Molasses?

[techhead420]

But don't you see? No carbohydrate can help plants until science first PROVES that it can and the proper documentation is submitted, peer-reviewed, and published.

After all, we all know that the world was in fact flat until it was conclusively proven to be round and the proper white papers published. If you'd tried to circumnavigate the globe without the proper documentation prior to that, you'd have fallen right off the edge of the world.

Techhead, I know where you're coming from. I dislike bad scientific method as much as the next educated man. However, being an ass is bad for science.

If you are right, being a flaming jerkwad is unnecessary. The truth withstands scrutiny so all that is necessary to prove oneself right is calm, rational scrutiny. Getting emotional and calling people names are the tools of those who lack the ability to prove themselves right.

But here's the thing: the only thing you can hope to prove is that no one has formally conducted an experiment on the interaction of carbohydrates and plants, published the results, and had it peer-reviewed. (I'm assuming here, that this is true. In point of fact, I do not and cannot know such a thing to be true without first checking every single such document known to exist.)

I have never used molasses myself. I have, however, used a carbohydrate supplement (Carboload) and have absolutely no doubts in my mind as to whether or not it works. It does. I know this to be true. Precisely how and why it works is something on which I cannot authoritatively speak. Like my mom - she couldn't tell you why her car runs, but she has no doubt that it does because she has observed it to be so.

Neither she nor I have conducted any research or published any documents to prove this to be true. Neither case is made more or less true by the presence or absence of such documents.

None of us are Wile E. Coyote. We do not need to have studied gravity in order to fall. Gravity works perfectly well for both the Physics major and ignorant rock alike.

Man, very funny and witty post. I love your humor.

Look, I don't give a damn if I'm an ass, if I can get people to think a little bit and actually look to see if there's anything behind these claims then great. People tend to accept urban legends and anecdotes as fact. All I'm saying is do a little research to see if there's anything to it. That's all I'm saying and so far there is no research to back up any claim so maybe we should have a little empiricism instead of passing off speculation as fact when for all we know there could be no effect or even a harmful effect (does the sugar throw off the osmotic pressure in the root zone making the uptake of nutrients more difficult by the roots?).

Your claim of Carboload working is simply conjecture. Have you've done a side to side experiment so that you can back your claim with empiricism? You know as well as I do, considering all of the factors that go into making a healthy and high yielding plant, that if there is no side by side comparison then other factors can and will play a part in the productivity of a plant. Is asking one to back a claim with empiricism so much to ask? Wouldn't that add to one's credibility?

I make a simple falsifiable claim. There are 100 years or so of research papers to draw from for ANY type of plant. NASA alone has spent millions in SBIR grants coming up with techniques for high sugar content (thus yield) in plants. Is NASA so stupid that they would over look adding carbos to plants? Where is the research to support this urban legend?

 

[ta2drvn]

Well guys, thanks for all the information on this subject. I think I have come to the conclusion that I will give Molasses a shot and see. There are 80+ posts and I have found 2 posts that are kinda skeptical but say try it and one person that has never tried molasses or done a side by side himself (and has a hard time being courteous with people that ask questions of him) that keeps repeating the following 'falsable' statement on this subject:


'The burden of proof lies with the person making the claim. The claim is that molasses will have a positive benefit to plant growth. This claim has NEVER been backed up in a published controlled study. This claim has NEVER been backed in a peer reviewed white paper.'


Since I have found plenty of claims (not a lot of access to 'white papers' on this subject through google, sorry I tried, maybe I didn't search correctly? but there seems to be papers on indirect benefits, ie soil) as to the benefits of molasses, well at least, for microbes in the soil that appear to lead to healthier soil. It seems to me that it only make sense that healthier soil directly benefits the plant. I am not a botanist or scientist so I could be wrong, but I have always heard the healthier the medium the healthier the plant. Seems to me that for $5-10 it is worth an experiment if nothing else.


Oh yeah and it helped to have people that actually used the stuff provide there experience in using it, thanks guys.

 

[Seamaiden]

Edited to add: I thought white papers were technical publications (engineering specs, that sort of thing). Maybe you should be searching on published papers, ag departments and other similar research. You can also use Google Scholar, but many, if not most, sites require membership and/or demonstration that you have an actual professional need for access to the article.

I might, or might not, read the whole nine pages of this thread. But, before I do, I will say this; efficacy of carbohydrates in the form of sugars has now been shown effective at boosting biological filtration in saltwater aquatic systems. Even VODKA has shown a positive effect (in helping drop oxidized N values). I'm trying the molasses, it seems to follow along with a lot of the research that has proven endo/ecto micrrhizae to be beneficial in a large way.

 

[sir smokesalot]

i'm done with this thread. all anyone wants to do is trade insults and argue whether there is scientific documentation regarding the effects of molasses. who cares? if you use it and think it works go with it. if you use it and dont see improvement, then don't. its as simple as that

 

[makinthemagic]

about 48 hours after adding molasses to my 2 girls there was some change. the ~2 week older plant added enough weight to start bending over. the younger one might have added some mass but not as dramatically. i will be upping the concentration and feeding more tomorrow

 

[CaNNaBiZNeSS]

i dont know if its a canadian hing only but bulk barns rock the shit out of anything you need, they got like 8 kinds of wierd molasses aroudn here, bnut you need to get the blackstrap, i got 8 oz of it for 97 cents, but you can get it jarred and shit, its messy shit.

infact i found HEMP SEEDS and roasted hemp seeds, suprised me, i actually wouldnt doubt out of the whole 2 tonne bin 10 would germ, even if they are useless, still hilarious to me you know little 13 year olds are tryna buy those seed and try and grow them out LMAO couldnt believe the bulk barn sells hemp seeds

 

[CaNNaBiZNeSS]

btw bulk barn is not in any way shape or form an actual barn, it is a store/supermarket of all household needs in bulk, (BIG ASS BINS that you have bags and and weigh out what you want etc) its quite sick i dont know if u guys got them in the states, would suck if you dont you can get anything there; kelp, guano any molasses etc for pennies

 

[jimmyspaz]

My yields increased 1/3 to 1/2 after I started using mollasses as a suppliment during flowering. As I understand it (thanx Subcool) it's largely the trace elements that benefit the plant, not so much the sugars. I would recommend it for anyone growing in soil. I know nothing about hydro though, maybe someone who does could respond.

 

[ta2drvn]

Jimmy and Magic thanks for the posts, keep us up on the progress M, good luck!




Hey Canna, I have never heard of this Bulk Barn sounds like a cool place. BTW, Hemp seed are eaten as a health food, they are high in essential fatty and amino acids... I don't think those seeds will pop and if they do probably have a <1% thc content anyways, poor kid that spends 90+ days trying to grow one... lol



HEMP SEED: The Most Nutritionally Complete Food Source In The World

 

[Seamaiden]

I wouldn't mind having something like that Barn around here, that's for sure.

 

[GarryFroker]

btw bulk barn is not in any way shape or form an actual barn, it is a store/supermarket of all household needs in bulk, (BIG ASS BINS that you have bags and and weigh out what you want etc) its quite sick i dont know if u guys got them in the states, would suck if you dont you can get anything there; kelp, guano any molasses etc for pennies

We have them here. They are called Sam's Club and Costco. I'd shop there too but I don't think I need a 50 pound bag of Frosted Flakes.

 

[GarryFroker]

Jimmy and Magic thanks for the posts, keep us up on the progress M, good luck!

What about me? lol

 

[codeman420]

lol @ this thread.

Molasses is real and works...but its Black strap molasses. It contains the best foods for those micro bacteria in your soil. anyone who dosnt believe...is new.

word.

 

[hooked.on.ponics]

I forgot who it was that asked, but generally molasses is a bad idea in hydroponics.

That's where products like Carboload really become most valuable. People can argue back and forth about whether it's worth the money to use in soil - personally I don't care because anything important enough to me to bother feeding in the first place is going to be in hydroponics rather than soil. Dirt's just for stuff I don't really care about, like houseplants.

But if you put molasses in a hydroponic system most of the time you're going to end up with nightmare of algae and god knows what else growing in your water.

So yeah, skip the molasses in hydroponics. If you want to use something like that go with Carboload.

 

[GarryFroker]

People can argue back and forth about whether it's worth the money to use in soil - personally I don't care because anything important enough to me to bother feeding in the first place is going to be in hydroponics rather than soil. Dirt's just for stuff I don't really care about, like houseplants.

Make sure when you fall off that high hose that you don't hurt yourself.

 

[drumsinttown]

I concur.... Feel free to keep comments as annoyingly unnecessary as that to yourself.

 

[ta2drvn]

you know some people would only grow their good stuff in soil.

 

[hooked.on.ponics]

Look, I understand that when there's a raving lunatic running around telling you that you're full of it for having an opinion that hasn't been double and triple checked by the scientific community that it's easy to get defensive (and offensive) but give a guy a break, will ya?

If you'll remember, I've demonstrated pretty nicely already that I'm not siding with him. Sheesh.

Someone asked a question about molasses and hydroponics. It just so happens that hydroponics is my thing (shocking, I know, considering my screen name). So I answer the question.

Then I say this:

People can argue back and forth about whether it's worth the money to use in soil - personally I don't care because anything important enough to me to bother feeding in the first place is going to be in hydroponics rather than soil. Dirt's just for stuff I don't really care about, like houseplants.

Nowhere do I say that soil is bad or that hydroponics is better. I'm just saying that, when it comes to plants that are important to me, I will always prefer to put them in hydroponics. Why? Because I get better results there, that's all.

Relax a bit, maybe a couple. Try not to bite someone's head off for having a different opinion. If soil is your thing, more power to ya. I'm not saying there's a single solitary thing wrong with that.

I just prefer 'ponics. There's nothing wrong with that, either.

 

[sleeper05]

So I was pretty much set on going out tomorrow and buying some of this until now that I read that it's for soil grows and not hydro. SOMEONE SHOULD PUT THAT AT THE START SO NO GROWS ARE ROYALLY FUCKED. Probably just flush the whole system but still, pain in the ass.

 

[Kludge]

Relax a bit, maybe a couple. Try not to bite someone's head off for having a different opinion. If soil is your thing, more power to ya. I'm not saying there's a single solitary thing wrong with that.

You're absolutly right. I mean if I saw shit on a hydroponics setup I'd try to wipe the hydroponics off the shit but it's fine for you.

Hey, it's like, I'm not SAYING hydroponics is only done by low life douchebags that have sex with their mothers... I'm just saying.

Please. A person that has to make themselves feel tall by standing on the corpses of others isn't a tall man at all; he's just a midget with bloody shoes.

Admit you were wrong, learn a life lesson, grow a little, and then go sleep with your neighbor's teenage daughter... oh wait, ignore that last part.