LED Noob - Help Me Decide, What I Need For This Grow, Please

G

GaiaGuy

Member
Hello,

I’ve done a couple CFL grows which turned out extremely well and now I’m interested in trying out LEDs. I would try HPS but the heat issue probably won’t work in my situation, so the low-heat emitting LEDs are an attractive alternative.

Basically, I have a 4’X4’ tent and would like to grow 2-3 plants (autos, no more than 2' tall each) at the same time. I’m currently looking at a 120watt LED panel which (claims) the following specs:

- 6:1:1:1 Red/Blue/Orange/White
- 400 Watt MH vegging Equivalent/ 300w HPS flowering equivalent
- 84 Red Led's 12 Blue Led's
- 12 Star Burst Orange Led's
- 12 Wide Kelvin White Full Spectrum
- 50,000+ hour life cycle

Would this be sufficient, or will I require supplemental lighting? Maybe toss in a couple of my 42watt CFLs? Alternatively I could buy two of them, but I don’t want/need overkill, and they do emit some heat, which I’m trying to avoid by going LED in the first place.

Thanks for your time.
 
Green Inferno

Green Inferno

Active Member
GaiaGuy said:
Hello,

I’ve done a couple CFL grows which turned out extremely well and now I’m interested in trying out LEDs. I would try HPS but the heat issue probably won’t work in my situation, so the low-heat emitting LEDs are an attractive alternative.

Basically, I have a 4’X4’ tent and would like to grow 2-3 plants (autos, no more than 2' tall each) at the same time. I’m currently looking at a 120watt LED panel which (claims) the following specs:

- 6:1:1:1 Red/Blue/Orange/White
- 400 Watt MH vegging Equivalent/ 300w HPS flowering equivalent
- 84 Red Led's 12 Blue Led's
- 12 Star Burst Orange Led's
- 12 Wide Kelvin White Full Spectrum
- 50,000+ hour life cycle

Would this be sufficient, or will I require supplemental lighting? Maybe toss in a couple of my 42watt CFLs? Alternatively I could buy two of them, but I don’t want/need overkill, and they do emit some heat, which I’m trying to avoid by going LED in the first place.

Thanks for your time.
Click to expand...
I have the 90 watt LED from HTG. It is pretty decent. Not as good as the company claims, but it is good for a small area.
I just ordered today a 240 watt LED from Gotham Hydro. There are a lot of decent grows on here with people using them.

http://www.gothamhydroponics.com/grow-lights/gotham-hydro-led-grow-lights/blackstar-240w-led-grow-light-3w-cree.html

I don't think this one will put out as much as a 400 watt HM or 300 watts worth of HPS. The coverage is 4-6 square feet for
the 240 watt. They have a 500 watt one, the actual wattage it draws is a little over 300 watts. Maybe check that one out.

http://cgi.ebay.com/New-500w-Blackstar-LED-Grow-light-3w-Flowering-LEDs-/290544137393?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43a5c7b4b1

I'm sure a few others will chime in with their recommendations. And some will even tell you to not use LEDs because they think they suck.
Do the research, and decide for yourself what sucks or not. Someone saying they suck with nothing to back it up doesn't mean they actually
suck.

Good luck.
 
Kingrow1

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
I admire you for using leds, whilst some do grow with it i feel that it has yet to become popular due to low yeilds and light. I won't say they suck and as green inferno said you got to decide what is best for each individual and grow. If green inferno could post me a link for a thread where a led or ufo was used for flowering with a good success of yeild i would be impressed but i am open minded and am in no way saying they suck but my opinion is that they suck.

I researched it and seen a 120watt led ufo at my mates grow, he wanted to sell it after a few weeks due to him not liking it watsoever, no one would buy it though as they seen it didn't really work. I read a lot on the technology behind led's and i just don't think it is good enough over flourescents (i don't like cfl's but flower with the higher wattage ones due to my individual situation).

As a point their claims are similar to cfl's and both say they produce the equivelant of a higher wattage bulb, and we all know this is an exageration!

Ok the great side about led's is they are the prefered choice of light fo vast crops of indoor lettuce and give better efficiency over all other light sources. So led's do work but not that great i think for marijuana although it dose obviously grow it to a point where it is worth it or some growers wouldn't use it.

Can you post some pics of your led grow green inferno so i can see their abilities. I'm gona search and look through a few led grows now to school myself some more.
 
Green Inferno

Green Inferno

Active Member
Kingrow1 said:
I admire you for using leds, whilst some do grow with it i feel that it has yet to become popular due to low yeilds and light. I won't say they suck and as green inferno said you got to decide what is best for each individual and grow. If green inferno could post me a link for a thread where a led or ufo was used for flowering with a good success of yeild i would be impressed but i am open minded and am in no way saying they suck but my opinion is that they suck.

I researched it and seen a 120watt led ufo at my mates grow, he wanted to sell it after a few weeks due to him not liking it watsoever, no one would buy it though as they seen it didn't really work. I read a lot on the technology behind led's and i just don't think it is good enough over flourescents (i don't like cfl's but flower with the higher wattage ones due to my individual situation).

As a point their claims are similar to cfl's and both say they produce the equivelant of a higher wattage bulb, and we all know this is an exageration!

Ok the great side about led's is they are the prefered choice of light fo vast crops of indoor lettuce and give better efficiency over all other light sources. So led's do work but not that great i think for marijuana although it dose obviously grow it to a point where it is worth it or some growers wouldn't use it.

Can you post some pics of your led grow green inferno so i can see their abilities. I'm gona search and look through a few led grows now to school myself some more.
Click to expand...
Sure:

http://forum.grasscity.com/advanced-growing-techniques/378954-spectra-unit-90watt-led-grow-almost-done-whe-got-buds.html

http://ledbudguy.com/showthread.php/1-Confined-Space-1020W-LED-24-Afgani-Kush/page15

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/386508-hempstar-3-stage-led-grow.html

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/416863-9-purple-kush-under-360-a-22.html

There's more, gotta research.

I think the problem is, most of the experienced growers are using HPS, and they have their garden dialed in perfectly, they don't want to make the switch,
there is no reason for them to, their HPS is working for them. So that leaves the noobs, they buy an LED either without researching and getting a bad LED
unit, or they do some research and get a good one, but makes noob mistakes, which kinda could make LEDs look bad. The technology is here, LEDs are getting
better all the time. Not all LEDs are bad. Not all growers are good.

Here are 2 pics of the same plant, at day 10, and again at day 16 (and I'm a noob as far as indoor growing):

Day 10:


Day 16:
 
Kingrow1

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
Hot damn, i just saw some grows with 1000w leds, 1w led at 60 lense. They certainly did yeild on 9 plants, quite impressive. I understand about dialing them in for your grow, looks like being different to other lights and you need to keep the plants short. Says 1600watts is about as much as a plant can handle led wise and that you keep the led panels about ten inches or so depending on the lense. Quite tricky they seem but i take it back they do work well although 100watt seems to be the more prefered wattage for a good yeild. I am impressed but not enough to change, i get more yeild for my flourescents and giant cfls but like you say thats what i have dialed in. Things to look at when buying the led units are the wattage of each individual led and the lense it uses. Says they kick out a fair amount of heat though!
 
Green Inferno

Green Inferno

Active Member
Kingrow1 said:
Hot damn, i just saw some grows with 1000w leds, 1w led at 60 lense. They certainly did yeild on 9 plants, quite impressive. I understand about dialing them in for your grow, looks like being different to other lights and you need to keep the plants short. Says 1600watts is about as much as a plant can handle led wise and that you keep the led panels about ten inches or so depending on the lense. Quite tricky they seem but i take it back they do work well although 100watt seems to be the more prefered wattage for a good yeild. I am impressed but not enough to change, i get more yeild for my flourescents and giant cfls but like you say thats what i have dialed in. Things to look at when buying the led units are the wattage of each individual led and the lense it uses. Says they kick out a fair amount of heat though!
Click to expand...
Different lights will work for different growers. I am a noob, and I am a technology junky, and I have seen the LEDs work.
So I will learn with LEDs. Once I have a few practice grows in with my 90 watt and my 240 watt, I will be getting three 500
watt LEDs. That should keep me smoking and happy indefinitely.

I am not an LED salesman, my feeling won't get hurt if someone decides to not get LEDs. Whatever will work for that persons
situation, is what they should get. If your situation calls for a 1000 HPS, get that. If it calls for CFLs, get those. If it calls for
a flash light, get that. Or, even just on the grounds on what you want. There is a world of choices out there.

Happy growing!
 
G

GaiaGuy

Member
Green Inferno said:
I have the 90 watt LED from HTG. It is pretty decent. Not as good as the company claims, but it is good for a small area.
I just ordered today a 240 watt LED from Gotham Hydro. There are a lot of decent grows on here with people using them.
Click to expand...
Those Blackstars look great... and I just noticed that GH has Euro locations! Thanks for the recommendation. I also found this helpful YouTube clip for the other LED n00bs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jszZ2GuRmR8

Green Inferno said:
I don't think this one will put out as much as a 400 watt HM or 300 watts worth of HPS. The coverage is 4-6 square feet for
the 240 watt. They have a 500 watt one, the actual wattage it draws is a little over 300 watts. Maybe check that one out.
Click to expand...
The coverage area is advertised as 3X3 for the model I listed, so I assumed the "400 HM/300HPS equivalent" is within the actual coverage area, not beyond. IE: coverage area = smaller, but equivalent within it, while a 300watt HPS would have a larger coverage area. If that makes sense.

I take it this is incorrect?

Green Inferno said:
I'm sure a few others will chime in with their recommendations. And some will even tell you to not use LEDs because they think they suck.
Do the research, and decide for yourself what sucks or not. Someone saying they suck with nothing to back it up doesn't mean they actually suck.
Click to expand...
Everyone told me CFLs “suck” and I pulled over 2oz off my first grow, so… hehe I’m always up for researching and trying new things! Thanks again.

UPDATE: I asked the manufacturer for any specifics that impact growth, and they confirmed that yields with LEDs ('in general') tend to be about 15% less than HPS. However, the energy savings and low-heat make them attractive to a variety of users. I guess I fall into that category, for the heat issue. I’ve read that HPS is basically a mini-heater, and very unfriendly to tent-grows unless you have the ability to circulate enough cool air.
 
Kingrow1

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
Whats the penetration depth of the usefull light for 500w led or similar, with flouros i get about 12 inches of usefull light, big cfl's about 20 inches or so and i know hps is quite a lot more so how do leds stack up against them? I am impressed by what i have seen so far but still struggling to justify needing them.
 
luciferateme

luciferateme

Active Member
i use the 90w 6 band gotham, i think its a great light for veg. which is what its designed for, the light from it though is nothing like the spread of light you get from a hps/mh. i cant speak about the flowering models cos i never used one. the only thing i can say to you is dont believe a lot of the stuff they put on the sites that sell the lights. it you ever say to yourself "no way", then its probably sales propaganda. also if i remember rightly, the 3w leds dont give out 3 times the light output of the 1w leds, i could be wrong ut im sure thats what i remember.
i just looked on gotham and each light they are selling says the leds have een upgraded a number of times so the technology keeps getting better. but that would make me want to wait, as i would not want to spend 700 quid on a light and the leds are gonna be updated in six months, dont think they should be singing that from the rooftops. if you defo want to go down the led route im sure youll be happy with it and if you get the 120w im sure it would be fine for 2-3 plants, you can always put a cfl in the bottom like you said.
good luck with it.
 
D

davoswavos

Active Member
IMHO Led's get bad rep because the sellers make outrageous claims if they told it how it was not one person would be let down right? but as far as facts go it would appear that if you know what your doing then you can grow more grams per watt with led then with hps and when its all said and done that is what counts right? and this is before factoring in the added heat from hps wich would be an issue with me I'd need ac almost always running and that dries out the air so then add in a humidifier damn my power bill would be jacked.
 
Kingrow1

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
Green Inferno said:
Different lights will work for different growers. I am a noob, and I am a technology junky, and I have seen the LEDs work.
So I will learn with LEDs. Once I have a few practice grows in with my 90 watt and my 240 watt, I will be getting three 500
watt LEDs. That should keep me smoking and happy indefinitely.

I am not an LED salesman, my feeling won't get hurt if someone decides to not get LEDs. Whatever will work for that persons
situation, is what they should get. If your situation calls for a 1000 HPS, get that. If it calls for CFLs, get those. If it calls for
a flash light, get that. Or, even just on the grounds on what you want. There is a world of choices out there.

Happy growing!
Click to expand...
Yer ok you can grow with LED's but i would definatly yeild more with other lights, this thread is way old now but i am of the thinking that i wouldnt bother with LED's over the simplicity of other lights.

Go get your 500watt panel and id rather a 400w Hps, would still out perform LED's anyday. There is still a way to go before growers like LED's. Growing with stronger lights seems more satisfying for me, daily growth and my plants, as for yeild i dont see how it could be more. Peace
 
Kingrow1

Kingrow1

Well-Known Member
LED has no penetration whatsoever and grows slow plants, it is not yet at the point of being usefull and we all know it. Yes it will grow but no a small 18w cfl will do more watt for watt. Peace
 
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