joe the plumber

ViRedd

New Member
you guys have to look at the bigger picture. what they say is different then what they will do. they will never end up delivering a take away money from one guy and give it to another guy type of economic policy. its just to get votes. im done on this thread politics should never be discussed
Dumb and dumber. The federal government just took over one trillion dollars in the largest train robbery in history from the American taxpayer and gave it to incompetent businessmen to bail out their failed companies. There is no constitutional authority for this robbery. They did it because they know that folks like you will turn your back and not even "discuss" politics.

Vi
 

ccodiane

New Member
Knock Knock....

Who's there?

Obama!

Obama who?

Open this fuckin door and give me your goddamn wallet before I kick this mother fucker down!
 

tipsgnob

New Member
Joe the Plumber doesn't really matter. Attempts to discredit the guy won't work. The issue at play here is O'Bama's principles and lack of faith in capitalism, free markets and entrepenurship. What O'Bama said in that taped interview was, "Hey Joe, no one likes to pay high taxes, but if you attain some success, I want to take money away from you, to give to those coming up behind you so that they can have some success too."

So, if you believe that its government's job to take away money from one citizen who works hard, plays by the rules, sacrifices, opens a business, then makes a decent living for him/her self, only to put that money into the hands of someone who hasn't earned it ... then vote for socialism. Vote for fascism. Vote for legalized plunder. Vote for immorality. Vote for lack of principles. Vote for theft. Cast your vote for O'Bama.

Vi
already did.............:mrgreen:
 

wannabe grower

Well-Known Member
OK, so say "O'Bama" get's elected and sends American soldiers to your house to collect the money from you because you happen to fall into the taxable category. Now multiply this by millions. How long do you think it will take all these hard working Americans handing over cash and the soldiers sent to collect it rebel? These silly gloom and doom tactics a select few of you consistantly spout off just will never happen. Banks and other lenders are causing the problems by handing people more cash than they can reasonably handle.
A 23 year old friend of mine went to buy a home in the mid 90's he made approx 30k a year. They offered him a loan for upto 300k worth of house. He wisely declined and bought a fixer upper for low 90k's. He was a reasonable American citizen not trying to live above his means.
On the flip side, everyday I go to various houses with 2 adults usually the man works full time making 100k plus a year while the wife stays home with the very young kids. They live in 600k+ houses and drive Mercedes and BMW's. They don't do any menial tasks themselves they hire people to cut lawns, tend pools, housekeep, even watch the kids, which is the pretense for the woman to stay home. All those bills vs 100k in income equals a problem. The man gets downsized 1 day, "Uh Oh!!" Now you and I can take up the slack because this couple were complete fucking dolts. Yay American way!!
 

ccodiane

New Member
OK, so say "O'Bama" get's elected and sends American soldiers to your house to collect the money from you because you happen to fall into the taxable category. Now multiply this by millions. How long do you think it will take all these hard working Americans handing over cash and the soldiers sent to collect it rebel? These silly gloom and doom tactics a select few of you consistantly spout off just will never happen. Banks and other lenders are causing the problems by handing people more cash than they can reasonably handle.
A 23 year old friend of mine went to buy a home in the mid 90's he made approx 30k a year. They offered him a loan for upto 300k worth of house. He wisely declined and bought a fixer upper for low 90k's. He was a reasonable American citizen not trying to live above his means.
On the flip side, everyday I go to various houses with 2 adults usually the man works full time making 100k plus a year while the wife stays home with the very young kids. They live in 600k+ houses and drive Mercedes and BMW's. They don't do any menial tasks themselves they hire people to cut lawns, tend pools, housekeep, even watch the kids, which is the pretense for the woman to stay home. All those bills vs 100k in income equals a problem. The man gets downsized 1 day, "Uh Oh!!" Now you and I can take up the slack because this couple were complete fucking dolts. Yay American way!!
Damn holmes.....it was just a knock knock joke.....:-P
 

lopezri

Well-Known Member
The best way to resolve the whole tax burden is to SWITCH from an Income Tax to a Purchase Tax, that way it doesn't matter how much money a person makes, it matters how much they spend. If you don't want to pay more taxes, you spend less, then you're paying less taxes. If you insist that you need that 50 inch flat screen television even though you can barely afford a $300.00 a month apartment, you're the one making the decision to pay more taxes to the government. Come on people. . . read Neal Boortz "The Fair Tax" book. It explains it all.

The problem with this though, is that we, the people, need to vote out all the incumbents in the legislature to get this past because all the ones sitting on the hill now know that taxes are used as a way to control the people and the votes.

Tax Code = Vote Control, that's why the democrats are always promising to lower taxes for the poor, so they get the poor vote, that's why the republicans are always promising to lower taxes for the rich, so they get the rich vote. Get rid of income taxes and you'll get rid of politicians using the tax code as a means to manipulate the people.
 

vertise

Well-Known Member
Dumb and dumber. The federal government just took over one trillion dollars in the largest train robbery in history from the American taxpayer and gave it to incompetent businessmen to bail out their failed companies. There is no constitutional authority for this robbery. They did it because they know that folks like you will turn your back and not even "discuss" politics.

Vi

they gave the money in order to prevent the largest companies from failing. if they fail america will have the highest unemployment rate of all time. you know what that means right. maybe not. think about that. 50,000 people will lose there jobs along with the stock market dropping to below 7000
 

vertise

Well-Known Member
Tax Code = Vote Control, that's why the democrats are always promising to lower taxes for the poor, so they get the poor vote, that's why the republicans are always promising to lower taxes for the rich, so they get the rich vote. Get rid of income taxes and you'll get rid of politicians using the tax code as a means to manipulate the people.

i agree man its politics
 

hom36rown

Well-Known Member
they gave the money in order to prevent the largest companies from failing. if they fail america will have the highest unemployment rate of all time. you know what that means right. maybe not. think about that. 50,000 people will lose there jobs along with the stock market dropping to below 7000
thats most likely going to happen anyway
 

CrackerJax

New Member
you make 250,000 a year and your in debt you are living way far beyond your means. thats why the economy is already in the shitter. maybe he shouldnt open his own business then cause he cant actually afford it. debt is what is fucking over this nation. Loans that people dig holes with and cant afford. there are problems with both economic plans plus you cant think that acorn is not another gimic.

vertise, you don't seem to understand how the economy is set up. A person who is making 250k and has no debt will be RAPED by the tax man. The entire govt. is set up upon debt.

If you are so concerned about debt. then why would you vote for a person (Obama) who will increase the debt.? Curious. or perhaps you haven't thought it through.

out.
 

Bongulator

Well-Known Member
The economy, and small businesses, do better under Democrats than under Republicans. It's been that way for eighty years. It's not even close.
 

Dankdude

Well-Known Member
The economy, and small businesses, do better under Democrats than under Republicans. It's been that way for eighty years. It's not even close.
And Corporations do Better under Republicans... Personally I would rather see small business doing well than corporations.
 

VictorVIcious

Well-Known Member
vertise, you don't seem to understand how the economy is set up. A person who is making 250k and has no debt will be RAPED by the tax man. The entire govt. is set up upon debt.
This is a common misunderstanding, folks think they get a tax break by being in debt, consciously or unconsciously, our tax code is set up to favor people that go in debt, but only to buy a house, homeownership the American Dream. It used to be that you could get a tax break for all debts that you paid interest on, didn't matter what it was for. In the late 70's or early 80's, can't remember for sure, they made some changes in the tax code that affected this. Seems everyone decided credit card debt was bad for you so they eliminated that deduction. And the refie market was born. All you had to do was go into your financial institution and borrow enough money to pay off you credit card debt, do a little home improving so you could say it was for your house, and bingo gingo, even though you Mortgage percent went up a little, you were saving all of this money, creating all of this positve cash flow. I assume you have listened to an ad or two, saved this lady $400.00 a month,etc. Well BULLSHIT, what they did was take your short term debt (credit cards) on stretch them out for the next thirty years, don't worry you can always get a refie and since the value of the property will go up, sell it and buy another.
How do you get the population to agree to have the 'government' bail out bad business decisions, tell everyone folks are losing their houses, we simply can't have that.
There are several things wrong with this idea that you get a tax break for paying interest on a house. When I was doing income taxes, I pointed this out to several folks. One of my relatives was trying to tell me it was good to have this Mortgage Interest Deduction, they were getting a refund. I explained that he could give me the $7000.00 he paid in interest and I would give him back $2000.00, no problem, it is not a credit it is literally and figuratively a deduction from income not a tax credit, subject to your AGI deduction, before you get the deduction. If you had paid cash instead you might owe a few dollas of taxes but you would have the $7000.00 you paid in interest in your pocket. See what I mean.
The next thing that is wrong with it is who pays for the deduction? All of the non-home owners.
If you don't pay the interest, you could pay the taxes, we are getting raped to keep bad credit flowing, and the tax breaks as you talk about them is big part of how they folks that have the money are doing it to us. The stockbroker gets paid whether you are buying or selling.
And you have fallen for it hook, line and sinker.


If you are so concerned about debt. then why would you vote for a person (Obama) who will increase the debt.? Curious. or perhaps you haven't thought it through.

out.
Maybe you haven't thought it thru. Lets take a few figures and toss them around. Lets start with the Trillion dollar health care for all American's program, ok? Sounds like a lot doesn't it? 850 billion for the bail out, plus the money for 'rescuing' freddie and fanny seems more expensive to me, you mean for the same dollars as the bail-out we can provide health care for everyone. $10,000,000,000.00 a month could be saved by not being in Iraq. $400,000,000,000.00 would come from not giving the oil companies anymore tax breaks. Everytime its the same bullshit. The difference is who gets the cuts. Personally, I think these 'ordinary citizens' they keep talking about, like they are extraordinary, are tired of hearing about trickle down, and the lament of someone making more money than we are complaining about the government taking it all. I will let you in on a little secret, it is easier to ignore $100,000.00 of income then it is for the guy making $30,000.00 to make a $10.00 mistake on his tax return. If money changes hands without a paper trail, does it exist? If I buy my companies 2 year old Lexus for a $1000.00 and the company writes of the other $70,000.00 is it income to me? Has anyone every made a 'strictly business trip'? There are so many ways for someone with a reportable income over $250,000.00 to get 'breaks'. VV:blsmoke:
 

Doctor Pot

Well-Known Member
Victor - I'm pretty sure it's 4 billion dollars in tax breaks to oil companies, not 400 billion.

vertise, you don't seem to understand how the economy is set up. A person who is making 250k and has no debt will be RAPED by the tax man. The entire govt. is set up upon debt.
That's why the US tax code strongly encourages the wealthy to have their money in investments. And they do. This lowers their taxed income by a great deal

If you are so concerned about debt. then why would you vote for a person (Obama) who will increase the debt.? Curious. or perhaps you haven't thought it through.
McCain wants to lower taxes on everybody, by $300,000,000,000. He also wants to freeze government spending, except on things like the DoD and things like Medicare and Social Security. But he'd still be increasing spending overall. What happens when you give the country an enormous tax cut without cutting spending? Obama will at least increase some taxes to make up for his various proposed programs, and his plan will result in less additional debt.

Many Republicans don't realize that income taxes on the rich are much less now than they were in the seventies. Even Obama's plans aren't anywhere near a 1970s-style tax code.
 

vertise

Well-Known Member
vertise, you don't seem to understand how the economy is set up. A person who is making 250k and has no debt will be RAPED by the tax man. The entire govt. is set up upon debt.

If you are so concerned about debt. then why would you vote for a person (Obama) who will increase the debt.? Curious. or perhaps you haven't thought it through.

out.
You got to use your brain a little more.
 

CrackerJax

New Member
Vertise u said:

"That's why the US tax code strongly encourages the wealthy to have their money in investments. And they do. This lowers their taxed income by a great deal"
==============================================

That money made in investments is subject to an even higher tax than income. While it is true that investments do not increase your taxable yearly income, it is simply a tax which is postponed until converted.
============== =========== =================
The definition of a small business is what is parsed about in political circles. Democrats have hardly been friends to small business historically. Onerous tax rates and expensive regulation help kill small businesses.

If you want to help business, which will in turn help society by creating jobs and opportunities for all folks actually willing to work, one merely needs to put Capital gains and Corporate taxes at 10%. The amount of foreign capital and domestic investment would literally rush in and create tens of thousands of jobs and small business startups as well as large. IPO'S would skyrocket! Seen any lately? And you won't with the Democrats.


Obama will tax and spend and that has NEVER built a robust private sector.

Public sector = inefficiency
Private sector = efficiency

It's pretty simple. If you doubt my words, one can merely gander at Social Security. The rate of return on SS for the "average Joe" is 2%. 2%!!!! Heck any idiot can take out CD's at 5%.

So keep dreaming and vote for Obama and watch your future slide away from you and your children.

Hell hath no fury like a one party government. That's about what you misguided folks are about to do. You deserve what you get. The wealthy will simply move their monies offshore.

They are called A.R.P's (asset relocation programs). I have mine already set up and as soon as the elections are finalized, it is simply as easy as one phone call to make it engage.

So come November 5th or 6th or so, watch the money fly away, taking opportunity and jobs with it.

High taxes = XXX amount of revenue for Govt.
Low taxes - same XXX amount of revenue for Govt.

This axiom has been proven over and over.

Obama = higher taxes
Mccain = lower taxes both will lead to the about the same amount of revenue for govt.

Difference is High taxes inhibit growth and jobs, while low taxes encourage growth and jobs.

The Bush tax cuts are about to expire and Obama will lard on more. Get ready to lose your momentum.

Get ready to lose your wallets.

Sorry if this pisses you off. If it pisses you off because you doubt it, then you haven't thought it through or you don't understand economics and human nature. They go together.

One of the very CORE reasons why capitalism is so effective at building individual and National wealth is because it is in synch with the basic human psyche upon which we all are governed by.

Humans will work most efficiently and labor best when the SELF is satisfied first and then outwards. Capitalism coupled with Democracy addresses this connection. The farther away you get from satisfying the self FIRST, such as in degrees, Socialism and Communism, the worse the results will be. Corruption occurs in all of these forms of Government because power corrupts absolutely, no matter who is at the wheel.

The only reason socialism even is mildly attractive to anyone is because of the GIGANTIC CAPITALISTIC ECONOMIC ENGINE called the United States is around to stoke the fires so hot that even less efficient forms of Govt's and applied economics gain, but not nearly at the rates of the U.S.

Take away the capitalistic economic engine and watch the planet suffer like never before.

Meanwhile I'll sit by the phone and wait to make the call. Like so many others



out.
 
Top