Phillips Elite Agro 315w T12 CMH in open fixtures - Impressive!!!

[ttystikk]

Yes that solves the heat issues in small spaces, but you lose bulb efficiencies when cooling it directly......might be worth the trade-off for some.

I never did, but had massive air circulation and exhaust.



I used the umbrella to "catch and bounce"light back towards the plants. The bulb was around 2.5 feet further down.

The 375w cmh kit will not replace a thousand watt hps for growing, lighting up a parking lot maybe

I plan to use two to replace a thouie, or four in a six foot tall vertical silo. Better PPf with less heat should do the rest, for a very long time if lamp life numbers are to be believed.

 

[GroErr]

I'm vertical bare bulb with HPS thouies right now. No umbrella necessary or desired. These aren't going to be a problem!

I may just grab it run it bare, maybe look around for a decent umbrella/reflector later, that makes it pretty easy to get going, have some plants I'll flip in 2 weeks or so, should give me enough time to get it, and get it tested/setup.

Yes that solves the heat issues in small spaces, but you lose bulb efficiencies when cooling it directly......might be worth the trade-off for some.
I never did, but had massive air circulation and exhaust.
I used the umbrella to "catch and bounce"light back towards the plants. The bulb was around 2.5 feet further down.
The 375w cmh kit will not replace a thousand watt hps for growing, lighting up a parking lot maybe

I have tons of air/circulation available, 7ft ceiling 4x9.5', fans available if needed and exhaust outside, shouldn't be a problem with heat, these look a lot more efficient anyhow, shouldn't throw off a ton of heat. Air conditioning in the summer helps, have it flowing in from the house furnace as needed through a vent/inline fan. if these can cover off 4x4 w/4 nice size plants I'd be happy, shouldn't have any issues covering that, anything more is a bonus. I'll probably do this 375W, then add another 200/400W of DIY LED's with those 3070 COBS later, that should do it, and max out the room but manageable for heat & the like... I'll call them to verify the 120v thing this week and get one ordered up Don't mind being the guinea pig, if the result is some nice bud

 

[Bubbagineer]

 

[foreverflyhi]

View attachment 3175365

Pretty

 

[ttystikk]

I may just grab it run it bare, maybe look around for a decent umbrella/reflector later, that makes it pretty easy to get going, have some plants I'll flip in 2 weeks or so, should give me enough time to get it, and get it tested/setup.


I have tons of air/circulation available, 7ft ceiling 4x9.5', fans available if needed and exhaust outside, shouldn't be a problem with heat, these look a lot more efficient anyhow, shouldn't throw off a ton of heat. Air conditioning in the summer helps, have it flowing in from the house furnace as needed through a vent/inline fan. if these can cover off 4x4 w/4 nice size plants I'd be happy, shouldn't have any issues covering that, anything more is a bonus. I'll probably do this 375W, then add another 200/400W of DIY LED's with those 3070 COBS later, that should do it, and max out the room but manageable for heat & the like... I'll call them to verify the 120v thing this week and get one ordered up Don't mind being the guinea pig, if the result is some nice bud

Perfect. I'm still seriously thinking of getting a bunch of these for my Super Silo, you gotta tell us how you like them!

I just saw the cover story in the most recent issue of High Times, their huge warehouse grow lit by dozens of ePapillon DE bulbs. That's awesome for horizontal too, but not for vertical.

 

[GroErr]

Perfect. I'm still seriously thinking of getting a bunch of these for my Super Silo, you gotta tell us how you like them!

I just saw the cover story in the most recent issue of High Times, their huge warehouse grow lit by dozens of ePapillon DE bulbs. That's awesome for horizontal too, but not for vertical.

I'll get an initial flowering round posted up here once I get the next cycle moving, looking forward to seeing what these can do

 

[GroErr]

Ok, some bad news on this GEL/Ceramatek ballast. The 375W does require 240v to run it. Some of the lower wattage ballasts in that Cerametek line run on 120v but the largest one needs 240v input. Suggested they change their main product info page, it says 120v. It's like $550 shipped up here, plus now some electrical, I better get googling 240v specs, my biggest challenge is going to have to take a wall down, and figure out path to get another line and in-line timer/outlet to the panel, through a 9" concrete wall. I brought 3x 120v/15A lines in through an existing hole, but there's no room left Suggested they figure out a way to support that 375W on 120v, he said they really haven't sold to this market, they're into commercial stuff mainly, but sounded like they're interested in figuring out a distribution method into hydro shops and the like. They're not setup to really sell one of's, more to sell into distribution channels, jobbers etc.

 

[PSUAGRO.]

Ok, some bad news on this GEL/Ceramatek ballast. The 375W does require 240v to run it. Some of the lower wattage ballasts in that Cerametek line run on 120v but the largest one needs 240v input. Suggested they change their main product info page, it says 120v. It's like $550 shipped up here, plus now some electrical, I better get googling 240v specs, my biggest challenge is going to have to take a wall down, and figure out path to get another line and in-line timer/outlet to the panel, through a 9" concrete wall. I brought 3x 120v/15A lines in through an existing hole, but there's no room left Suggested they figure out a way to support that 375W on 120v, he said they really haven't sold to this market, they're into commercial stuff mainly, but sounded like they're interested in figuring out a distribution method into hydro shops and the like. They're not setup to really sell one of's, more to sell into distribution channels, jobbers etc.

Fuck............stupid misinformation, I don't get these companies sometimes. So the 315w is still confirmed 120v?? Did you ask about the 375w bulb manufacturer???

be safe grower

 

[GroErr]

Fuck............stupid misinformation, I don't get these companies sometimes. So the 315w is still confirmed 120v?? Did you ask about the 375w bulb manufacturer???

be safe grower

Yeah, pain in the ass, I'll get pricing from him on the 315W, was really interested in the 375W though. The 315W 930 lamp @3100k is not bad, may even be a better colour for flowering which is my only purpose for this light. Don't like the unprotected lamp but it puts out better specs. Lower wattage but would seem to me more efficient for flowering, I'll be mixing/adding some form of LED's so my total wattage would be running more like 315W + 100 to 200W of LED's, should still cover a 4x4 nicely.

I didn't specifically check but will on the 315W, I'm thinking it DOES run on 120v. If you look at the spec sheet/.pdf, the lamp voltage for the 315 is 100v, the lamp voltage for the 375 is 140v, thereby the requirement to run the 375W @240v. Pretty sure it's just the 375W that requires the 240v. I'd rather not go through that hassle of running a 240v circuit... damn...

RE: Lamps. here's what he quoted. "Eye Lighting Eyetera Arc" (linked to the Eye Lighting spec sheets). The colours and wattage don't match but their ballast drives them so that would potentially change the output. Not liking the discrepancies though...

Your thoughts on the 315W specs/colour? I'll post back the confirmation of bulb and 120v question on the 315W when I get their response.

 

[bicit]

Yeah, pain in the ass, I'll get pricing from him on the 315W, was really interested in the 375W though. The 315W 930 lamp @3100k is not bad, may even be a better colour for flowering which is my only purpose for this light. Don't like the unprotected lamp but it puts out better specs. Lower wattage but would seem to me more efficient for flowering, I'll be mixing/adding some form of LED's so my total wattage would be running more like 315W + 100 to 200W of LED's, should still cover a 4x4 nicely.

I didn't specifically check but will on the 315W, I'm thinking it DOES run on 120v. If you look at the spec sheet/.pdf, the lamp voltage for the 315 is 100v, the lamp voltage for the 375 is 140v, thereby the requirement to run the 375W @240v. Pretty sure it's just the 375W that requires the 240v. I'd rather not go through that hassle of running a 240v circuit... damn...

RE: Lamps. here's what he quoted. "Eye Lighting Eyetera Arc" (linked to the Eye Lighting spec sheets). The colours and wattage don't match but their ballast drives them so that would potentially change the output. Not liking the discrepancies though...

Your thoughts on the 315W specs/colour? I'll post back the confirmation of bulb and 120v question on the 315W when I get their response.

Who did you talk to by chance? When I called they confirmed that the 375 watt was 120v compatible, maybe he misspoke when I called? I was quoted $420 for the 315 and $480 for the 375. I don't know if that's standard pricing or not though. They don't carry the 930 or the agro spec bulbs, just the 4100k. You would have to buy the other bulbs seperately. I wonder if they would sell the balasts by themselves without the bulb or converter socket?

I'll call them tomorrow. If you guy's have a list of questions you'd like me to ask, post or IM them to me and I'll ask for you.

 

[GroErr]

Who did you talk to by chance? When I called they confirmed that the 375 watt was 120v compatible, maybe he misspoke when I called? I was quoted $420 for the 315 and $480 for the 375. I don't know if that's standard pricing or not though. They don't carry the 930 or the agro spec bulbs, just the 4100k. You would have to buy the other bulbs seperately. I wonder if they would sell the balasts by themselves without the bulb or converter socket?

I'll call them tomorrow. If you guy's have a list of questions you'd like me to ask, post or IM them to me and I'll ask for you.

Guy I spoke to was Matt, think he was relegated to Canada, haven't done any business here yet. He was/sounded positive that the 375W required the 240v input though.

I just sent him a message again to confirm the 315W kit voltage requirements and bulb manufacturer/specs. The specs on the 930/930p lamps under the 315W ballast look better. Lower overall lumens/power but better flowering colour (3100k), almost identical colour rendering chart, better CRI than the 375W, am I missing something other than the 375W vs. 315W?

 

[bicit]

Guy I spoke to was Matt, think he was relegated to Canada, haven't done any business here yet. He was/sounded positive that the 375W required the 240v input though.

I just sent him a message again to confirm the 315W kit voltage requirements and bulb manufacturer/specs. The specs on the 930/930p lamps under the 315W ballast look better. Lower overall lumens/power but better flowering colour (3100k), almost identical colour rendering chart, better CRI than the 375W, am I missing something other than the 375W vs. 315W?

I don't think the 375 watt kit is a philips bulb, they don't have one listed on their website.. I think the 315 is probably the best bet.

 

[GroErr]

I don't think the 375 watt kit is a philips bulb, they don't have one listed on their website.. I think the 315 is probably the best bet.

No you're right, I think all their bulbs provided with these kits will be the Eye Lighting brand. Although I'd imagine the 315W philips bulbs will fit/work with that 315W ballast. I think I asked him all open questions. He was pretty quick at responding so I'd expect to hear back from him today at some point. Will post his response when I get it.

Basically:
The 375W he was sure required the 240v input (would be good to get that answer verified by someone else there if you're talking to a different contact, but looking at the specs, the bulb is 140v so likely requires the 240v line)
The 315W is outstanding: Asked him to confirm whether this kit runs on 120 or 240v, also asked the brand/type of bulb used.
He confirmed they provide a socket with the kit to match the bulb in the kit

Right now I'm liking the specs on the 315W 930 bulb, unprotected but 3100k and nice spectrum chart for flowering, if this runs on 120v I'll likely grab one of these.

 

[bicit]

Ah, I was under the impression they were using Philips bulbs in their kits. Now things are a little clearer, some of his odd replies make more sense now. I'm interested to see the reply to your email now. If these aren't Philips bulbs then I wonder how they would compare?

However, the person I talked to the other day has supposedly had positive reports from "green houses" in Washington and Colorado. So they can't be that bad.

 

[GroErr]

Ah, I was under the impression they were using Philips bulbs in their kits. Now things are a little clearer, some of his odd replies make more sense now. I'm interested to see the reply to your email now. If these aren't Philips bulbs then I wonder how they would compare?

However, the person I talked to the other day has supposedly had positive reports from "green houses" in Washington and Colorado. So they can't be that bad.

I checked out Eye Lighting specs and they look similar but better life expectancy for the Eye Lighting bulbs, the ballasts are the difference though and where the price shoots up. Not that far off the Phillips Elite Agro 315 combos, if they truly last twice as long and provide the stated specs for spectrum, the Ceramatek would be worth a few bucks extra. In my case, even at 30,000 hrs would equate to almost 7 years (assuming 365 days/year) at 12/12, not bad life if they actually last that long and well worth some nice nugs

 

[hyroot]

I though it was Philips master colour.. if its either that or eye lighting. Imo the Philips all start and elite agro are better bulbs.. Higher par and higher cri. Imo the higher the cri the better the performance...

 

[GroErr]

Ok, now I'm pissed, looks like even the 315W while it CAN be set to 120v, they don't support/warranty it 120v mode. Here's what I got below, copied from the email. Sent him a note to clarify but if I'm reading it the way I think he means this, these are out. Not something I'll want to take a chance on and I'm not up for changing my power right now to suit their ballast(s). Maybe I'll consider one of the Phillips 315's for now, or make the Cree 3070 LED panels

Quote:
"The 315W can be programmed to run on 120v. The 375 watt cannot. We do not warranty the product when it is programmed that way because of a lack of testing data. I can find out more technical details if you would like, but it would take some time as our CTO is in China right now."

 

[hyroot]

Ok, now I'm pissed, looks like even the 315W while it CAN be set to 120v, they don't support/warranty it 120v mode. Here's what I got below, copied from the email. Sent him a note to clarify but if I'm reading it the way I think he means this, these are out. Not something I'll want to take a chance on and I'm not up for changing my power right now to suit their ballast(s). Maybe I'll consider one of the Phillips 315's for now, or make the Cree 3070 LED panels

Quote:
"The 315W can be programmed to run on 120v. The 375 watt cannot. We do not warranty the product when it is programmed that way because of a lack of testing data. I can find out more technical details if you would like, but it would take some time as our CTO is in China right now."

sounds kind of shady... Just buy an allstart bulb from advanced tech (1.5 year warranty) then a 400w or 1000w mag mh or switchable ballast (5 -7 year warranty). For around $200 with open reflector or vert mogul. For the 330 or 860. 1400 umole/s at 12 inches for 330 and 1800 umole/s at 32 inches for 860 and both have a 90-93 cri.


or buy an elite agro bulb and the electronic ballast cococola posted the link of a couple pages back

 

[PSUAGRO.]

Ok, now I'm pissed, looks like even the 315W while it CAN be set to 120v, they don't support/warranty it 120v mode. Here's what I got below, copied from the email. Sent him a note to clarify but if I'm reading it the way I think he means this, these are out. Not something I'll want to take a chance on and I'm not up for changing my power right now to suit their ballast(s). Maybe I'll consider one of the Phillips 315's for now, or make the Cree 3070 LED panels

Quote:
"The 315W can be programmed to run on 120v. The 375 watt cannot. We do not warranty the product when it is programmed that way because of a lack of testing data. I can find out more technical details if you would like, but it would take some time as our CTO is in China right now."

This is such bullshit, all these conflicting responses, idk what the he'll is going on over at gel.

Warranty off the table for 120v basically makes it useless at that input....
Obviously no one is gonna risk their expensive gear....

Also running unprotected mh bulbs in an open fixture is not a good idea ever.

 

[GroErr]

sounds kind of shady... Just buy an allstart bulb from advanced tech (1.5 year warranty) then a 400w or 1000w mag mh or switchable ballast (5 -7 year warranty). For around $200 with open reflector or vert mogul. For the 330 or 860. 1400 umole/s at 12 inches for 330 and 1800 umole/s at 32 inches for 860 and both have a 90-93 cri.
or buy an elite agro bulb and the electronic ballast cococola posted the link of a couple pages back

Yeah, thanks hyroot, sounds like an option, may do a smaller one then build an LED, it'll be easier to get something going.

This is such bullshit, all these conflicting responses, idk what the he'll is going on over at gel.
Warranty off the table for 120v basically makes it useless at that input....
Obviously no one is gonna risk their expensive gear....
Also running unprotected mh bulbs in an open fixture is not a good idea ever.

At that price point, no warranty is not an option. Maybe they'll make some changes, if they want to get into this market, they'll need to. I'm not impressed with them so far, not a company I'd go out of my way (install a 240v circuit) to try it.
Thanks for the input.