Led after germination

Ikilledbambi

Ikilledbambi

Member
Hi, I was wondering if it's ok to start seedlings out under my 300 watt led, or if I should veg them under cfl for a week or two first. I'm starting with a speed devil auto and ultimate purple photo. I will be running the light 20/4 until auto is done then switch 12/12.
 
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az2000

Well-Known Member
The LED is overkill. You should keep it pretty far from the plants. CFL would be less energy cost the first week.
 
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az2000

Well-Known Member
Madagascar said:
Is this LeD worth it ?
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That's a complicated topic. The first question to ask is: why am I considering LED? If it's to reduce energy costs or manage heat, then yes, they're worth it.

The inexpensive lights like you linked to use epistar/epiled diodes which aren't very efficient. T5HO (short 4' spaces) and CMH (tall spaces) are better values. More light, less heat and usually lower cost up front.

To cut energy consumption or heat generation beyond that, you have to pay some serious money on efficient LED. Many make their own DIY COBs which are very cost-effective, but you need some skills to do that. Otherwise, you're looking at Area-51 LED, Tasty LED (some others I haven't followed. You'd have to ask about it in the LED forum).

I use Cree LED lightbulbs (my write-up) from Home Depot. I love them. They're not as efficient as COBs. But, better than the epi-fixtures. I like that they're commodities. I can run down to the store to get another. And, 10-year warranty. Also scalable, easy to add a few at a time, lower initial cost to get into.

This can be an emotional issue for some people because they buy an epi-whatever fixture, they like how it grows, and they feel attacked when the above rationale is stated. They didn't buy their light to save electricity or reduce heat. They just wanted to "do LED." They might be running 50-60w/sq ft and like it. (One guy said two days ago he intends to run over 70w/sq ft.). Or, they run at comparable power and get airy buds in flower, which isn't bad either. (Any bud you grow yourself is 100x better than buying from a dealer.).

That's fine. Whatever works for people. But, if you're choosing LED for a reason, the epi-whatever lights don't add up compared to the non-LED options. It's just a potentially explosive issue to talk about.

Where you can *really* get hurt is buying the rebranded epi-whatever lights sold at a premium. (Lush, Kind, Scammie Mackenzie's HydroGrowLED, BlackDog, GrowBlu.). Those are truly predatory in nature. For the money you get MarsHydro/Tao performance and pay Area51 prices. It truly does not add up.

There you have it.
 
Ikilledbambi

Ikilledbambi

Member
I am running an led simply because I want to. I have hps/mh I could run if I so choose. I am doing a small grow, simply for my own medication, and like to tinker with different things. I am not a master grower, this will be my first run in over ten years. Thank you all for the input.
 
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az2000

Well-Known Member
Ikilledbambi said:
I am running an led simply because I want to. ... this will be my first run in over ten years.
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I don't know if this input will be welcome. But, if it's one of the inexpensive products often found on Amazon and eBay, the recommended footprint may not be ideal. (It's common for that spec to be overstated.). It probably pulls 150w actual. For shorter plants, that should cover 3.3 sq ft. (45w/sq ft). If you grow taller plants, maybe 2.5-2.7 sq ft. (55-60w/sq ft).

You can compare that with the specs to see how close it is. If it's spec'ed for a larger footprint, I would stay closer to what I said above, or use some sidelighting. The lights will grow. It's just that sometimes (frequently) the specs aren't right and people are disappointed with airy buds (but, they wouldn't be if they concentrated the light a little narrower.).

I hope that's well received. I just thought since you hadn't grown in 10 years that might help you avoid that possible experience.
 
Ikilledbambi

Ikilledbambi

Member
Thanks for your input. I appreciate the knowledge. It is one of the cheap eBay lights. My grow area is18"x30"x72". I will supplement with side lights if needed. I think I'm going to try it on a single auto first. If it does not work, no big loss, I'll toss it in the dumpster and go back to the lights I know work. Thanks again for your comments.
 
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az2000

Well-Known Member
Ikilledbambi said:
If it does not work, no big loss, I'll toss it in the dumpster and go back to the lights I know work.
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I'm sure it will work. Your space is 3.75 sq ft. That's 40w/sq ft. If it's shorter plants (2' from soil) that should work ok (but, a couple Cree 9.5w bulbs or CFLs would make a difference). If it's taller plants (5' from soil), you would need quite a bit more (perhaps 50% more light) or you'll have airy buds.

I'm really sold on sidelighting. If you like to squeeze efficiency out of things, you can get more results from fewer watts by distributing those watts around the plant, not a single source. I've gotten great results from a plant grown at only 21w/sq ft using nothing but those Cree lightbulbs. That might be more of an OCD obsession/hobby than a realistic approach to lighting. (Not everyone wants to rig up a dozen sockets around a plant). But, it illustrates how you can get considerable bang for the buck by adding some watts from the side compared to more at the top. (I know you're only growing for personal and may not be into this. But, see this guy's side-lighting chamber. That's impressive.).

You won't be disappointed if you add 2-4 sidelights in flower.
 
Ikilledbambi

Ikilledbambi

Member
Thanks, I'll look into it. I'm kinda in awe of how much the technology has changed over time. When I last had ladies auto plants where almost unheard of as well. Thanks for taking the time out of your day to help get me back where I need to be.
 
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