Official greenhorn

jartlow

jartlow

Well-Known Member
Hey everyone. I've been studying for months on growing. I picked up ed rosenthal's grower's handbook as well as reading online. I've tried to answer my own questions and develop my own idea on my garden. I'm posting here to get some input. My garden will be soil based at this time. I'm also pretty sure I want to keep my plants at 4 or under.

I purchased my seeds from the single seed centre. I ordered a huge variety of all femininized seeds. I did receive one free seed that was an auto flower.

I'm looking to build my box 4' long x 4' wide x 6' tall. Eventually I'd like to have the two chamber setup for seedlings and clones but I want to master growing first.

So far I have come up with several things I need, mind you some of the minor things may be missing but I was hoping to get some input on my overall idea and product selection.

1. Soil medium.. I'm stuck with this one, I read recommendations just to see later on something totally different. From what I understand I need a peat-based soil that contains nothing but peat, lime, and perlite for the seedling stage. After 3 weeks transplant pots and use a soil such as foxfarms.

2. Fertilizer, honestly I have no idea but I keep seeing foxfarms as well.

3. 150 CFM Phresh filters odor eliminator. 4" flange for $73.56(greners.com)

4. 175 CFM Vortex powerfans 4" flange for $121.39(greners.com) *the 4" will be used as the exhaust for the box with the Phresh filter.*☆note☆ the possible light I'm looking to buy is air cooled with a 6" flange. If I decide to buy this light I'm curious to know if I would need to buy two more of these fans with 6" flanges to circulate air through the light; or would 1 exhaust fan be enough to pull air throw without an intake(for the light cooling).

5. This light is the one I'm mentioning for the extra fan. http://www.greners.com/i/grow-lights/hoods-reflectors/radiant-ac-reflector-with-6-flange.html
I'm just curious if I am missing something better. I also found a light that has both 600w MH and HPS included, however it isn't air cooled.
http://www.virtualsunhydroponics.com/virtual-sun-600-watt-hps-mh-digital-ballast-grow-light-kit

6. Obviously a intake fan and fine filter, pots, etc... I did read that a green CFL should be left on 24/7 so I believe I'll be buying one of those as well.

I'm no expert but it's hard trying to discover everything on your own. I appreciate everyones' help with my grow op. Thank you


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Nizza

Nizza

Well-Known Member
1) I like happy frog. this has humics and earth worm castings, as well as myco's. If you're really worried about burning the seedlings you can do as said, but i wanted to mention I don't use FFOF because it doesn't use lime as a buffer, it uses oyster shell
2) I like dyna gro foliage pro. The happy frog will have enough nutes in it, depending on how i do transplanting. First, I plant them in dixie cups, and give them a little rapid start rooting enhancer for the first watering. the rapid start (gen hydro) has willow tree bark extract, alfalfa extract, and kelp extract. I only use this once when planted and again each transplant. I moisten the soil with a little water, then give it a little of the rapid start mixture. I avoid using any of the dyna gro because it may effect microbials, so when I believe the plant needs more nutes I upp it to a bigger container, the fresh soil takes care of it.
3) Don't use the carbon filter till flower unless you want it to go bad fast. The higher humidity that some people run in veg will clog up the filter quick, so it's advised to use it when flowering (if it's not too smelly in veg) I recommend using a regular filter on the air intake to keep dust levels down, this will in turn keep the light, leaves, and reflective material less dusty resulting in more light
4) I don't really like air cooled lights with the glass in between. IMO it's much better to get control over the heat, like don't mix the intake and exhaust air, and do whatever you can to get the light as close as you need it without the glass. It's okay though to extract the heat straight from the fixture if you like that idea
5) Imo the ultimate purpose of air cooled lights is that you can seal off the grow and add co2, and seperate the heat from the lights on it's own air loop. If i ever used co2 i'd probably do this.
6) Don't worry about the green CFL or any of that crap.. If you're reeally super interested in this get a green LED light at the right wavelength so that you don't interrupt photoperiod. The green party bulbs are used for emergencies and should be avoided

I didn't see a timer mentioned, make sure you buy a heavy duty one... I really like the programmable one's that are digital with the built in battery, they cost a little more but it's worth it. You do need to run the exhaust 24/7 though because the plants need fresh air at night

I recommend a soil thermometer, also. A lot of people overlook soil temps and it is key to healthy plants, keep them between 60-70 (67-68 optimal) and your plants will blow up! Things that govern root temps are water temperature used when watering, how insulated the pots are (( I really like air pruner pots, or smart pots))


hope I helped and thank you for taking the time to actually ask the right questions!
 
prosperian

prosperian

Well-Known Member
Looks like a pretty good list. Glad to read that you have done some homework.

1. Soil medium.. I'm stuck with this one, I read recommendations just to see later on something totally different. From what I understand I need a peat-based soil that contains nothing but peat, lime, and perlite for the seedling stage. After 3 weeks transplant pots and use a soil such as foxfarms.

My first grow was bagged organic soil mixed with perlite and mushroom compost at equal parts. Now I use organic potting soil from Roots Organics. Has everything in the soil. I cook the soil for 30 days before use on 2 week old plants. Cooking = throwing the bags into a plastic container with good drainage, add water and put the lid back on it loosely. This soil requires no feeding through the entire grow, just transplanting fresh soil during veg period. I use the other soil for seedlings.

2. Fertilizer, honestly I have no idea but I keep seeing foxfarms as well.

Don't use it anymore. Everything I need is already in the soil - EWC, Bat Guano, Seaweed, and several more organic amendments. When I strated I used Roots Organics Buddha Grow and Bloom.

3. 150 CFM Phresh filters odor eliminator. 4" flange for $73.56(greners.com)

Sounds like my setup. Phresh is the best.

4. 175 CFM Vortex powerfans 4" flange for $121.39(greners.com) *the 4" will be used as the exhaust for the box with the Phresh filter.*☆note☆ the possible light I'm looking to buy is air cooled with a 6" flange. If I decide to buy this light I'm curious to know if I would need to buy two more of these fans with 6" flanges to circulate air through the light; or would 1 exhaust fan be enough to pull air throw without an intake(for the light cooling).

Similar to mine. I use a Rebel inline with a variable speed controller. Don't forget about that.

5. This light is the one I'm mentioning for the extra fan. http://www.greners.com/i/grow-lights/hoods-reflectors/radiant-ac-reflector-with-6-flange.html
I'm just curious if I am missing something better. I also found a light that has both 600w MH and HPS included, however it isn't air cooled.
http://www.virtualsunhydroponics.com/virtual-sun-600-watt-hps-mh-digital-ballast-grow-light-kit

I've seen both those fixtures used successfully by growers. I prefer the closed fixture so the heat be extracted from the grow room easily. I ran a 400w Cool Tube. I have upgraded to LED Area 51 SGS-160.

6. Obviously a intake fan and fine filter, pots, etc... I did read that a green CFL should be left on 24/7 so I believe I'll be buying one of those as well.

Don't think that's necessary, but when in the grow at lights out you want a green spectrum bulb. I've run just a regular cfl for 15 minutes and taking pics with flash and have had no negative impact ont he plants. It's not like it's perfectly dark in nature.

I'm no expert but it's hard trying to discover everything on your own. I appreciate everyones' help with my grow op. Thank you

You won't get it all from us, reading books, or watching videos, not even half. You have to learn by doing.

My advice. Keep a grow journal and calendar. Write down everything and refer to it on future grows. After a couple you will have everything dialed in. Don't get frustrated or impatient. Gardening requires time.
You can check my entire grow start to finish at my sig. line. Good luck!
 
jartlow

jartlow

Well-Known Member
Thank you for your time and help!

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jartlow

jartlow

Well-Known Member
prosperian said:
Looks like a pretty good list. Glad to read that you have done some homework.

1. Soil medium.. I'm stuck with this one, I read recommendations just to see later on something totally different. From what I understand I need a peat-based soil that contains nothing but peat, lime, and perlite for the seedling stage. After 3 weeks transplant pots and use a soil such as foxfarms.

My first grow was bagged organic soil mixed with perlite and mushroom compost at equal parts. Now I use organic potting soil from Roots Organics. Has everything in the soil. I cook the soil for 30 days before use on 2 week old plants. Cooking = throwing the bags into a plastic container with good drainage, add water and put the lid back on it loosely. This soil requires no feeding through the entire grow, just transplanting fresh soil during veg period. I use the other soil for seedlings.

2. Fertilizer, honestly I have no idea but I keep seeing foxfarms as well.

Don't use it anymore. Everything I need is already in the soil - EWC, Bat Guano, Seaweed, and several more organic amendments. When I strated I used Roots Organics Buddha Grow and Bloom.

3. 150 CFM Phresh filters odor eliminator. 4" flange for $73.56(greners.com)

Sounds like my setup. Phresh is the best.

4. 175 CFM Vortex powerfans 4" flange for $121.39(greners.com) *the 4" will be used as the exhaust for the box with the Phresh filter.*☆note☆ the possible light I'm looking to buy is air cooled with a 6" flange. If I decide to buy this light I'm curious to know if I would need to buy two more of these fans with 6" flanges to circulate air through the light; or would 1 exhaust fan be enough to pull air throw without an intake(for the light cooling).

Similar to mine. I use a Rebel inline with a variable speed controller. Don't forget about that.

5. This light is the one I'm mentioning for the extra fan. http://www.greners.com/i/grow-lights/hoods-reflectors/radiant-ac-reflector-with-6-flange.html
I'm just curious if I am missing something better. I also found a light that has both 600w MH and HPS included, however it isn't air cooled.
http://www.virtualsunhydroponics.com/virtual-sun-600-watt-hps-mh-digital-ballast-grow-light-kit

I've seen both those fixtures used successfully by growers. I prefer the closed fixture so the heat be extracted from the grow room easily. I ran a 400w Cool Tube. I have upgraded to LED Area 51 SGS-160.

6. Obviously a intake fan and fine filter, pots, etc... I did read that a green CFL should be left on 24/7 so I believe I'll be buying one of those as well.

Don't think that's necessary, but when in the grow at lights out you want a green spectrum bulb. I've run just a regular cfl for 15 minutes and taking pics with flash and have had no negative impact ont he plants. It's not like it's perfectly dark in nature.

I'm no expert but it's hard trying to discover everything on your own. I appreciate everyones' help with my grow op. Thank you

You won't get it all from us, reading books, or watching videos, not even half. You have to learn by doing.

My advice. Keep a grow journal and calendar. Write down everything and refer to it on future grows. After a couple you will have everything dialed in. Don't get frustrated or impatient. Gardening requires time.
You can check my entire grow start to finish at my sig. line. Good luck!
Click to expand...
You mentioned LED.. I posted about this in the lights forum. As a complete beginner should I buy LED or stick with my mh/hps combo?



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prosperian

prosperian

Well-Known Member
jartlow said:
You mentioned LED.. I posted about this in the lights forum. As a complete beginner should I buy LED or stick with my mh/hps combo?Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Rollitup mobile app
Click to expand...
I'm not a big believer in dropping a ton of money into this hobby until you know you're going to doing it for a long time.

If you have a small grow, LED is a great solution. But in my opinion, this kind of tech needs to be in experienced hands. I learned on a 400w HID, and I used that knowledge to help me be successful with LED. Not that you can't start out that way, but most the help out there is going to come from HID and CFL users. LED is really new and expensive.

If you caught one of my other posts yesterday, I really break down the costs of LED vs HID in detail. LED wins.

Here is the link.
 
jartlow

jartlow

Well-Known Member
prosperian said:
I'm not a big believer in dropping a ton of money into this hobby until you know you're going to doing it for a long time.

If you have a small grow, LED is a great solution. But in my opinion, this kind of tech needs to be in experienced hands. I learned on a 400w HID, and I used that knowledge to help me be successful with LED. Not that you can't start out that way, but most the help out there is going to come from HID and CFL users. LED is really new and expensive.

If you caught one of my other posts yesterday, I really break down the costs of LED vs HID in detail. LED wins.

Here is the link.
Click to expand...
Excellent, thanks for the link! I hate to spend the money on the hid 600w setup if instead I could spend it on LED and also save money as far as light cooling goes and my electricity bill. What LED lights would you recommend for my growing space to get maximum yield? Also with LED what do I need; fans, ducts, timers, etc..?

With LED do I manually adjust the color spectrum? If so do they come with the programs or would I need to buy something like that? I'm sorry for all the questions, I just want to have my ducks in a row.

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prosperian

prosperian

Well-Known Member
The decision you need to make, is how much bud do you need per grow. Then work backwards into the equipment that meets that goal. Let me know if you have more questions. Happy to help.

4'x4'x6' I'd use to SGS-160 or SGS-190 from Area 51. These have 100% Cree Leds. Website: http://area51lighting.com/ I worked with Jeff there and he's excellent at responding to questions.

My 160 covers 2' x 3' at 18" for max penetration and coverage. You can squeeze out 3' x 3' but you will lose some of the intensity on the edges. You can make that up with cfl or fluro side lighting.

I was able to get 5 plants in my last 2 x 3 grow with 5 gal fabric pots. What you need to decide is how much grow space do you need in tent based on how many plants you have to grow. I did use supplemental lighting on the sides and down below. Some cheap t8 fluros did the job and kept things green down below a thick canopy of leaves.

Obviously there are several quality LED manufacturers. I spent 4 months researching and following trusted LED growers before making the move to LED. See my sig. for a documented LED grow, warn you now, it's a long thread.
 
jartlow

jartlow

Well-Known Member
I plan on growing about 4-5 plants at a time(flowering/vegs) I'm not doing a two chamber set up yet. End goal I'd like to have a two chamber set up though. Realistically I'm just wanting a good yield. I really don't have a minimum however the more the better.

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BigEasy1

BigEasy1

Well-Known Member
I started out with an LED. It took me a few grows but I got 80 grams trimmed, dried and cured off my last auto.
 
prosperian

prosperian

Well-Known Member
Well, you can get 4-5 plants with an 8 week veg under one LED panel.

But it would take some topping, lst-ing, and maybe a scrog.

You will see all those trimming techniques in my last grow "LED GROW" to hit my 364 grams of potent bud.

Next time I might try fewer plants and my challenge is to get close to the same yield.

I see growers do it on here all the time. They go from a lot buckets to one or two.

Only problem I see is less variety and the veg period is extended.
 
jartlow

jartlow

Well-Known Member
prosperian said:
Well, you can get 4-5 plants with an 8 week veg under one LED panel.

But it would take some topping, lst-ing, and maybe a scrog.

You will see all those trimming techniques in my last grow "LED GROW" to hit my 364 grams of potent bud.

Next time I might try fewer plants and my challenge is to get close to the same yield.

I see growers do it on here all the time. They go from a lot buckets to one or two.

Only problem I see is less variety and the veg period is extended.
Click to expand...
From what I read I should expect 250 -660g using a 600w HPS.. should I not expect the same with a good LED ?

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prosperian

prosperian

Well-Known Member
jartlow said:
From what I read I should expect 250 -660g using a 600w HPS.. should I not expect the same with a good LED ?
Click to expand...

Yeah, my little 155w hits on the low side of that range. Bump up the wattage or add a second panel and you can hit on the high side, like in the 600s.

Only thing really capping your production is floor space. You will run out of room before you run out of light.
 
prosperian

prosperian

Well-Known Member
I didn't see the coverage area on their website. You might cruise over to the LED section of RIU.

There you can find a lot of good info on what to look for when buying LED.

Unfortunately, it's a lot more than just watts that factor into a good led panel.
 
jartlow

jartlow

Well-Known Member
prosperian said:
I didn't see the coverage area on their website. You might cruise over to the LED section of RIU.

There you can find a lot of good info on what to look for when buying LED.

Unfortunately, it's a lot more than just watts that factor into a good led panel.
Click to expand...
What about light spectrum? Will it need adjusted?

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