Are you wasting your nutes? What's your ppm

[AlphaPhase]

I wanted to start this thread to get experienced knowledge about ppm levels. I have been told I'm wasting my nutes while running a 1200 ppm Lucas formula schedule. Sometimes I even hit 1300. Usually I don't go over 1100, but currently I'm using LF for the first time and seeing how it goes. So far it's going OK, could be better, but it's not bad.

I've been told there are NO heavy feeding plants and that heavy feeding plants is a myth. I've heard that going over 500 ppm during flowering is a waste of money and nutes because plants don't use higher ppm levels. I have to disagree with this info I've heard, but am all ears for anyone that can provide info that can prove this theory right.

See, I'd love to save money and use less nutes. But I think that plants use different amounts strain depending.

If this low ppm theory is correct then no one wowould have any problems running multiple different strains using the same hydro res. Correct?

Id like to h3ar from all that force feed their girls or let them starve and all people in between.

What is your ppm? Have you noticed some strains need more ppm? What's the highest and lowest ppm levels you've used for a grow. And don't forget to tell us your ppm meter conversion . 7 or. 5

Alright, let me hear it, because I don't believe a low ppm level is the best for all Mary Jane. Prove me wrong or prove me right. Let's goooooo

 

[AlphaPhase]

Come on fellow riu members, let me have it! I'm very interested in low ppm grows, I just need to be "sold" on it.. I would like to try it if there's proof of great grows using below 700ppm when it's all said and done. I don't wanna hear about low ppm because it saves money, I want to hear WHY low ppm levels is BENEFITIAL for cannabis. No corner cutters. I want to know the science behind this low ppm that some of the people claim is best. If 500-700 ppm during full blown flower is best, then why? Why not higher ppm during flowering like a 1000 or 1500 ppm? I know some people run even higher. And I know it's all based on what nutes are added. I'm talking about using base nutes ppm numbers. You can also add ppm above the base number ppm for additives.

 

[jondamon]

I run drain to waste in coco.

I feed every time and my levels never exceed 1.6-1.8EC
That's about 700-900ppm at .5 scale.

When I ran full hydro I very rarely exceeded 1.4EC.

By res monitoring every 24hours you can start to find the sweet spot.

The sweet spot is that area where nutes and water are uptaken at approximately the same rate keeping your res ppm pretty stable.

This sweet spot though changes with every new growth phase.



J

 

[mackdx]

Same as Jondamon here. DTW Coco, multiple feedings per light cycle, 700 to 800 ppm (500 scale). Plants never look like they are wanting for anything

 

[waterdawg]

650 is the highest I run. All good so far. If I run higher PH drops and ppm's rise, running 650ish seems to keep things stable longer.

 

[candleguy]

I run hydro and monitor water and ppm levels so water goes down but ppm stays the same, to me this means that the plant has exactly the correct amount of food to water currently at 1200 ppm, although I have just been recently told that this is not true and the roots create there own food?!? Cba reading up on it though tbh

 

[jondamon]

I run hydro and monitor water and ppm levels so water goes down but ppm stays the same, to me this means that the plant has exactly the correct amount of food to water currently at 1200 ppm, although I have just been recently told that this is not true and the roots create there own food?!? Cba reading up on it though tbh

Roots create exudates which feed microbes.

They don't create their own nutrients. If they did we'd never need to feed anything.



J

 

[Wilksey]

Take a week and look through a bunch of different grow journals and compare the plants of the growers that feed low vs. those that feed high. The ONLY difference is that the low feeders plants lack the burnt, clawed, and gnarly fan and sun leaves of the high feeders.

Nute levels are going to depend on strain, size of the plant, and the growing environment. High nutes given to a "light feeder" in an environment that is not conducive to metabolizing said nutes is not only a waste of nutes / money, but is detrimental to your plant.

By going light, you always have the option of adding more nutes to make up any deficiencies. By going heavy, the only option you have for any needed "fix", if you CAN, is time.

Good luck, regardless.

 

[Sativied]

Alright, let me hear it, because I don't believe a low ppm level is the best for all Mary Jane. Prove me wrong or prove me right. Let's goooooo

If you make such a claim the burden of proof is yours.

Start by realizing the following are not the same:
- ppm of nutrient solution
- ppm of medium
- ppm of what the plant takes up
- amount of nutrients (ions) the plant needs to create big fat buds

If this low ppm theory is correct then no one would have any problems running multiple different strains using the same hydro res. Correct?

Correct.

Anyway, we recently had a thread about this already. See the following thread, start at page 2 but most relevant info is on page 3.
http://rollitup.org/t/why-are-my-ppms-going-up-now.835107/page-2

I run 350ppm by the way, 480 last round. At no point are the plants starving, on the contrary.

 

[SnapsProvolone]

Depends totally on the system, medium and strain imo.

 

[DeeTee]

I tend to stay around 800ppm's to 900ppm's, my plants love it, see no reason to go higher, btw I'm hydro.

 

[AlphaPhase]

If you make such a claim the burden of proof is yours.

Start by realizing the following are not the same:
- ppm of nutrient solution
- ppm of medium
- ppm of what the plant takes up
- amount of nutrients (ions) the plant needs to create big fat buds

Correct.

Anyway, we recently had a thread about this already. See the following thread, start at page 2 but most relevant info is on page 3.
http://rollitup.org/t/why-are-my-ppms-going-up-now.835107/page-2

I run 350ppm by the way, 480 last round. At no point are the plants starving, on the contrary.

Wow, 350 huh? See that's why I started this thread, I've heard about and read some journals and came to a conclusion that 40% of people run lower ppm with good luck and 40% run higher ppm with good luck, and 20% of people just are way off in ppm lala land

I think the problem with confusion is when people talk about ppm but don't mention their conversion scale. I know that's been discussed in the forum as well. My 1050 ppm @ 7 scale would be 700ppm @5 scale, both the same EC. I've found most people fall into this category of ppm levels. The. 7 conversion guy says to the. 5 conversion guy, "hey your ppm is too low" and vice versa, when in reality it's the exact same. I will do my next journal using 500ppm ish maybe a little higher, on a. 7 conversion meter and will document my findings. My current grow I've hit 1350 ppm using Lucas, no nute burn really. But I have 2 strains in one hydro system and one strain likes lower N levels the other will take any amount of nutes it seems and use them.

 

[AlphaPhase]

650 is the highest I run. All good so far. If I run higher PH drops and ppm's rise, running 650ish seems to keep things stable longer.

What ec is that, . 5 or. 7 scale? If your at a. 5 scale, that's pretty much the same as I usually run. Late flowering I always hit 1000-1100 on my. 7 meter.. 1.5 ec

 

[AlphaPhase]

Here's a pic of my current grow 3.5 weeks flowering. I'm currently at 1100ppm with. 7 conversion, 1.5 ec

 

[waterdawg]

.5 scale. And that is the highest I run. Dropping it to 500 has not changed much other than PH drops a bit slower. I am actually thinking even lower on my next run. Also I'm sure there is no simple answer to the exact sweet spot for everyone. As said earlier I would think setup, and strain has a lot ti do with it. My setup is basically an NFT on overdrive lol. The roots sit in a fairly turbulent environment. Kinda like a babbling brook lol.

 

[waterdawg]

So now I'm confused lol. My EC meter is .5 so if my meter reads 1000 my ppm's are 500, correct? If my meter was .7 conversion would my ppms not be the same but the meter would read 750. I'm not sure why this confuses me so lol. I just assumed ppm's were ppm's.

 

[Sativied]

So now I'm confused lol. My EC meter is .5 so if my meter reads 1000 my ppm's are 500, correct? If my meter was .7 conversion would my ppms not be the same but the meter would read 750. I'm not sure why this confuses me so lol. I just assumed ppm's were ppm's.

http://www.milwaukeetesters.com/pdf/ph-ec_info.pdf

 

[AlphaPhase]

So now I'm confused lol. My EC meter is .5 so if my meter reads 1000 my ppm's are 500, correct? If my meter was .7 conversion would my ppms not be the same but the meter would read 750. I'm not sure why this confuses me so lol. I just assumed ppm's were ppm's.

Lol, it is pretty confusing. Let me see if I can clear this up a little, if I'm wrong I'm sure someone will correct me.. Ppm is based solely on EC value. If you have an EC meter and it reads 1.0 then your ec is 1.0-- now if you have a ppm meter that reads out in ppm on a .5 scale and it is displaying 500 ppm, that means your ec is 1.0. If you have a ppm m3ter with a .7 conversion and it is displaying 700ppm, again the ec is 1.0 - ppm is based on EC, the numbers of ppm may be different on different meters, but as in my example they are both the same ec

 

[Sativied]

Indeed, they are TDS/EC meters that merely convert the ppm before displaying it. The conversion differs sometimes per brand but also differences within some brands based on region.

What ec is that, . 5 or. 7 scale? If your at a. 5 scale, that's pretty much the same as I usually run. Late flowering I always hit 1000-1100 on my. 7 meter.. 1.5 ec

If you happen to have a 0.7 you run pretty much what I ran previous run, which is 480ppm for me, almost 1 EC, which works for most, if not all strains from start to finish (used 350 first and last week) given an efficient hydro setup with sufficient root space.

 

[941mick]

Depends totally on the system, medium and strain imo.

Exactly! A RDWC system is not going to need more than 500ppm in most cases. Where as a drain to waste soilless may need a lot more more, depending on the strain. Microbe and enzyme activity in your medium will also play a role.

Growers using nutes that only grow a strain out one time are really doing themselves a disservice. It usually takes me 3-4 grows before i have a strains feeding needs dialed in for optimum production and quality. Despite what some people are advertising there is no one size fits all when it comes to ppm, which is why I will never run super soil. Sure I could dial in a super soil but It would be way more labor incentive than just changing base fertilizer levels.

Last year for example I focused on OG #18 and 818 headband. These two plants ended up thriving at much different ppm. The OG #18 grew much better at 300-900ppm and the 818 at 500-1500ppm.

700 scale BTW