Meijiu MJ-650 Alibaba LED vs Nanoluxx 1K DE HPS. Side by Side Experiment

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newbplantgrower420

Well-Known Member
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Going to try to journal my side by side grow since some of you on here were interested. I do ebb and flow so Im pretty hands off. I just check if everything is going smoothly and do my topoffs and water changes. I usually just let the crop do its thing in bloom. Anything significant like when buds start forming and ripening etc Ill document on here.

LEDs are Meijiu 650s vouched by bk78 and a few others on this forum are on my middle 4x8. Rest of this room is with 1KW Nanoluxx DE HPS.

Brand new DE bulbs fully loaded for this experiment.

Going to keep temps just a tad over 80F. I think that should do for the LEDs. Its a Co2 supplemented rm.

Going to be giving same nutrients. Its all the same strain. Skywalker OG. Ill adjust the nutrients to LEDs if i see any deficiencies.

The 4x8 tray with the LEDs was my strongest tray last run. It had 2 DE HPS fixtures and it pulled just under 6 lbs. My other trays didnt pull as well....they pulled 2per light... not sure why it was so low...but thats not important. Im going to be comparing this LED tray to the other trays this run and my previous run.

18 6x6x6 Grodan hugos per 4x8 tray. Ebb and flow. Fully sealed and Co2 supplemented rm. Plants were vegged and trained for 8 weeks.

2 MJ 650s per 4x8 tray and 2 DE Fixtures per 4x8.

The LEDs are ~22 inches away from the top of the canopy. Ill try to bring it ~15in depending on the stretch these next few days for maximum light.

Im going to try these lights for a few runs and see how it fares. My goal is to hit 2.5per light with them. Ive read about people hitting 3+ with fluences and gavitas online so its a reasonable goal considering that this Alibaba LED is pretty much the same specs. If I can hit that Ill fully transition to these strip LEDs and be done with DE fixtures for good. I usually hit anywhere from ~2.0-2.5 per light with DE so if I can accomplish the same with LEDs thats a win win for me.

Im a DE HPS grower from the start thats just tired of changing expensive bulbs every few runs and my high electricity bill. So Im rooting for the LED to beat the DE in yield.

Its not a scientific experiment but I have to get some info on this lights potential before coughing up thousands of dollars to fully transition this bloom rm to all LEDs. Hence this experiment.

Let the battle begin.
 
JoeBlow5823

JoeBlow5823

Well-Known Member
newbplantgrower420 said:
View attachment 4646653

View attachment 4646654
Going to try to journal my side by side grow since some of you on here were interested. I do ebb and flow so Im pretty hands off. I just check if everything is going smoothly and do my topoffs and water changes. I usually just let the crop do its thing in bloom. Anything significant like when buds start forming and ripening etc Ill document on here.

LEDs are Meijiu 650s vouched by bk78 and a few others on this forum are on my middle 4x8. Rest of this room is with 1KW Nanoluxx DE HPS.

Brand new DE bulbs fully loaded for this experiment.

Going to keep temps just a tad over 80F. I think that should do for the LEDs. Its a Co2 supplemented rm.

Going to be giving same nutrients. Its all the same strain. Skywalker OG. Ill adjust the nutrients to LEDs if i see any deficiencies.

The 4x8 tray with the LEDs was my strongest tray last run. It had 2 DE HPS fixtures and it pulled just under 6 lbs. My other trays didnt pull as well....they pulled 2per light... not sure why it was so low...but thats not important. Im going to be comparing this LED tray to the other trays this run and my previous run.

18 6x6x6 Grodan hugos per 4x8 tray. Ebb and flow. Fully sealed and Co2 supplemented rm. Plants were vegged and trained for 8 weeks.

2 MJ 650s per 4x8 tray and 2 DE Fixtures per 4x8.

The LEDs are ~22 inches away from the top of the canopy. Ill try to bring it ~15in depending on the stretch these next few days for maximum light.

Im going to try these lights for a few runs and see how it fares. My goal is to hit 2.5per light with them. Ive read about people hitting 3+ with fluences and gavitas online so its a reasonable goal considering that this Alibaba LED is pretty much the same specs. If I can hit that Ill fully transition to these strip LEDs and be done with DE fixtures for good. I usually hit anywhere from ~2.0-2.5 per light with DE so if I can accomplish the same with LEDs thats a win win for me.

Im a DE HPS grower from the start thats just tired of changing expensive bulbs every few runs and my high electricity bill. So Im rooting for the LED to beat the DE in yield.

Its not a scientific experiment but I have to get some info on this lights potential before coughing up thousands of dollars to fully transition this bloom rm to all LEDs. Hence this experiment.

Let the battle begin.
Click to expand...
This will be interesting. Wish you had ran philips or gavita bulbs but it will be a good comparison.
 
N

newbplantgrower420

Well-Known Member
JoeBlow5823 said:
This will be interesting. Wish you had ran philips or gavita bulbs but it will be a good comparison.
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Im running majority Ushios,1 philips, and 1 hortilux Hydroshop was out of Philips. Thats usually what I run but most of the top of the line bulbs put out the same amt of light and the very similar red heavy spectrum from my understanding.
 
P

piratebug

Well-Known Member
That is not really a fair comparison, and why are your HID(s) so high up? Anyway, LED(s) are much more efficient than HID(s) so you don't even need to use 1/2 of the LED watts to match a HID running double those LED watts. Seriously... you would be much better off running a equally distributed maximum of 480 watts overhead and then run some lower angled side lighting to give your plants more penetrating lighting because LED(s) are simply not that great at doing that like HID(s) are. Yeah, I have been there and done that, so I know running anymore than 480 overhead LED watts using samsung tech in a 4 x 4 space amounts to nothing more than one wasting energy on unneeded lighting watts that won't get them anymore bud unless they are willing to heat that room up, just a wee bit, and then run some co2 in there!
 
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Kassiopeija

Kassiopeija

Well-Known Member
Hello,
newbplantgrower420 said:
The 4x8 tray with the LEDs was my strongest tray last run. It had 2 DE HPS fixtures and it pulled just under 6 lbs. My other trays didnt pull as well....they pulled 2per light... not sure why it was so low...but thats not important. Im going to be comparing this LED tray to the other trays this run and my previous run.
Click to expand...
so you pulled 50% more @ the middle row when running all the same lights but you think this isn't important... in a SBS?
 
JoeBlow5823

JoeBlow5823

Well-Known Member
piratebug said:
That is not really a fair comparison, and why are your HID(s) so high up? Anyway, LED(s) are much more efficient than HID(s) so you don't even need to use 1/2 of the LED watts to match a HID running double those LED watts. Seriously... you would be much better off running a equally distributed maximum of 480 watts overhead and then run some lower angled side lighting to give your plants more penetrating lighting because LED(s) are simply not that great at doing that like HID(s) are. Yeah, I have been there and done that, so I know running anymore than 480 overhead LED watts using samsung tech in a 4 x 4 space amounts to nothing more than one wasting energy on unneeded lighting watts that won't get them anymore bud unless they are willing to heat that room up, just a wee bit, and then run some co2 in there!
Click to expand...
The only way to run a open fixture double ended HPS is up high. You really dont seem to actually know much about HID lights or high power growing. 1000w of double ended power for a 4x4 area is REALLY pushing the limits as well. As he said, the room is SEALED RUNNING CO2. This guy is comparing MAX output of both HPS and LED side by side and it looks to me he really knows what he is doing. I dont think he has any interest in fucking around with a bunch of side lighting everywhere. The only issue with the experiment is that there will be a decent amount of cross lighting/reflected light but in the end the scale doesn't lie; If there is a major discrepancy in weight between HPS and LED, then one is a pretty clear winner.
 
N

newbplantgrower420

Well-Known Member
Kassiopeija said:
Hello,

so you pulled 50% more @ the middle row when running all the same lights but you think this isn't important... in a SBS?
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it is important. i shouldve put the LEDs on one of the side trays now that u guys mention crosslighting. ill do that for sure next run since Im going to give these lights a shot for a few runs.

the middle tray even with LEDs should pull the most yield again if crosslighting is the reason for the 50% yield increase. Will it give ~6 again? We'll see.
 
JoeBlow5823

JoeBlow5823

Well-Known Member
newbplantgrower420 said:
it is important. i shouldve put the LEDs on one of the side trays now that u guys mention crosslighting. ill do that for sure next run since Im going to give these lights a shot for a few runs.

the middle tray even with LEDs should pull the most yield again if crosslighting is the reason for the 50% yield increase. Will it give ~6 again? We'll see.
Click to expand...
Yeah keep playing with things, see what happens.
 
Rocket Soul

Rocket Soul

Well-Known Member
newbplantgrower420 said:
it is important. i shouldve put the LEDs on one of the side trays now that u guys mention crosslighting. ill do that for sure next run since Im going to give these lights a shot for a few runs.

the middle tray even with LEDs should pull the most yield again if crosslighting is the reason for the 50% yield increase. Will it give ~6 again? We'll see.
Click to expand...
What temps/rh would you run? You know leds like it hot and DE likes it cold, right? But maybe with crosslighting/heatimg this can be worked around.
 
JoeBlow5823

JoeBlow5823

Well-Known Member
Rocket Soul said:
What temps/rh would you run? You know leds like it hot and DE likes it cold, right? But maybe with crosslighting/heatimg this can be worked around.
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This is another important factor....

Doesnt look like dividing the room in two is an option though.
 
N

newbplantgrower420

Well-Known Member
Rocket Soul said:
What temps/rh would you run? You know leds like it hot and DE likes it cold, right? But maybe with crosslighting/heatimg this can be worked around.
Click to expand...
I keep my DE rms at 76-81F daytime. 55 RH which I drop to 50 when it starts budding. Then 45 late in flower.

Im thinking of bumping the temps up slightly to 80+ with 85F being the absolute max. Ill keep RH the same.

Ive tested growing this strain exactly 2 runs ago in this same room at 90+F with co2 and it turned out pretty good yield wise. Only problem was it was the bud came out pretty hairy. So theyll tolerate 85F fine.

What do you LED pros think? Any suggestions?
 
Keesje

Keesje

Well-Known Member
I love experiments.
But an experiment must pursue a goal.
By hanging 2 different light sources in 1 tent, the outcome will not be very clear.
These light sources are so different that they each require a different climate.
They need other values - for example temperature - to perform at their best.
So to be able to determine the difference properly, you should create 2 independent spaces.

Which is not to say that I will enjoy following this topic.
 
JoeBlow5823

JoeBlow5823

Well-Known Member
Keesje said:
I love experiments.
But an experiment must pursue a goal.
By hanging 2 different light sources in 1 tent, the outcome will not be very clear.
These light sources are so different that they each require a different climate.
They need other values - for example temperature - to perform at their best.
So to be able to determine the difference properly, you should create 2 independent spaces.

Which is not to say that I will enjoy following this topic.
Click to expand...
This is not a tent. This is like a 8 foot x 12 foot room. But the other variables are valid points.
 
Keesje

Keesje

Well-Known Member
It is the same as a tent. So it doesn't make any difference for the statements I made.
 
JoeBlow5823

JoeBlow5823

Well-Known Member
Keesje said:
It is the same as a tent. So it doesn't make any difference for the statements I made.
Click to expand...
I know. To be a truly perfect comparison it needs to be divided and ideal conditions in both spaces. BUT he is running high temps and CO2 so it is somewhat fair. Cross lighting is the biggest issue at that point. I think if yields are drastically different between the lights, that is something to go on.... Would at least help in deciding whether to stick to HPS or change to LED. Im also worried the fans are cooling the bulbs to much in those open reflectors... A cold double end HPS has a severely reduced output
 
Keesje

Keesje

Well-Known Member
I think if you would check VPD the right way (so including the leaf temperature) you will see that on one of the sides of the room, the VPD is higher or lower then optimum. So that can have a huge impact on how the plants will develop.
Which will not say much about the light being used, but more about that this particular light source was not optimal for that enviroment.
 
N

newbplantgrower420

Well-Known Member
I got 1 area to work with and this is it lol. Going to have make it work even if its not ideal just for the sake of getting some info on what kind of quality and yield this LED creates vs the DE.

Ill try to keep the temps in the middleground for both DE and LED which I think is above 80F daytime. I think Im going to bump the RH to ~65% and try to keep it there at least for early flower. I usually ditch the VPD chart after flip but Ill try to follow it for the LEDs sake.

I have good air circulation so Im not too worried about PM hitting.
 
N

newbplantgrower420

Well-Known Member
Update

Day 20 After Flip

Led
5B404006-5C82-4C05-A97E-18DF8F527287.jpeg

HPS
EAF1C950-1EDE-4126-9E79-E01BDAF303FB.jpeg

So far they look about even nug wise as far as my eye can tell.

Temps under LEDs are ~80F peaking at 82-83. Under the DE HPS its getting 83ish peaking at 86F cause of the scorching hot DE bulbs. RH Im keeping 55% now til the end.

Feeding ~2.5EC with the 2 part MC. I see some Calcium deficiencies under the LEDs. Going to fix that by adding a little more Calcium Nitrate than recommended by MC. Their 2 part ratios always cause me problems with this strain even under DE

So far so good for the LEDs. Same nug size as the DE but less power. My only concern now is how well or how worse the LED lights are going to penetrate compared to the DE.
 
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