Growing with LED's, What the fuck is the problem? an what fucking light to buy?

smokefacekillah

smokefacekillah

Well-Known Member
So I ventured off into the LED section, an I don't know what advice to follow, considering every thread I find turns into a debate on if they work or not.

I want to buy an LED grow light, but again misinformation has thrown me off, Some say don't buy the cheap Chinese kind, which is kind of odd cause when I looked at some real expensive LED'S they all mostly say Made in china, or some parts came from china.

I don't know what the fuck to look for when it comes to LED's, I found good lights with the right spectrum for growing, most of them at 3w per diodes, but they are made in china lights off of eBay.

Who here can help me out?
 
D

Devilspawn

Well-Known Member
I went w brand named mfg here in us like black star and magnum and have been very happy but I'm prob 18 mo behind the markets latest. In so far as Chinese eBay panels there is a difference between 3 watt diodes and 3 w chipsets where they put a few together. The wattage per diode is steadily increasing and prices are dropping. It used to be u had to have cree or bridgelux diodes to be sure you were getting what u paid for. Make sure you size your lights footprint to the mfg specs. I am over lighting my cab with a 357 magnum Gen2 and it more than does the trick
 
Abiqua

Abiqua

Well-Known Member
How much do you want to spend?

How big of a space?

Veg and flower or just flower?


The problem with ebay chinese is that their quality is essentially unqualified. Who checks it? Warranty's suck, diode and wattage are lied about constantly. But there are some out their that work.

Most of the what is recommended in the LED forums, the companies have taken the time, researched wavelengths, power capacity, all this bullshit and then give you a [most of them] a pretty good warranty and track record.

I myself, said fuck it and built my own out of quality bulbs that share some of the diodes that panels have. Cree and Phillips. and 3 light bathroom fixtures.

I can customize and it brings it for 3.5 sq. ft lol.

:peace:
 
Banana444

Banana444

Well-Known Member
I was in the same boat about 2 months ago. I even have 3 electronics classes under my belt. I went hid and im not looking back. I still want an led light, but they seem to be a growers toy. A hobby light, so to speak. Its developing tech and has yet to really overtake. The Hans panel seems to be one of the best out there for something you can buy and plug right in. But cost and coverage, hid beats it short term. Leds will def overtake the market at some point but we are just not quite there, at least for me, just quite yet, im holding off. Im sure if I get some extra dough in my pocket I will be quick to pull the trigger on something...just waiting...lurking.
 
Ghrimm

Ghrimm

Active Member
Check out my grow journal. Im using 3 300w china LEDs. Spend about $300 on all of the via ebay.
 
goatlicker

goatlicker

Well-Known Member
I've grown with a 90watt ufo led and they do okay for veg but when it comes to flower don't quite have enough power. I now run a area 51 XGS 190 led and they are the fucken shit put politely Lol, extremely good light.
 
A

althor

Well-Known Member
HEY! For 1200 dollars YOU CAN GET THE SAME RESULTS that you could get from a 300 dollar HID.

Why anyone pays 4x the price for a light that even states that it is comparable to a light 1/4th the price is ridiculous to me.
If I pay 4x or 3x or even 2x the price, I expect 2x or 3x or 4x the end results. Yet LED will tell you, you pay 4x the price and get the same result as the 300 dollar light and people run out and BUY that shit.
 
prosperian

prosperian

Well-Known Member
OK let me break down my LED grow and shed a little light on this, hah. I don't want to debate the subject of LED vs HID, but these were my results and you guys know I document everything. I respect a lot of the growers on here that use HID. What works for you is all that matters. I just don't want people spreading the wrong information without using real facts.

My Area 51 160w LED was $500. GPW 1.65
MY HID "System" was $550. GPW .65

My HID "System" 400w + Cool Tube + MH Bulb + HPS Bulb + Fixture Exhaust Tubes, Conectors + 180 CFM Inline Fan + Variable Speed Controller + Extra Oscillating Fans + high heat sensor cut off (for fire in case the fan quits), well you get the idea,it adds up!



I pulled the exhaust system completely out of my closet for the HID heat extraction and enclosed light fixture. This removed an inline fan, ducting, variable controller, heat sensors, and most important stopped the house air conditioning from running all the time. The air exchange system now runs at 15% power with on and off cycling. Before with HID ran at 90% power all the time lights were on.

You can imagine how much money I'm saving when it's 100 degrees outside and my home a/c is trying to keep the temps at 73 degrees. With the HID "System" the a/c didn't shut off until the lights went out. I couldn't see wasting all that money by having cool air sucked out of the house from my grow closet.



If we are going to use something simplistic like GPW (grams per watt) I more than doubled mine by tossing the 400w HID and going to a 160w LED. Yes, I had some other things factor in to my LED GPW like better soil, and three additional weeks of veg time.

Bottom line, I was able to maintain, actually improve my harvest weight on LED. Averaged 2.6 oz per plant - five plants in my last grow. I was at 2.25 oz per plant on HID. Biggest change is of course the electricity. I consume 88% less electricity without sacrificing yield and no bulb replacement, yay.







So, you have to figure more than acquisition costs when making an investment into efficient technology. My GPW went from .65 to 1.65, not that GPW should be used to measure your results, but most old timers, especially HID users use this number. I think once you factor in operating cost the decision becomes really clear for a small grower. Spend some money now, and save every day as you operate the grow.

In my opinion, high quality LED lighting is worth the money in the right hands.

 
I

IGROWLED

Member
smokefacekillah said:
So I ventured off into the LED section, an I don't know what advice to follow, considering every thread I find turns into a debate on if they work or not.

I want to buy an LED grow light, but again misinformation has thrown me off, Some say don't buy the cheap Chinese kind, which is kind of odd cause when I looked at some real expensive LED'S they all mostly say Made in china, or some parts came from china.

I don't know what the fuck to look for when it comes to LED's, I found good lights with the right spectrum for growing, most of them at 3w per diodes, but they are made in china lights off of eBay.

Who here can help me out?
Click to expand...

Check this place out. This is where ive been buying my led grow lights, They advertise the Actual wattage, Are a US company, Offer good warranties, And have everything from bargain lights to high end specialty systems. Led grow lights definitely work well as long as you have at least like 35 Actual watts per plant. You have to watch it with most companies because they will sell you a "500 watt led grow light" but it will actually only put out about 50% of that. People get scammed and end up under-powering the grow and get crappy results which gives led grow lights a bad rep. http://www.evolutiongrowled.com/shop-evolution.html#!/~/category/id=0&inview=product30692070&offset=0&sort=normal
 
smokefacekillah

smokefacekillah

Well-Known Member
Ghrimm said:
Check out my grow journal. Im using 3 300w china LEDs. Spend about $300 on all of the via ebay.
Click to expand...
do you have a link or the specs for those lights, that's kinda what I been looking at but I'm not sure there is so many of them that look the same
 
smokefacekillah

smokefacekillah

Well-Known Member
ohh and I'm working on a small grow area here is a pic of what I have in the box now and the cfls I have
I Have 8 cfls 2x 42w 6x23w CFL's 2 of the 23watters are 5000K, I just need a small Panel cause no matter what I'm going to use Cfl's as side lighting cause that's what my box is set up for
 

Attachments

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greatbranch

Well-Known Member
prosperian said:
OK let me break down my LED grow and shed a little light on this, hah. I don't want to debate the subject of LED vs HID, but these were my results and you guys know I document everything. I respect a lot of the growers on here that use HID. What works for you is all that matters. I just don't want people spreading the wrong information without using real facts.

My Area 51 160w LED was $500. GPW 1.65
MY HID "System" was $550. GPW .65

My HID "System" 400w + Cool Tube + MH Bulb + HPS Bulb + Fixture Exhaust Tubes, Conectors + 180 CFM Inline Fan + Variable Speed Controller + Extra Oscillating Fans + high heat sensor cut off (for fire in case the fan quits), well you get the idea,it adds up!



I pulled the exhaust system completely out of my closet for the HID heat extraction and enclosed light fixture. This removed an inline fan, ducting, variable controller, heat sensors, and most important stopped the house air conditioning from running all the time. The air exchange system now runs at 15% power with on and off cycling. Before with HID ran at 90% power all the time lights were on.

You can imagine how much money I'm saving when it's 100 degrees outside and my home a/c is trying to keep the temps at 73 degrees. With the HID "System" the a/c didn't shut off until the lights went out. I couldn't see wasting all that money by having cool air sucked out of the house from my grow closet.

If we are going to use something simplistic like GPW (grams per watt) I more than doubled mine by tossing the 400w HID and going to a 160w LED. Yes, I had some other things factor in to my LED GPW like better soil, and three additional weeks of veg time.

Bottom line, I was able to maintain, actually improve my harvest weight on LED. Averaged 2.6 oz per plant - five plants in my last grow. I was at 2.25 oz per plant on HID. Biggest change is of course the electricity. I consume 88% less electricity without sacrificing yield and no bulb replacement, yay.


So, you have to figure more than acquisition costs when making an investment into efficient technology. My GPW went from .65 to 1.65, not that GPW should be used to measure your results, but most old timers, especially HID users use this number. I think once you factor in operating cost the decision becomes really clear for a small grower. Spend some money now, and save every day as you operate the grow.

In my opinion, high quality LED lighting is worth the money in the right hands.
Click to expand...
Way to spread the gospel, Prosperian! :bigjoint:
 
prosperian

prosperian

Well-Known Member
greatbranch said:
Way to spread the gospel, Prosperian! :bigjoint:
Click to expand...
Lot of bad information out there brother, even on RIU. Let's face it, bunch of kids on here burning up their plants with HID and sucking up our natural resources.

I watched a documentary on electricity consumption by illegal grows in America recently. We suck up a lot of electricity, specifically HID growers.

When led finally saturates the market, the prices will go down as will our carbon footprint. Until then, you have to take a big breath and open up your wallet real wide for the latest high tech gear.

There I go again, preachin'. :joint:
 
Pinworm

Pinworm

Well-Known Member
prosperian said:
Lot of bad information out there brother, even on RIU. Let's face it, bunch of kids on here burning up their plants with HID and sucking up our natural resources.

I watched a documentary on electricity consumption by illegal grows in America recently. We suck up a lot of electricity, specifically HID growers.

When led finally saturates the market, the prices will go down as will our carbon footprint. Until then, you have to take a big breath and open up your wallet real wide for the latest high tech gear.

There I go again, preachin'. :joint:
Click to expand...
Preaching? Nah - Just hooking up the community with awesome (essential) info.

Listen to my boy, here, OP, and your girls will put on the show of your life for ya.

LEDS is the future.
 
PetFlora

PetFlora

Well-Known Member
The problem plaguing led began in the very beginning, when they were sold as the best way to max chlorophyll A & B using R/B monochromes for the PAR peaks. Sounded good on paper, and yes, many have grown lush looking buds with them, BUT, let me use a health analogy...

If someone is a meat and potatoes eater, no greens, they may look healthy and be strong for years, but eventually they will develop health issues, as well as predispose their offspring to those issues

Sticking with food for a minute, plants need a full diet beyond NPK. A balance of micro minerals are ESSENTIAL to enjoy full health, and provide high quality (tasty) fruits, or in this case- buds

White Light is the only way to get that. Some manufacturers are adding some white diodes, but it's a joke, probably due to having a huge inventory of R/B diodes

Now, within white diodes, for growing we need a blend of NW + WW during veg and flower. However, in flower more WW is needed. Note how A 51 has 3 switches
 
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