to flush or not to flush???

Flush or don't flush

  • Flush

    Votes: 14 58.3%
  • Don't flush

    Votes: 10 41.7%

  • Total voters
    24
  • Poll closed .

goatslayer

Active Member
:cuss: This seems to be a personal preferance but I don't want chemically tasting weed or the pop and fizzle when I burn a bowl, but on the opposite end I don't want to drown my girls either. So what should I do I used advanced nutrients in sunshine organics soil and lightly nuted, I still have 96+% of my 1 liter bottles of nutes. So would I be ok just using distilled water the last 2 weeks or do I have to flush??? Just don't want to fuck this up they are looking pretty good.

https://www.rollitup.org/grow-journals/280460-first-grow-600watt-mover-6.html
 

goatslayer

Active Member
I thought running 3x the volume of the soil with water was flushing??? i.e 3 gal pots = 9 gal of water for flush. I would prefer to just water with distilled till the end it would be cheaper, I buy all my water. I know I need to get an ro but not till I finish this round. Plus I'm afraid of drowning them 9 gal is a lot of water I only use 3 quarts for watering as a gal has too much run off.
 

mcpurple

Well-Known Member
I thought running 3x the volume of the soil with water was flushing??? i.e 3 gal pots = 9 gal of water for flush. I would prefer to just water with distilled till the end it would be cheaper, I buy all my water. I know I need to get an ro but not till I finish this round. Plus I'm afraid of drowning them 9 gal is a lot of water I only use 3 quarts for watering as a gal has too much run off.
you are right im usin 5 gallon pot so i would flush with 15, 2 weeks before harvest and then just water with straight water till harvest, and i does kinda drown the plant u will notice it will droop a bit after u flush but in about a day it will be normal, i just flushed mine a few days ago, and it drooped for about 6 hours,:bigjoint:
 

goatslayer

Active Member
Would it be ok without the 9 gal through the 3 gal pots part and just run say 1 and a half gal through them 2 weeks out then use water only???
 

mcpurple

Well-Known Member
i would at least run 3 gallons of water through 2 weeks before harvest then every watering after is just water, is their a reason u dont want to flush with 9
 

mcpurple

Well-Known Member
u will thank ur selfif u do it propperly the buds will taste much better i made the mistake of not doin it on my last grow and itwas dank bud but i could taste the ferts and it sparked and crackled becuz the ferts
 

goatslayer

Active Member
Just have'nt had them droop or nothing since my nute burn in the very begining so just want them to be happy and healthy. The yellow girl that I got turned yellow after a buddy told me he was watering with 1 gal a plant and I figured I'd try it on one and oh shit it turned yellow, gave it some extra grow and it greened up a bit but still I'm sure it affected it some way looks like a beatiful tree but it's still pretty yellow.
 

lightsgreenaction

Well-Known Member
I say two weeks out you water a little heavy (like 1.5 or 2 times as much as normal) without nutes. Then continue to use no nutes the rest of the time. The plants should use up the remaining nutes and not have a bad taste or popping
from left over nutes...

I don't use more nutes than necessary though, so a flush is less necessary maybe for me.
 

mcpurple

Well-Known Member
well im not telling u what to do just giving advice, so either u take it or dont, but do whatever u want to do, and see for your self it takes trial and error to figure most things out for ur self hope all gos well with ur plants keep em green
 

TANDY

Member
i just feed plain water on the last feed and let it dry right out before the chop.

good taste is all in the cure!!!
 

goatslayer

Active Member
Well sheeit I still don't know what to do I think I'm gonna ph 5 gal of tap water (Damn it) run that through then run a gal of distilled to wash out any chlorine or whatever bullshit is in tap water.
 

mcpurple

Well-Known Member
i just feed plain water on the last feed and let it dry right out before the chop.

taste is all in the cure!!!
thats not even considered a flush, and i wouldnt recomend someone doin this as their flush,

Well sheeit I still don't know what to do I think I'm gonna ph 5 gal of tap water (Damn it) run that through then run a gal of distilled to wash out any chlorine or whatever bullshit is in tap water.
if u want the chlorine and stuff out fill 5 milk jusg full of water leave lids off and let it sit for 24 hours before use and most the chlorine will be gone i do 48 hours of the lid off if not lonfger but 24 hours will work, most every thing will be evaporated and u dont have to by water just use this method works great my water comes out smellin like bleach almost and once it sits open over night it has no smell and tatstes much better:bigjoint: hope that helps
 

mr.red

Well-Known Member
I go all organic and NEVER flush.

To paraphrase an issue of Treating Yourself: You never see farmers "flushing" their fields with 3x the amount of water.. that's called a flood and is NOT good.

If you are doing things naturally, things such as flushing are not required

bongsmilie
 

mcpurple

Well-Known Member
I go all organic and NEVER flush.

To paraphrase an issue of Treating Yourself: You never see farmers "flushing" their fields with 3x the amount of water.. that's called a flood and is NOT good.

If you are doing things naturally, things such as flushing are not required

bongsmilie

thats cuz farmers dont giva a hoot about what were consuming as long as their makin money and they dont want to to flush cuz it takes time and money for them, also i know growers who are all organic and still flush, and in a feild of crops 3x the amount of water wouldnt really be that much it would be like a rain cloud passin over wich happens all the time to crops in cali and oregon, like i said do what u think u should do its all up to u:bigjoint: oh and also since your usin mg and i beleive it has timerelased nutes, so ya i would definitly flush
 

FlyLikeAnEagle

Well-Known Member
Pre harvest flushing is a controversial topic. Flushing is supposed to improve taste of the final bud by either giving only pure water, clearing solutions or extensive flushing for the last 7-14 days of flowering. While many growers claim a positive effect, others deny any positive influence or even suggest reduced yield and quality.

The theory of pre harvest flushing is to remove nutrients from the grow medium/root zone. A lack of nutrients creates a deficiency, forcing the plant to translocate and use up its internal nutrient compounds.

Nutrient fundamentals and uptake:

Until recently it was common thought that all nutrients are absorbed by plant roots as ions of mineral elements. However in newer studies more and more evidence emerged that additionally plant roots are capable of taking up complex organic molecules like amino acids directly thus bypassing the mineralization process.

The major nutrient uptake processes are:

1) Active transport mechanism into root hairs (the plant has to put energy in it, ATP driven) which is selective to some degree. This is one way the plant (being immobile) can adjust to the environment.

2) Passive transport (diffusion) through symplast to endodermis.

http://www.biol.sc.edu/courses/bio102/f99-3637.html

http://www.hort.wisc.edu/cran/Publications/2001 Proceedings/min_nutr.pdf

The claim only ‘chemical’ ferted plants need to be flushed should be taken with a grain of salt. Organic and synthetic ferted plants take up mineral ions alike, probably to a different degree though. Many influences play key roles in the taste and flavor of the final bud, like the nutrition balance and strength throughout the entire life cycle of the plant, the drying and curing process and other environmental conditions.

3) Active transport mechanism of organic molecules into root hairs via endocytosis.

http://acd.ucar.edu/~eholland/encyc6.html

Here is a simplified overview of nutrient functions:

Nitrogen is needed to build chlorophyll, amino acids, and proteins. Phosphorus is necessary for photosynthesis and other growth processes. Potassium is utilized to form sugar and starch and to activate enzymes. Magnesium also plays a role in activating enzymes and is part of chlorophyll. Calcium is used during cell growth and division and is part of the cell wall. Sulfur is part of amino acids and proteins.

Plants also require trace elements, which include boron, chlorine, copper, iron, manganese, sodium, zinc, molybdenum, nickel, cobalt, and silicon.

Copper, iron, and manganese are used in photosynthesis. Molybdenum, nickel, and cobalt are necessary for the movement of nitrogen in the plant. Boron is important for reproduction, while chlorine stimulates root growth and development. Sodium benefits the movement of water within the plant and zinc is neeeded for enzymes and used in auxins (organic plant hormones). Finally, silicon helps to build tough cell walls for better heat and drought tolerance.

You can get an idea from this how closely all the essential elements are involved in the many metabolic processes within the plant, often relying on each other.

Nutrient movement and mobility inside the plant:

Besides endocytosis, there are two major pathways inside the plant, the xylem and the phloem. When water and minerals are absorbed by plant roots, these substances must be transported up to the plant's stems and leaves for photosynthesis and further metabolic processes. This upward transport happens in the xylem. While the xylem is able to transport organic compounds, the phloem is much more adapted to do so.

The organic compounds thus originating in the leaves have to be moved throughout the plant, upwards and downwards, to where they are needed. This transport happens in the phloem. Compounds that are moving through the phloem are mostly:
Sugars as sugary saps, organic nitrogen compounds (amino acids and amides, ureides and legumes), hormones and proteins.

Not all nutrient compounds are moveable within the plant.

1) N, P, K, Mg and S are considered mobile: they can move up and down the plant in both xylem and phloem.
Deficiency appears on old leaves first.

2) Ca, Fe, Zn, Mo, B, Cu, Mn are considered immobile: they only move up the plant in the xylem.
Deficiency appears on new leaves first.


Storage organelles:

Salts and organic metabolites can be stored in storage organelles. The most important storage organelle is the vacuole, which can contribute up to 90% of the cell volume. The majority of compounds found in the vacuole are sugars, polysaccharides, organic acids and proteins though.


Translocation:

Now that the basics are explained, we can take a look at the translocation process. It should be already clear that only mobile elements can be translocated through the phloem. Immobile elements cant be translocated and are not more available to the plant for further metabolic processes and new plant growth.

Since flushing (in theory) induces a nutrient deficiency in the rootzone, the translocation process aids in the plants survival. Translocation is transportation of assimilates through the phloem from source (a net exporter of assimilate) to sink (a net importer of assimilate). Sources are mostly mature fan leaves and sinks are mostly apical meristems, lateral meristem, fruit, seed and developing leaves etc.

You can see this by the yellowing and later dying of the mature fan leaves from the second day on after flushing started. Developing leaves, bud leaves and calyxes don’t serve as sources, they are sinks. Changes in those plant parts are due to the deficient immobile elements which start to indicate on new growth first.

Unfortunately, several metabolic processes are unable to take place anymore since other elements needed are no longer available (the immobile ones). This includes processes where nitrogen and phosphorus, which have likely the most impact on taste, are involved.

For example nitrogen: usually plants use nitrogen to form plant proteins. Enzyme systems rapidly reduce nitrate-N (NO3-) to compounds that are used to build amino-nitrogen which is the basis for amino acids. Amino acids are building blocks for proteins, most of them are plant enzymes responsible for all the chemical changes important for plant growth.

Sulfur and calcium among others have major roles in production and activating of proteins, thereby decreasing nitrate within the plant. Excess nitrate within the plant may result from unbalanced nutrition rather than an excess of nitrogen.

Summary:

Preharvest flushing puts the plant(s) under serious stress. The plant has to deal with nutrient deficiencies in a very important part of its cycle. Strong changes in the amount of dissolved substances in the root-zone stress the roots, possibly to the point of direct physical damage to them. Many immobile elements are no more available for further metabolic processes. We are loosing the fan leaves and damage will show likely on new growth as well.

The grower should react in an educated way to the plant needs. Excessive, deficient or unbalanced levels should be avoided regardless the nutrient source. Nutrient levels should be gradually adjusted to the lesser needs in later flowering. Stress factors should be limited as far as possible. If that is accomplished throughout the entire life cycle, there shouldn’t be any excessive nutrient compounds in the plants tissue. It doesn’t sound likely to the author that you can correct growing errors (significant lower mobile nutrient compound levels) with preharvest flushing.

Drying and curing (when done right) on the other hand have proved (In many studies) to have a major impact on taste and flavour, by breaking down chlorophylls and converting starches into sugars. Most attributes blamed on unflushed buds may be the result of unbalanced nutrition and/or overfert and unproper drying/curing.
 

goatslayer

Active Member
Thanks flylikeaneagle I used my nutes very lightly 1/4 to 1/3 strength so I am going to flush lightly if at all I am still debating. I am thinking that since I nuted lightly I could run 1 to 1.5 gal of distilled water every watering with the same effect as flushing without the stress on my girls, like I said they are beatifull trees now and swelling every day. I am worried that if I flush they will wilt for a day or two then lose fast growth due to nutrient loss. Uncle ben on this forum has been my advice to take to heart since he takes a scientific aproach and seems he thinks flushing is a myth so like I said I will probably just water heavy then report my results to help others. I have a super good pot sense( I see tons of good pot) so I'll tell yall when I'm dry how she tastes. On anther note shit I'm out smoking on my ash tray fuck, hard to be out when you got a room full of dank, won't chop early though that seems to be the most common mistake around here premature bullshit.
 
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