LED NOVICE ASKS - "What to SEEK and AVOID in a 1st LED???"

NorthofEngland

NorthofEngland

Well-Known Member
Over the last 6 weeks I have read VOLUMES of information concerning LED panels.
Unfortunately much of the info has been varied greatly or even been an outright contradiction to other info.
For example - When I tried to find out what LED panel would best replace a 600w HID in a 4 x 4ft tent,
I read that 150w of LED would adequately replace 600w of HID,
then I was told that 600W of HID should be replaced with 600w of LED....
And, over the next week, I was told that 250w/400w/300w and 2 x 200w LED's were the best replacements....?

Then, as though I wasn't confused enough, I found out that a 600w LED
may actually only emit about 340w
(Some 1200w panels have an actual output of less than 595w!)
SO....DO I REPLACE 600w of HID with '600w TOTAL' or '600w ACTUAL'?

I was then informed that 5w diodes were hopelessly inefficient
and 1w diodes lacked penetration to anything but the top canopy.
COB's were mentioned
I recall it meant CHIP ON BOARD
but my mind stopped working at this point.

IS THERE A SIMPLIFIED CHECKLIST OF PLUSES AND MINUSES THAT A POTENTIAL BUYER CAN USE
TO HELP CHOOSE AN LED PANEL - HOPEFULLY WITHOUT PAYING CONSIDERABLE MONEY
FOR A PANEL THAT TURNS OUT TO BE USELESS???
 
Southerner

Southerner

Well-Known Member
Well if you ask any group of growers how much light you should use, you will get a huge variety of responses. I have also been doing a lot of LED grow light research in the past half year. It has taken me up till now to commit to buying something and settled on the hans panel 80w. I think the output of three of those would be enough to replace a 600w hps and the 3w Cree and Osram LEDs have some pretty powerful light penetration.

Its not so simple because the real measurement that matters is PAR, not necessarily just wattage. You probably know better than to replace your light with the Chinese LEDs on ebay. The quality of the parts is what matters, especially the diodes. Area 51, hans panels, and a few others seem like you are getting less for more but they are the only panels worth buying. Their prices can seem cringe worthy, but if you go to a LED parts site and add everything up you might be surprised how much the Cree lights alone costs. People who build their own panels certainly save money, but they also have a more than basic understanding of electrics and the principals of LEDs.

At at the very, very most I would see 300w of quality LEDs would equal 600w of HID.

Edit: wanted to add that an option would be to turn your hps ballast to 300w and maybe start with one hans panel and see if a full conversion is right for you
 
J

Johnxnyg

Well-Known Member
I believe you can not go wrong with Area 51. Although I am going with the brand new California light works solar storm 440w. It comes out next week! And I really like their company! So far so good with my 400w ss!
 
SupraSPL

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
Yep not all LEDs are created equal. In some cases you might need more than 600W LED to replace a 600 HPS. But if you use top bins running soft and cool you can replace a 600HPS with about 250W.
 
DCobeen

DCobeen

Well-Known Member
if you can afford it go with area51 5watt diodes they run close to 3 watt. to replace a 600 watt hps get at least 300 watt actual. the reason you see 1200 watts 550 actual is they run the led's at 50% so they last 10 years or more. if you cant afford a area 51 then get a lg-led 700 or 900 watt mars II led, there are a few grows ive seen with both and the ones who grew with them knew how to grow and all the led's did over 1 gram per actual watt but that is a full canopy. if you go to ebay and see a china led and it doesn't say lg-led dont get it. lg-led uses top notch led's. cree's in area 51 is american made led, the rest of their panel is made in china also. so its your call. but get a 700 watt led that pushes over 300 watts and you are set.
 
DCobeen

DCobeen

Well-Known Member
Johnxnyg said:
I believe you can not go wrong with Area 51. Although I am going with the brand new California light works solar storm 440w. It comes out next week! And I really like their company! So far so good with my 400w ss!
Click to expand...
oh cali lights coming out with a new model. that could change allot. ill be getting a new led panel in may and ill buy a good one and then in 2 weeks their will be better one.
 
guod

guod

Well-Known Member
from the sheets:

88 High Quality 5 watt LED bulbs for 400 watts of intense lighting for your plant canopy.

Total Power Consumption: Maximum of 345 Watts
with the
Two built-in 15 watt T8 Fluorescent light tubes for the UV-B plants require to boost crop potency.

build in gods own country with a little help by NASA *

LOL

*Designed and manufactured in the USA by California Lightworks
 
J

Johnxnyg

Well-Known Member
guod said:
from the sheets:

88 High Quality 5 watt LED bulbs for 400 watts of intense lighting for your plant canopy.

Total Power Consumption: Maximum of 345 Watts
with the
Two built-in 15 watt T8 Fluorescent light tubes for the UV-B plants require to boost crop potency.

build in gods own country with a little help by NASA *

LOL

*Designed and manufactured in the USA by California Lightworks
Click to expand...
Not sure what you are mocking, but if you point it out I'd appreciate it as it went right over my head lol.

those numbers are also for the 400w not the new 440w as those will be realsed in a couple of weeks.

They use 5w diodes and push them to 4! Getting 345 watts out of 400w is pretty friggin good for led. Lots of companies use 3w diodes and run them to 2 or 1w.
 
ellydee

ellydee

Well-Known Member
ellydee

ellydee

Well-Known Member
"They use 5w diodes and push them to 4! Getting 345 watts out of 400w is pretty friggin good for led. Lots of companies use 3w diodes and run them to 2 or 1w."

They have to overdrive them because their "footprint" stinks. They run very warm by the way.
 
J

Johnxnyg

Well-Known Member
ellydee said:
"They use 5w diodes and push them to 4! Getting 345 watts out of 400w is pretty friggin good for led. Lots of companies use 3w diodes and run them to 2 or 1w."

They have to overdrive them because their "footprint" stinks. They run very warm by the way.
Click to expand...
yea unfortunately I don't have anything to compare it to, they don't run to warm for me. My high temp in my tent is 77 so I can not complain there.

yes I have read about the poor footprint, but my tent is 2x2 so no worries there!

Also what do you mean by overdriving there led lights? They are being under driven to 3.5-4w, wouldn't over driving mean pushing it to 6? Or do you mean they should be run to lower then 3 to increase life?

also do you have the readings off their new lamp!? As I have been trying to find the par to see if there brand new ones are still old news!

fortunately I have the resources to buy the Area 51 as well if I don't like the CLW! And that I am truly grateful for!

PS op: if you can afford it, the majority loves area51! I'll be loving my CLW over in the corner somewhere shamed by the community!
 
DCobeen

DCobeen

Well-Known Member
i can say this. does your light grow weed you love to smoke? if so who cares. you are the grower as long as they produce buds you like and enjoy then you did good. now for competition i think someone with money who can have 3-5 tents setup run 3-5 clones from same mother. use everything the same as for light time/nutes fans RH. then we could see which light is truly the best. tell then lets just keep posting and when we see a light do better by diff growers over and over then we can really say that light is better.
 
J

Johnxnyg

Well-Known Member
DCobeen said:
i can say this. does your light grow weed you love to smoke? if so who cares. you are the grower as long as they produce buds you like and enjoy then you did good. now for competition i think someone with money who can have 3-5 tents setup run 3-5 clones from same mother. use everything the same as for light time/nutes fans RH. then we could see which light is truly the best. tell then lets just keep posting and when we see a light do better by diff growers over and over then we can really say that light is better.
Click to expand...
Its an easy test to do if you have the funds/time. I am not that vested... and the light is putting a huge smile on my face! What else can i ask for. I do like to learn and love to have these intelligent discussion! Its what keeps me on these boards all the time!
 
DCobeen

DCobeen

Well-Known Member
Johnxnyg said:
Its an easy test to do if you have the funds/time. I am not that vested... and the light is putting a huge smile on my face! What else can i ask for. I do like to learn and love to have these intelligent discussion! Its what keeps me on these boards all the time!
Click to expand...
yes i really want to find the best light for the money by may. i can say i wont be spending $1000 for a light that is just not gonna happen, but $1050 for a complete tent package that i can do in late may or june and cali light is included with a tent package. i will see if area 51 is also.
 
A

anomuumi

Member
SupraSPL said:
Yep not all LEDs are created equal. In some cases you might need more than 600W LED to replace a 600 HPS. But if you use top bins running soft and cool you can replace a 600HPS with about 250W.
Click to expand...
I'd say it depends a lot how much you need even top bin leds to replace your HPS.

Let's say you have problems with humidity, temps and managing overall growroom conditions - and get 10 oz per grow with a 600W HPS. Most definately you'll be better off with lower watts and a proper DIY led will give you a boost in quality and quantity.

On the other hand, if you have perfected your methods, growroom environment and monocrop a cashcrop strain - maybe getting somewhere between 1lb and 1½lb or even more under a single 600W HPS from grow - you'd need a lot more LED watts than in the first case. Though still less than HPS watts when using top bin leds in a DIY fixture.

There are as many grows and styles as there are growers, so it's hard to compare but leds do have an advantage in many properties!
 
midgetaus

midgetaus

Member
NorthofEngland said:
Over the last 6 weeks I have read VOLUMES of information concerning LED panels.
Unfortunately much of the info has been varied greatly or even been an outright contradiction to other info.
For example - When I tried to find out what LED panel would best replace a 600w HID in a 4 x 4ft tent,
I read that 150w of LED would adequately replace 600w of HID,
then I was told that 600W of HID should be replaced with 600w of LED....
And, over the next week, I was told that 250w/400w/300w and 2 x 200w LED's were the best replacements....?

Then, as though I wasn't confused enough, I found out that a 600w LED
may actually only emit about 340w
(Some 1200w panels have an actual output of less than 595w!)
SO....DO I REPLACE 600w of HID with '600w TOTAL' or '600w ACTUAL'?

I was then informed that 5w diodes were hopelessly inefficient
and 1w diodes lacked penetration to anything but the top canopy.
COB's were mentioned
I recall it meant CHIP ON BOARD
but my mind stopped working at this point.

IS THERE A SIMPLIFIED CHECKLIST OF PLUSES AND MINUSES THAT A POTENTIAL BUYER CAN USE
TO HELP CHOOSE AN LED PANEL - HOPEFULLY WITHOUT PAYING CONSIDERABLE MONEY
FOR A PANEL THAT TURNS OUT TO BE USELESS???
Click to expand...
Im like you and have and am researching hard for the past month or so.

I would say get one with as many bands as possible..

Get more power than you need.. If you think you need 300 get a 400 as this will run at 300.. they always run at less than the stated wattage.

Shoose a shape that suits your tent...

Sometimes NOT ALL but sometimes you will find exact replicas just rebranded.. I do believe some of the better companies have better made connection. I also believe that some companies claim they are good when they are rebranded and nothing more.

I can find it now but i saw one on Ebay America that is identical to one being sold by a UK company... just a lot cheaper... exact same light... this doesnt mean all are but definitely some.


Also look at warranty.. I would prefer to buy of a US company for a little more or UK for that fact than alibaba in china with a shit after sales service...
 
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