help me identify the defiency

so im in a pickle here. i’ve tried using boomerang and it seemed to help for a while and now it’s getting bad again. it seems to be affecting the older plants the most with the youngest not being affected at all? i’m pretty sure i found mite eggs on my plants but i didn’t find any mites. any help is appreciated

Spider mites. Look better.

well i bought a fogger and spray. anything else i can do to get rid of them?

and how exactly do the mites make the leaves yellow and die?

Sure looks like mite damage. Mites eat holes into the leaves and suck the fluids out of the plant. This in turn destroys the leaves. If left to their own they will eventually cover the buds in webs and ruin the harvest.

There is a product from NPK industries called Mighty Wash that may help you out.

That's not a deficiency...
That's insect damage, most likely mites but it could also be thrips.


Check the glass around your light for poops, if there are tiny specks of poop on the glass, it's probably thrips.


If you cannot see the insects, it's probably mites.
Put a pieces of paper under a section of leaves and shake it, if you super tiny black or red specks smaller than the size of ground pepper fall onto the paper, it's mites.


If you have a loupe or a microscope, look at the leaves (or paper) and you can see the nymphs chomping away at the leaves.


If this is an indoor grow, you may want to stay away from the chemical sprays because you have to breathe the same air.


I would suggest using neem oil (the actual oil, not some mix called neem oil). Check out Camden Grey oil company (https://www.camdengrey.com/essential-oils/neem-seed-wild.html), they usually have the pure oil for decent prices.
Neem is relatively safe, some people actually take this as a supplement.


I would also pick up some diatomaceous earth (Home Depot/Amazon). You can put this around the base of plants to keep the mites from burrowing into the soil (I assume it's soil or coco) and laying eggs.
You can also mix some of the diatomaceous earth in with the neem oil to really mess up those mites.
The diatomaceous earth cuts the mites allowing the neem to get into their bodies and do it's work faster.


The neem oil needs to be mixed with an emulsifier, most people use soap, but don't just use any soap, and don't use detergent (dish soap)...
I use an emulsifier because it works and I don't have to keep shaking the stupid bottle the entire time I am spraying.
Either way, to make sure the neem goes on your plants and doesn't just coat the inside of the bottle, takes a little extra prep.


I suggest using a potassium based soap, a good one you can probably pick up locally is Dr. Bronners (unscented).
https://www.amazon.com/Dr-Bronners-Pure-Castile-Liquid-Soap/dp/B000HJXQ9G/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&keywords=dr+bronners+unscented+soap&link_code=qs&qid=1547990617&sourceid=Mozilla-search&sr=8-7&tag=mozilla-20
Don't get the scented one because the scent will cause the leaves to wilt.


Potassium soap will breakdown into usable ingredients for your plants and not "salt the earth" like a sodium based "cake" soap or detergent.


If you are interested, I can tell you how to make this same soap for much less than buying it ($3.22 for 9oz.), but it takes time for the soap to mature and that doesn't help you right now.
You need something that can help now...
So, use the Dr. Bronners, if you can get it locally.


When you mix the neem oil and soap, the water needs to be hot, like 180 degrees.
I use a cheap stir plate I got off Amazon and I just boil the water, fill up a beaker that has the soap and neem oil in it and then I let it stir until the mixture is room temperature.
Otherwise the neem oil is going to separate way too easily and you will be shaking the bottle every other spray and when you wash out the bottle half the oil will have stuck to the sides of the bottle.
This is why I use an emulsifier, this way all of the neem is kept mixed and I don't have fuss with it.


I would tell you the name of the emulsifier, but it's crazy expensive and the company that sells it takes like 2 weeks to even ship it out. Plus I have to retain a few secrets...


Here's a recipe that works on plants just about to go into flower (I am not sure how old your plants are or how big they are).
8 ounces is usually good for each plant at this stage/size. Unless this is some outdoor grow monster that takes up half your grow space...
1/2 tsp Neem oil
1/2 tsp Potassium Soap
8 Ounces Water (118ml)


Wait until just before your lights go off (this will depend on how many plants you have to spray, but a minute or two per plant is sufficient), then spray the plants until the leaves drip with the mixture.
Then let them sit through the night with a fan circulating the air so the neem mixture dries on the leaves.


If you add the diatomaceous earth, I am not sure how much to add honestly (1/2-1.0 tsp per 4 ounces probably), I just found out about this myself and I haven't had a chance to try it. I have read that diatomaceous earth is also a weak emulsifier so that helps and it shouldn't clog your sprayer, but I am not positive.


The reason you want to spray just before the lights go off is because light destroys neem oils effectiveness. As it is neem is only useful once sprayed for like 100 hours, with light added in this time is drastically reduced, but you will see major results overnight.


Speaking of which, keep your neem oil in the fridge.
It will solidify but just let it sit out for like 30 minutes prior to measureing it out and it will be liquid again. Also after a few years it will start to separate a bit while in the fridge, just let the oil sit out and fully warm to room temp and then shake it really hard for about a minute and it will re-disperse and be fine for another 6 months.
I made the mistake of buying a 16 ounce bottle when I first started growing because I totally over estimated how much I was going to need. Needless to say I still have quite a bit of it left.
A few ounces a year for decent size grows should be more than sufficient.


You can safely spray once a week.
I wouldn't spray once the flowers, but this is a personal preference.
Technically small quantities of neem are safe for ingestion, but more than likely neem turns into something nasty if left on parts that get decarboxylated.
I am sure it's fine for raw tinctures.
Similarly to if you use Olive oil to fry in, it can go from a "healthy fat" to a mild carcinogen (aldehyde formation during typical frying temps).


I think that about covers it...

well i’ve sprayed with mitey wash twice, and
used those doctor doom foggers twice. i’m not getting a whole let of webs if any webbing really, but i can see whole undersides of leaves covered in little golden eggs. i suppose i’ll have to try the methods listed above but holy fuck how resilient are these things? should i be spraying the soil as well??

Nuke Em

https://www.flyingskull.net/NukeEm.html

cincity420 said:

well i’ve sprayed with mitey wash twice, and
used those doctor doom foggers twice. i’m not getting a whole let of webs if any webbing really, but i can see whole undersides of leaves covered in little golden eggs. i suppose i’ll have to try the methods listed above but holy fuck how resilient are these things? should i be spraying the soil as well??

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That might damage is about as bad as it gets that is why I quit growing in 1995 plus I was getting married but I couldn't get rid of those bastards for 2 years so I had enough

you need to do everything, spray everything all the time because until you get rid of them, or at least come to control them you can forget about it!

Predator mites won't help until you stop spraying but knock the population down and then introduced predators down the road

Neem oil isn't going to control mites, they don't care about neem oil, you need dynamite, gasoline and matches (think along those lines) and I'm not joking!

If I had an infestation that bad I'd tear my garden down and by the way I used to see webs mainly on buds so if you're not seeing webs on the leaves that doesn't mean anything, plus you're seeing eggs, its 100% mites, at least mites, treat for mites and anything else will die too because they are the hardest to kill

Ps. They are on the younger plants too, treat all plants.

Beachwalker said:

That might damage is about as bad as it gets that is why I quit growing in 1995 plus I was getting married but I couldn't get rid of those bastards for 2 years so I had enough

you need to do everything, spray everything all the time because until you get rid of them, or at least come to control them you can forget about it!

Predator mites won't help until you stop spraying but knock the population down and then introduced predators down the road

Neem oil isn't going to control mites, they don't care about neem oil, you need dynamite, gasoline and matches (think along those lines) and I'm not joking!

If I had an infestation that bad I'd tear my garden down and by the way I used to see webs mainly on buds so if you're not seeing webs on the leaves that doesn't mean anything, plus you're seeing eggs, its 100% mites, at least mites, treat for mites and anything else will die too because they are the hardest to kill

Ps. They are on the younger plants too, treat all plants.

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Neem works as a preventative measure in veg. But once you have them neem just keeps them under control. And you only want to use neem in veg. I wouldn't spray that stuff on flowering plants of any age. And the key is to spray until it's dripping off and on both sides of the leaves. I might just be lucky but I haven't had mites in years since I started spraying weekly in veg. Years ago I had them so bad that I just could not get rid of them. I have since moved and now keep my grow area under quarantine. No outside plants are brought in under any circumstances, no outside visitors, I stay out of anyone else's grow room, and I keep everything clean.

xtsho said:

Neem works as a preventative measure in veg. But once you have them neem just keeps them under control. And you only want to use neem in veg. I wouldn't spray that stuff on flowering plants of any age. And the key is to spray until it's dripping off and on both sides of the leaves. I might just be lucky but I haven't had mites in years since I started spraying weekly in veg. Years ago I had them so bad that I just could not get rid of them. I have since moved and now keep my grow area under quarantine. No outside plants are brought in under any circumstances, no outside visitors, I stay out of anyone else's grow room, and I keep everything clean.

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Absolutely I use it about once a week in veg but it's not going to do anything to an infestation like he's got going on.

I couldn't get rid of them either but we didn't have all these products back then like now so I guess it would be easier now but I don't want to find out ever again

Agree never outside plants in. And when I Garden Outdoors I'm really careful, change clothes shower everything but I probably should be more careful if I'm honest, it's kind of like dodging the bullet with those little bastards


Op best buy two or even three different products and cycle them because these devils will become immune to anything, also get more aggressive in treating them

i haven’t seen but the tiniest of webs on a branch in veg. it hasn’t touched my flower room yet. no webs on buds. i just bought 300 lady bugs to try and eat the fuckers out. i’ve been using mighty wash but it doesn’t seem to be doing the job. the go away for a day and come back within 2 days. do they live in the dirt also??

they dont live in dirt but the eggs can fall off and hatch down there.

With such a population you won't get rid of mites unless you go with something like Forbid but thats frowned upon. Best bet is to destroy the plants, sterilize equipment and area repeatedly.

i’m also going to get rosemary oil as we speak

cincity420 said:

i’m also going to get rosemary oil as we speak

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your pissing in the wind mate. none of this money expenditure is going to stop the mites.

This is why running a perpetual grow is not something I would do personally. One can never totally clean up a room and start clean. One plant with a few eggs is all it takes to perpetuate the infestation.

Get some Forbid 4f and spray the vegging plants, not flowering plants. I have been battling spidey for a bit and the Forbid works THROUGH the leaves systemically. Just spray it over the tops of all the leaves. I now spray my vegging plants about once a month with it and zero mites since. I spray plants with Forbid about a week into flowering as preventative. If I see any specs on flowering plants, I hit them with pyrethrin, which becomes non toxic after a few hours. Forbid is expensive, but you can buy it by the ounce be resellers. An ounce goes a long way! Don't mess around with these nice natural remedies, they will work for a day then the mites come back.

cincity420 said:

well i’ve sprayed with mitey wash twice, and
used those doctor doom foggers twice. i’m not getting a whole let of webs if any webbing really, but i can see whole undersides of leaves covered in little golden eggs. i suppose i’ll have to try the methods listed above but holy fuck how resilient are these things? should i be spraying the soil as well??

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Those doom foggers are a waste of money.

You'll be able to figure out how to get rid of them only like a thousand threads on the subject but whatever you IPM ends up being the trick is to stay on top of them consistently even if you think you dont have any mites to spray for = you spray anyways.

Would lady bugs even have a chance?Assuming a sealed room and say a couple hundred thousand of them.

myke said:

Would lady bugs even have a chance?Assuming a sealed room and say a couple hundred thousand of them.

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Nope. They don't eat eggs. They can help reduce the numbers but with an infestation this advanced there is no winning this battle conventionally. You would have to go nuclear on them with Avid, Forbid, Floramite, TetraSan.. Of all those Forbid has the least tolerance build up, some populations of mites have become immune to the Avid and Floramite as they were overused and not properly...

If you really had to save a strain thats in veg, hit it with Forbid 4F. Mix at 1.2mL per gallon. That is absolute max rate and the plants may get a little wierd with that exposure but will survive to produce cuttings in time. A normal rate for prevention of mites would be 1mL per gallon. If you are going to retreat, use another tool to prevent the population from building immunity. Avid with Tetra San 5 would be my go to at that point. Then the next treatment would be Floramite and then back to Forbid. Frankly if this is done in a dedicated veg and clones cut from that and put into clean flowering rooms, you shouldn't have mite issues unless you are carrying them into the flowering rooms on your person or the grow room is poorly sealed. Treating the vegetation around the outside of your home is a good idea.

myke said:

Would lady bugs even have a chance?Assuming a sealed room and say a couple hundred thousand of them.

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Even 10k of them won’t wipe it out, the mite reproduce to fast, n ladybugs prefer aphids

OP Sorry about the mites , fight hard,
When you think you won, keep at it for another month , then start a preventative treatment.

Getting rid of them should be top priority, or shutting down , n cleaning everything 10 times , mites are no joke.

I would welcome in thrips n others compared to mites .