Lens and Reflector Optics for COB

What Optics do you use in your DIY Lamp

  • No Optics

    Votes: 132 45.4%

  • Glass Lens

    Votes: 58 19.9%

  • Reflector

    Votes: 118 40.5%

  • Silicone Lens

    Votes: 23 7.9%

  • Other

    Votes: 6 2.1%
  • Total voters
    291
robincnn

robincnn

Well-Known Member
Optics for COB

I posted some charts earlier here
https://www.rollitup.org/t/how-to-plot-ppf-chart-with-quantum-sensors-for-led-light-comparison.881113/
They give a good estimate. However the corner values were not correct as sensor has to be in vertical position and not aimed towards the light source.
Also no data for reflective areas.

Test setup
I had a better setup than last time and the Apogee sensor was kept vertical. No corrections have been made to the date. Raw data. Not multiplied or divided by any correction factor.
Open area measurements.
For reflective sides test 2X2.5 tent with small elevated platform with nice green canopy.:weed:
1.jpg

Optics tested
1) No Optics
2) Kingbrite 80 lens 100mm
3) Kingbrite 120 lens 100mm
4) Ledil Stella FN14074_STELLA-HB CXA/B 3590 72 deg HighBay 93 %
5) Ledil Angelina F13838_ANGELINA-XW CXA/B 3590 90 deg Wide 94 %

Kingbrite new reflector was not available so may be next time.

Please feel free to add your review/opinion for any other lens you may have tried like 77mm glass or your own DIY reflector.

Edit:
I bought a sample of 90 degree 100mm glass lens on ebay and it was identical to Jerry's 120 lens. These Chinese lens may be little different between each sellers.
Use http://www.findchips.com/ to find who has optics/other parts in stock.
 
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robincnn

robincnn

Well-Known Member
Please feel free to post your opinion if you can draw any conclusions from these charts.

CXB 3590 COB without optics.
upload_2015-12-22_10-22-54.png
An ideal optics would
1) Provide even coverage
2) No hotspot in center and more diffused light
3) no losses
4) cheep and easy to install
5) does not increase Tc

For open area COB with no optics we see smaller numbers as the light spreads and test area is small. The light that spread gets lost unless you have more plants on the side.
So for a large grow space the photons may hit leaves somewhere but on corners the light will be lost. Small non reflective spaces would lose a lot of light as well.

Kingbrite 80 glass lens performs very similar to LEDIL ANGELINA reflector.
LEDIL ANGELINA is plastic and weights much less than Kingbrite 80 glass lens.
Kingbrite 80 and 120 lens covers the COB. LEDIL ANGELINA reflector leaves LES exposed.
I did not test the F13671_ANGE-RZ-LENS that covers the ANGELINA reflector to protect LES. F13671_ANGE-RZ-LENS should give the same pattern with losses of 5%-7%. It will also raise case temperature a little.

The Ledil Stella was not easy to test. It has a very narrow beam so important to maintain distance between cobs. Distance from canopy important too due to strong beam in center. Not exactly DIY friendly, beam too narrow and expensive too. Very important to have it centered.

Another lens that can be used is KB 120 lens. This lens has a flat base so the lens in close to LES.
It will not work with ideal COB holder . It will work on Vero 29, 3590 should be fine with this holder and BJB for 3070 or any other low profile holder.
This lens is worth mentioning as it does not have a strong center and the coverage is wider and most even.

Looks like LEDIL ANGELINA reflector is a great choice. Easy to install and nice coverage.
Lens are good too but not as easy to install. Lens are good option if you want to cover the LES.

EDIT:
My cheat sheet for ANGELINA reflector. Please let me know if you see any errors

Vero 29 - Solder or use 'Pico-EZmate™ Harness for Bridgelux Vero'
upload_2015-12-22_12-56-13.png

CXB 3590 - No solder, Push connect

upload_2015-12-22_12-57-54.png

CXB 3070 - No solder, Push connect
upload_2015-12-22_13-0-57.png

CXB 3070 - Solder needed
Note FCN14983_ANGELINA-XW will also work
FCN14983_ANGELINA-XW = F13838_ANGELINA-XW + C14036_CLAMP-CXA25-30
upload_2015-12-22_13-3-59.png

CXB 3070 - With BJB -Push connect - stranded could be an issue but solid wire works
Note the reflector part number is not same.
@Greengenes707 Thanks for update that these will work as well 47.319.2154 for 20awg, 47.319.2155 for 18awg. BJB will sells these soon.
These can be bought at http://www.pacificlightconcepts.com
upload_2015-12-22_13-10-11.png

F13671_ANGE-RZ-LENS can be inserted into reflector to cover COB. It will have it additional 5%-7% losses
upload_2015-12-22_13-19-39.png



KB 80 and KB 120
upload_2015-12-22_13-32-10.png
lens holder with 4 mount holes
upload_2015-12-22_13-34-38.png

Note 120KB will not work with ideal COB holder. see pic it leaves a little over 5mm gap.
It will work on Vero 29, 3590 should be fine with this holder
BJB for 3070 or C14036_CLAMP-CXA25-30 or any other low profile holder.
KB 90 works fine with ideal COB holder.
upload_2015-12-22_14-25-48.png
 
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robincnn

robincnn

Well-Known Member
alesh said:
Good job!
Do you still have Khatod lens # PL1845SR ? I would love to see its testing with 3590.
Click to expand...
Tested with Vero 29 earlier and It spreads the light too much. LES size is similar for 3590 and Vero 29 so i did not expect different results. Khatod not so much DIY friendly and easily available so did not test again.
Will try to test next time along with Jerry's new reflector.
 
P

PurpleBuz

Well-Known Member
robincnn said:
Please feel free to post your opinion if you can draw any conclusions from these charts.

The Ledil Stella was not easy to test. It has a very narrow beam so important to maintain distance between cobs. Distance from canopy important too due to strong beam in center.
Not exactly DIY friendly, beam too narrow and expensive too.
.
Click to expand...

this test confirms my suspicions on the stella, beam is a little too tight, usefull mostly along walkways or closely spaced cobs.
I did notice that the stella published data, shows it functions better with smaller les cobs (less center focused) apparently it pushes the light from the outer part of the les to the center, and the center to the outer part of the beam. Might be better with a cxb3070 or a vero18

khatod does have a 90 degree circular silicon lens, might be worth testing.

Thanks for the great usefull data. much appreciated.
 
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alesh

alesh

Well-Known Member
robincnn said:
Tested with Vero 29 earlier and It spreads the light too much. LES size is similar for 3590 and Vero 29 so i did not expect different results. Khatod not so much DIY friendly and easily available so did not test again.
Will try to test next time along with Jerry's new reflector.
Click to expand...
I like the spread. Why isn't it DIY friendly?
Got quoted 9.64EUR for the lens and 1.71EUR for the frame, MOQ 30 pcs.
 
alesh

alesh

Well-Known Member
Greengenes707 said:
MOQ of 30 is the non DIY friendly part from my perception.
Click to expand...
I agree.
But the next build should be around 30 COBs so I could consider them as a possibility. I really like the spread and that they'd cover the COB completely. But there's not much info and @robincnn seems like he didn't like them very much. So I'm trying to gather as much info as possible. They're not cheap, too.
 
P

PurpleBuz

Well-Known Member
Stephenj37826

Stephenj37826

Well-Known Member
robincnn said:
Tested with Vero 29 earlier and It spreads the light too much. LES size is similar for 3590 and Vero 29 so i did not expect different results. Khatod not so much DIY friendly and easily available so did not test again.
Will try to test next time along with Jerry's new reflector.
Click to expand...
Where did you get your khatod? I bought 8 for testing from Verical.
 
testiclees

testiclees

Well-Known Member
Can anyone tell me the make of the magnetic glass lenses that optic use(d) and how they might fit into the values shown above?

many thanks
 
robincnn

robincnn

Well-Known Member
bassman999 said:
I have to say I wasnt in favor of lenses nor reflectors till I saw the KB120 measured data.
It has more edge light in a 2x2 that raw cab, without too much hot-spoting
Click to expand...
I like the KB120 too. Will give a try.

testiclees said:
Can anyone tell me the make of the magnetic glass lenses that optic use(d) and how they might fit into the values shown above?
many thanks
Click to expand...
magnetic glass lenses? no clue will have to lookup
 
robincnn

robincnn

Well-Known Member
alesh said:
I like the spread. Why isn't it DIY friendly?
Click to expand...
Khatod has to be centered properly. Routing wire to COB is something to give a thought. Have to check with them for holder compatibility. They have their own holder for Vero i think.
Then the COB on heasink may have to be recessed a little, they mentioned.
If you do not get it centered or mounted at incorrect height then it will make coverage uneven. So not DIY friendly for most. But for you it is DIY Friendly.

@alesh with Khatod 120 degree batwing type PL1845SR. The center point intensity drops to as 1/3 of what it is without any lens.
Which means the COB will have to come at like 8 inches or less from canopy. May be even less if you are running low currents for efficiency. 6 to 8 inches COB height from canopy seems wrong, it could lack penetration.
Looks like a perfect optic if you want to get real close or even inside/under the canopy.

@alesh @PurpleBuz
My old chart of Khatod 90 PL1825SR was wrong. As i said they are not DIY or kapton friendly.
The lens was loose so the center was too strong. I tested it again recently.
PL1825SR if installed properly will give results very similar to Kingbrite 120. Just better because the center will be even less hot and coverage will be more even and slightly stronger.
Khatod 90 PL1825SR seems the best optic to me if you can install it right. Will try them later, for now KB 120, 90 and reflector as they are cheaper, easy to use and because slightly more light in center is not a big issue specially if cobs are spaced apart evenly.

Stephenj37826 said:
Where did you get your khatod? I bought 8 for testing from Verical.
Click to expand...
You can contact khatod from their website. They should give you a sample if they have it in stock. Which one are you testing.

Great khatod in stock with Verical PL1825SR 90 degree $11.21ea with 9 min order. @Growmau5 if you do not like those heavy KB 80 lens and still want to cover LES then give them a try in your next project.
 
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alesh

alesh

Well-Known Member
robincnn said:
Khatod has to be centered properly. Routing wire to COB is something to give a thought. Have to check with them for holder compatibility. They have their own holder for Vero i think.
Then the COB on heasink may have to be reassessed a little, they mentioned.
If you do not get it centered or have it mounted at proper height then it will make coverage uneven. So not DIY friendly for most. But for you it is DIY Friendly.

@alesh with Khatod 120 degree batwing type PL1845SR. The center point intensity drops to as 1/3 of what it is without any lens.
Which means the COB will have to come at like 8 inches or less from canopy. May be even less if you are running low currents for efficiency. 6 to 8 inches COB height from canopy seems wrong, it could lack penetration.
Looks like a perfect optic if you want to get real close or even inside/under the canopy.

@alesh @PurpleBuz
My old chart of Khatod 90 PL1825SR was wrong. As i said they are not DIY or kapton friendly.
The lens was loose so the center was too strong. I tested it again recently.
PL1825SR if installed properly will give results very similar to Kingbrite 120. Just better because the center will be even less hot and coverage will be more even and slightly stronger.
Khatod 90 PL1825SR seems the best optic to me if you can install it right. Will try them later, for now KB 120, 90 and reflector as they are cheaper, easy to use and because slightly more light in center is not a big issue specially if cobs are spaced apart evenly.


You can contact khatod from their website. They should give you a sample if they have it in stock. Which one are you testing.

Great khatod in stock with Verical PL1825SR 90 degree $11.21ea with 9 min order. @Growmau5 if you do not like those heavy KB 80 lens and still want to cover LES then give them a try in your next project.
Click to expand...
Great info thanks.
 
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