate/quantify bud density, weight, and trichome production? Most inexperienced growers likely have some difficulty monitoring such variables due to their inexperience. I'm hard-pressed to believe most individuals claims on these types of forums especially if they lack reasonable documentation. I believe most newbies read threads without much skepticism because they haven't been around the block enough and form unreasonable expectations especially when it comes to yields. Yield and trichome production varies greatly between genetics. Temperature can also play a significant factor. I might buy one just to run a side by side comparison with my setup to see if it justifies paying over double the price for a single bulb. $30 more really isn't that much money but if your running several lights costs such as these can quickly raise a growers operating expenses. I'm always ready to learn something new but I do not expect to double my yield simply by swapping my bulb that is for sure.

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Here is where I responded with a video to help you with "I might buy one just to run a side by side comparison with my setup to see if it justifies paying over double the price for a single bulb. $30 more really isn't that much money but if your running several lights costs such as these can quickly raise a growers operating expenses. I'm always ready to learn something new" But, you ignored the video in favor of focusing on where I said "didn't see a difference". You opened the door.

I do not think you wish to learn something new. Yes, please criticize my reaction to you. You need to re-evaluate the timeline and the events within it, toolbox.

howsitgrowin420 said:

These are the two posts where you communicated with me directly. I had said nothing to you. When I write "you", I mean the person to which I am responding, but now I'm a little more clear on how to follow your type of writing.

If you are going to argue with people, then have a backbone. I could care less about your grammar....unless you decide to start acting like you know something. How many people choose to argue with someone and then write your instead of you're? Find an instance where I've criticized someone who writes "when your first starting...." but when they say "maybe if your inexperienced" while using a low T backhanded insult where the thing they are actually trying to say is the contrapositive, that's when I respond accordingly.



Here is where I responded with a video to help you with "I might buy one just to run a side by side comparison with my setup to see if it justifies paying over double the price for a single bulb. $30 more really isn't that much money but if your running several lights costs such as these can quickly raise a growers operating expenses. I'm always ready to learn something new" But, you ignored the video in favor of focusing on where I said "didn't see a difference". You opened the door.

I do not think you wish to learn something new. Yes, please criticize my reaction to you. You need to re-evaluate the timeline and the events within it, toolbox.

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Okay enough with the lame backbone and toolbox comments. Seriously grow up and get a life what are you still in high school. You're not in a position to tell people what they think and what they should do. Opened the door hahah. Poor baby. You are the only punk on this thread who started the personal attacks and passive aggressive posts. I never intentionally ignored your video and I was never interested in what you had to say after you started acting like a twit. I think everyone else who has already posted would agree! Which is why moderators removed your irrelevant content. Your post was removed as proof of your childish behavior. Good luck getting any type of professional job if you conduct yourself in person the way you do online. What a waste of time this has turned into. You must do this kind of stuff a lot I would imagine. Who in their right mind would waste their time learning from a character like you hahaha your more entertaining then you are informative.
This was never an argument but you sure tried like hell to turn it into one.

.......Think im more confused than when i started reading this thread.......

piecemasta said:

Okay enough with the lame backbone and toolbox comments. Seriously grow up and get a life what are you still in high school. You're not in a position to tell people what they think and what they should do. Opened the door hahah. Poor baby. You are the only punk on this thread who started the personal attacks and passive aggressive posts. I never intentionally ignored your video and I was never interested in what you had to say after you started acting like a twit. I think everyone else who has already posted would agree! Which is why moderators removed your irrelevant content. Your post was removed as proof of your childish behavior. Good luck getting any type of professional job if you conduct yourself in person the way you do online. What a waste of time this has turned into. You must do this kind of stuff a lot I would imagine. Who in their right mind would waste their time learning from a character like you hahaha your more entertaining then you are informative.
This was never an argument but you sure tried like hell to turn it into one.

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I do like that you proofread that one.

Listen, to any reader it is pretty clear that you were attempting to come to the rescue of the person to whom I said "if you didn't see a difference." You over reacted to that. You had not been involved in the conversation at all and jumped in to try and respond to a perceived attack. You immediately jumped into statements about how there was no difference between bulbs when I had posted comparison data showing a difference between the very types of bulbs to which you were alluding. If you didn't like my data, then you should have provided data of your own. Instead, you implied that only inexperienced growers would purchase the very bulbs I had already stated that I purchased.

Yes, you did attempt to make it personal, but not in a direct way. First, you established that only inexperienced growers would fall victim to claims of greater performance or fire hazards - you even implied that the higher lumen output I was purchasing was a deception by the manufacturer to get inexperienced types to purchase them.

Obviously I am in high school, you nailed that one. Also obviously, one's greatest aspiration in life should be to hold some portion of the division of labor upon his back - a professional job as you put it. Allow me to rephrase my criticism of you if you do not like "backbone" and "toolbox" - I do not find them lame, but at least they were functional (you proofread your last post). I believe that you attempted to make some backhanded insults and then responded with indignation upon being called out. I feel that someone with a backbone would take a couple of days to find some data that would support his claim and then produce those data. Toolbox, well, to explain that I would say this: you are acting like you are the crusader of the forums and that you have some moral high ground from which you may sanctimoniously cast your passive aggressive derision.

I purchased my bulbs after comparing product specifications and reviews whereas you said "manufacturers make up their lumen output and make up stories of fire hazards." Yes, the professional world is full of people using opinions whereas academia harbors those who read and compile information - you must be a big fish. Is that less lame?

piecemasta said:

What a twit. @howsitgrowin420 you need to moderate yourself before others do it for you. Your taking this way to far. You need to simmer down. Personal attacks are not tolerated on this forum. Whatever I said has nothing directly to do with the video or any related content. Why would anyone pay any attention to you with the way your reacting? Actually, the problem is people like you go around accusing others of things they never explicitly said, and then attempt to demean fellow members. Sounds like a personal issue to me.
Because everyone who drinks is a good for nothing alcoholic...? hahah Retard juice? Now you are really making yourself out to be a twit. Maybe it's a good idea you don't drink! No one here cares about your personal beliefs.
Cool, good for you. There you go again! I never said "cheap bulbs are every bit as good as expensive bulbs" nor did I state "you" were a hobbyist. Lets get one thing straight going into the future. Unless I explicitly tag you in my post I am not directly referring to you @howsitgrowin420 so stop taking offense! Your taking everything too literal and out of context. Some growers buy products because they are sold on certain notions like that.
"Go grow a 1oz plant and call it a good day, meanwhile I'll keep pulling 4 oz per plant out of a perpetual harvest at 4 plants every 2.5 weeks." what a douchy thing to say. Let me guess, you drive one of those massive raised 4x4 trucks with the plastic nuts hanging from the bumper! haha.
Why would anyone in their right mind involve themselves with you with the way your acting!? Who wants to waste their time involving themselves with a overly aggressive character like yourself. I pity who ever has to deal with that in person!
It is a waste of time responding to these irrelevant posts.
My grammar? Your one to talk @howsitgrowin420 lol! In case you weren't aware this is a cannabis forum not a grammar class. #Troll

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why did you call me a twit and then act like I should knock off the backbone and toolbox comments? You are quite illogical. Seriously, explain why you would call me a twit and a troll and then get offended if I call you a spineless toolbox.

People do not often call you out for being illogical, but if you evaluated the content of what you say you would find that you invalidate yourself.

Get over yourself @howsitgrowing

piecemasta said:

Get over yourself @howsitgrowing

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@howsitgrowin420 . I thought you might like to read about how to use the @ symbol to tag people. By following the link you can get a history of the origins and how it applies to forums. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/At_sign

In this case, correct spelling not only conveys either: 1) ability to spell or 2) ability to use technology, but also adds functionality. It may also be a useful tool in precluding spelling errors by allowing you to select the person's name after inputting relatively few characters. Now though, oversight of relatively simple details has brought @howsitgrowing into the conversation. Note that I am @howsitgrowin420 @piecemasta. By selecting the correct corresponding photo from the dropdown list, your message will be sure to be received.

Grown with a $14.99 400w hps

When I was growing under MH in the 80s, I didn't even know that a lightbulb like that could get dimmer over time! lol! So after using the same bulb for YEARS (yes, you read it right), I did begin to see a dimming over time....I thought that either the bulb was dimmer or I was going blind! (Maybe a little of both).

There weren't too many choices for bulbs back then. I think mine were Sylvania....and likely intended for industrial lighting -nothing to do with horticulture. I preferred MH over HPS but only because the HPS color was a giveaway to cops and snoops.

Those bulbs are relatively cheap now...like ~$20. The question is: "Should I buy four cheap bulbs or one expensive one?" I think it would probably better to change the cheap bulb once a month as far as providing the brightest light over the course of a grow than it would be to buy an expensive bulb and run it the entire grow, instead.

If it's the difference between replacing the bulbs regularly I would go with cheap bulbs.

Shacks123 said:

Grown with a $14.99 400w hps

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Impressive! Great job!

Back when I started growing there was barely a market of grow bulbs for HID. I remember when I busted out the cash and bought my first Philips Son Agro bulb, was a 430 watt HPS. I can't really say it did better than the cheap hardware store HPS bulbs but it came with a cool label. lol

amgprb said:

I run both expensive bulbs and inexpensive. I have 4 HIDs so bulbs can get pricey and I get what I can afford at that time.

My favorite is Ushio. I can typically get 4 good harvests out of a ushio before I see any difference (ie lower yield).

As for the inexpensive, i use iPower bulbs. You can get them on Ebay/Amazon for under $15. They also come with a 1 year warrenty. When new, they will perform just like a top end bulb. I have run them side by side with very little difference in yield. The issue with the iPower lamps are that the quality definately diminishes much faster. I will replace an iPower lamp every other harvest.

*another mid priced bulb that I really like are Solis Tek. They compare to Ushio and Hortilux in quality and I will run a Solis Tek for 3-4 harvests before replacing

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Which iPower bulbs u used? 400W, 600W OR 1000W?