That's a load off my mind...

[Beefbisquit]

The universe is estimated to be roughly 13 or 14 billions of years old, thats a finite amount of time. The only way our universe could be any older is if there was a big collapse of the "old" universe, where the "old" universe had an implosion on itself. And God only knows how many cycles the universe went through if this theory is true.

The estimate is based on the observable universe.

Even if the universe always existed in one form or another, why do you need to take God out of the equation?

Because god is unproven, and the most likely scenario is the one that makes the least amount of assumptions. In this case, the explanation that doesn't make the assumption that god exists is more likely.

Im also skeptical of God but I leave a possibility for Him because of this creation that we all live in. God to Me is just another way of saying the Highest Power, for all I know God could be an alien or computer or something else all together, but there is a Highest Power in the universe, whatever it may be.

Why bother redefining god to mean alien or highest power? It's pretty clear that 'god' is meant to refer to a supernatural force, not an alien.

Thats right, God could be natural or God could be supernatural, regardless, God is just the Highest Power to Me.



Before there was a big bang, there was a singularity, everything was CREATED from the singularity, right? I believe it had to have been created at one point in time, even if it was a seemingly infinite time ago.

All matter and energy was part of the singularity. Saying it was created by the singularity implies intention, which isn't the case. You believe the singularity was created? Why? What evidence do you have for this assertion? Just believing it for the sake of believing it is a dumb reason.

You have seen the types of things I post, and I believe what I say so there are no lies but maybe some mistakes.

I dont want to start a religion, but I do want to start a new Spirituality.

I just want to know what are the chances or probality of My facts and claims, if true indeed.

People should only believe in Me because they have seen My evidence for themselves, and they have used logic and discernment to find the truth.

But there are a spectrum of outcomes, either I could have no witnesses in the future or the whole world could witness Me, or anywhere in between. It doesnt matter to Me much, as long as I do My best.

But most religions start out very small, with only a few followers. Religions usually start from one man, and then it grows.

My Words speak for themself.

~PEACE~

They sure do.

[video=youtube;1D5Sa2Yq-2g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1D5Sa2Yq-2g[/video]

 

[Nevaeh420]

The estimate is based on the observable universe.

The key word there is the OBSERVABLE universe.

The universe is so big that we cant even see how big it really is? What if it goes on forever?

How do we know how big the universe is if we cant even see it all?

Because god is unproven, and the most likely scenario is the one that makes the least amount of assumptions. In this case, the explanation that doesn't make the assumption that god exists is more likely.

You may be right Beef, God is unproven. Thats why Im an Agnostic, Im right either way, if God is real or not.

I just dont see how you dont see a design to creation.

How could everything come from nothing?

Why bother redefining god to mean alien or highest power? It's pretty clear that 'god' is meant to refer to a supernatural force, not an alien.

All Im saying is that there is a Highest Power in the universe, whether it be an alien or computer or something totally different, I dont know what. That Highest Power deserves My respect, whatever it might be. Maybe we will never know the Highest Power because of the vastness of the universe, but there still is One. There has to be a Being (or computer) thats Greater then all the rest.

Do you agree on that Beef?

All matter and energy was part of the singularity. Saying it was created by the singularity implies intention, which isn't the case. You believe the singularity was created? Why? What evidence do you have for this assertion? Just believing it for the sake of believing it is a dumb reason.

Everything in our known universe came from the singularity. I think its safe to say that the singularity created everything... but what created the singularity? Was it a natural cause? If so, what natural cause, causes singularities?

They sure do.

[video=youtube;1D5Sa2Yq-2g]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1D5Sa2Yq-2g[/video]

I guess Im the clown now?

I have surely put on a show. I hope I have entertained some people.

I just want everyone to be happy, content, sheltered, fed and quenched, joyful and full of Truth. Basically I want to first meet everyones needs and then fulfill their dreams, but Who am I? Can you blame Me for My aspirations?

What do you want to do Beef?

~PEACE~

 

[cannabineer]

The point about the "observable" universe is acute.
The observable universe has three spatial dimensions and one directional temporal one.
But our best math points to this being a limited slice embedded in many more, including other temporal dimensions.
They're a part of us, even as we don't (yet!) have the tools to tease a look into them.

At that point, with us no longer confined to lineal, directional time (which is likely a spuria of our very limited dimensional awareness) Eternity being the infinite Now will become physics, and studiable as such. Jmo.

 

[Beefbisquit]

The key word there is the OBSERVABLE universe.

Yes, observable. The only way we can make forensic science work is with evidence.

The universe is so big that we cant even see how big it really is? What if it goes on forever?

What if it goes on forever, and has existed forever?

How do we know how big the universe is if we cant even see it all?

That's why we make the best estimate possible based on the available evidence.

You may be right Beef, God is unproven. Thats why Im an Agnostic, Im right either way, if God is real or not.

I just dont see how you dont see a design to creation.

Because I have trained my mind to see past false patterns. That's why. You, have not.

How could everything come from nothing?

No one ever said everything came from nothing. That's a strawman argument (a logical fallacy). That might be how you imagine it happening in your mind, but that doesn't mean that's how it happened. You are suggesting that the laws of thermodynamics are being violated, and I am not.

When someone says something along the lines of, "That can't be true because I can't imagine it happening" (which is what you're saying with you're statement about creation 'coming from nothing'), it's called an argument from incredulity.

This is another logical fallacy, one that I've trained my mind not to make/fall prey to. If you want any form of respect regarding your ideas, make sure you don't make logical fallacies.

If your ideas don't make logical sense, they're probably wrong, and further more not deserving of praise/worship/adherence/listening to/giving them the time of day....

All Im saying is that there is a Highest Power in the universe, whether it be an alien or computer or something totally different, I dont know what. That Highest Power deserves My respect, whatever it might be.

How do you know there is a higher power? How do you know we're not the highest power?

Maybe we will never know the Highest Power because of the vastness of the universe, but there still is One. There has to be a Being (or computer) thats Greater then all the rest.

Do you agree on that Beef?

No. There is no evidence to support that idea. There may or may not be extraterrestrial life, and it may or may not be more advanced than we are.

Everything in our known universe came from the singularity. I think its safe to say that the singularity created everything... but what created the singularity? Was it a natural cause? If so, what natural cause, causes singularities?

Creation implies intelligence. That's like saying a lake 'created' a whirlpool. Well, not really - it formed in the lake from currents and other conditions, but it wasn't created/invented/designed by the lake.

I guess Im the clown now?

You get a gold star.

I have surely put on a show. I hope I have entertained some people.

I just want everyone to be happy, content, sheltered, fed and quenched, joyful and full of Truth. Basically I want to first meet everyones needs and then fulfill their dreams, but Who am I? Can you blame Me for My aspirations?

What do you want to do Beef?

~PEACE~

I want to be Chef.

 

[Nevaeh420]

Yes, observable. The only way we can make forensic science work is with evidence.



What if it goes on forever, and has existed forever?



That's why we make the best estimate possible based on the available evidence.




Because I have trained my mind to see past false patterns. That's why. You, have not.



No one ever said everything came from nothing. That's a strawman argument (a logical fallacy). That might be how you imagine it happening in your mind, but that doesn't mean that's how it happened. You are suggesting that the laws of thermodynamics are being violated, and I am not.

When someone says something along the lines of, "That can't be true because I can't imagine it happening" (which is what you're saying with you're statement about creation 'coming from nothing'), it's called an argument from incredulity.

This is another logical fallacy, one that I've trained my mind not to make/fall prey to. If you want any form of respect regarding your ideas, make sure you don't make logical fallacies.

If your ideas don't make logical sense, they're probably wrong, and further more not deserving of praise/worship/adherence/listening to/giving them the time of day....



How do you know there is a higher power? How do you know we're not the highest power?


No. There is no evidence to support that idea. There may or may not be extraterrestrial life, and it may or may not be more advanced than we are.






Creation implies intelligence. That's like saying a lake 'created' a whirlpool. Well, not really - it formed in the lake from currents and other conditions, but it wasn't created/invented/designed by the lake.



You get a gold star.



I want to be Chef.

Youre a scholar and a gentleman, Beef.

Im going to agree to disagree on some notions. Im not saying your wrong but I would rather believe in the things that make the most sense to Me. I could be wrong, but Im okay with that.

For example, Im going to continue to believe that the universe was created; and Im going to assume that some of the aliens are smarter then us. It just makes logical sense to Me.

But I commend you for being so scientific. Thats all.

~PEACE~

 

[Beefbisquit]

Youre a scholar and a gentleman, Beef.

Im going to agree to disagree on some notions. Im not saying your wrong but I would rather believe in the things that make the most sense to Me. I could be wrong, but Im okay with that.

For example, Im going to continue to believe that the universe was created; and Im going to assume that some of the aliens are smarter then us. It just makes logical sense to Me.

But I commend you for being so scientific. Thats all.

~PEACE~

It might make sense to you, but it's not logical sense.

Logic follows a specific set of rules.

 

[K J]

My beliefs are also similar to the Popes beliefs. I also belive that there is no sin besides disobeying your conscience. Atheists are just obeying their own logic, intuition and conscience, so why wouldnt God allow them into heaven for doing what they believe is right?

People should never be forced to believe anything contrary to their intuition and conscience, and that includes the belief in God. Threating or damning people to hell is just a scare tactic by the religious people, trying to convert you to their beliefs.

But who is the Pope that anyone should listen to him?- hes just an elected official like all the other Popes that tried to speak for God. How do we KNOW hes even sent by God?- we dont know. I believe Jesus said in the Bible, "There is only One Teacher, and that is Christ" or something like that.

~PEACE~

Genuine question, what about psychopaths that have no conscience? One hand they seem to be about as evil as it gets but on the other is it fair to punish somebody for being broken?

 

[Nevaeh420]

Genuine question, what about psychopaths that have no conscience? One hand they seem to be about as evil as it gets but on the other is it fair to punish somebody for being broken?

The law punishes people, not God.

I believe there will be a final judgment, by God, after you die. Most people will be reincarnated to a life full of felicity, born again into paradise; but the very few people that continually disobeyed their intuition and conscience will never be born again or reincarnated into paradise. This is Gods judgment.

So candidly, if you believe youre doing the right thing then you will be born again into paradise; but if you continually do the things you believe are wrong then you are danger of never seeing paradise.

I dont believe God will judge you until after you die. But the law will punish you if you break the law and get caught.

If you dont have a conscience then I dont believe God will judge you, but most people, if not every person, has a conscience. Usually if youre conscious, you have a conscience.

This is what I believe, I could be wrong about God but this seems like what a just God would do.

Just always be on your best behavior and you will be golden.

~PEACE~

 

[Beefbisquit]

The law punishes people, not God.

I believe there will be a final judgment, by God, after you die. Most people will be reincarnated to a life full of felicity, born again into paradise; but the very few people that continually disobeyed their intuition and conscience will never be born again or reincarnated into paradise. This is Gods judgment.

So candidly, if you believe youre doing the right thing then you will be born again into paradise; but if you continually do the things you believe are wrong then you are danger of never seeing paradise.

You never answered the question. What about psychopaths who don't have a conscience? How could god punish someone for going against what would normally be the voice of a conscience, when they hear no voice at all? What about babies? They don't have language skills, therefore no conscience. What about people in vegetative states?

I dont believe God will judge you until after you die. But the law will punish you if you break the law and get caught.

If you dont have a conscience then I dont believe God will judge you, but most people, if not every person, has a conscience. Usually if youre conscious, you have a conscience.

This is what I believe, I could be wrong about God but this seems like what a just God would do.

Just always be on your best behavior and you will be golden.

~PEACE~

My best behavior? Your best behavior, or gods best behavior? Who's best behavior should I act on? What if me and you have a different idea of what is right and wrong? If all we have to do is follow our conscience, then how can two people feel differently about the same action, and be given different consequences by god for acting the same way?

Boy A doens't think steal is bad.
Boy B thinks stealing is bad.

Both boys steal, god punishes Boy B because it goes against his conscience and lets Boy A reincarnate because he followed his conscience? Doesn't make sense.