giving defoliation during flower a try

[furnz]

I don't take pictures of seedlings usually.
But I guess this is kind of neat.

A triploid

 

[Sativied]

I don't take pictures of seedlings usually.
But I guess this is kind of neat.

A triploid

Not a triploid (which says something about the genetic make up, extra chromosome) but a tricot (instead of a regular dicot), which will grow out with whorled phyllotaxy instead of regular phyllotaxy.

Here's one of mine (although mine start out as dicot)

 

[a senile fungus]

Not a triploid (which says something about the genetic make up, extra chromosome) but a tricot (instead of a regular dicot), which will grow out with whorled phyllotaxy instead of regular phyllotaxy.

Here's one of mine (although mine start out as dicot)
View attachment 3281330

I've always enjoyed your breeding projects sativied

Very cool to see trichomes on a plant that young...

And you take amazing photos, makes me want to buy a real camera...

 

[stankyyank]

A grower from northwestleaf (doctor Scanderson, unsure of credentials) says this:
http://www.thenorthwestleaf.com/pages/articles/post/why-a-plants-final-3-4-weeks-of-grow-are-so-important
"Often, gardeners will deliberately stress the plant mildly right at the end of the flower stage. Many of the desirable characteristics about Cannabis are largely a result of the biological defense mechanisms employed by the Cannabis plant. By creating somewhat stressful environment, you "trick" the plant into focusing its last energy at protecting itself from the stress and recovering which can lead to increased resin and potency of cannabinoids as well as an increase in essential oils."
Any thoughts on this anyone, and any science to prove or dispel this? He doesn't list his source or reference and I'm unsure if he's put it out elsewhere. The following is written by Nebula Haze:
"Some growers say that harvesting different parts of the plant at different times is stressful for the plant, and that is true.
It's also been shown that stress near harvest time actually causes an increase in resin/cannabinoid production, which most growers find beneficial."
http://www.growweedeasy.com/thc-cbd-cbn-when-to-harvest-marijuana

 

[stankyyank]

Some more to add to the mix from http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2822621?uid=3739960&uid=2&uid=4&uid=3739256&sid=21104410475811

The Role of Trichomes in Plant Defense
Donald A. Levin
The Quarterly Review of Biology
Vol. 48, No. 1, Part 1 (Mar., 1973), pp. 3-15
Published by: The University of Chicago Press
Article Stable URL: http://www.jstor.org/stable/2822621

The Quarterly Review of Biology © 1973 The University of Chicago Press
Abstract: Trichomes occur in a multitude of forms and sizes. Although they have been used widely for taxonomic purposes, their adaptive significance has been all but ignored by the evolutionist and ecologist. It is clear that trichomes play a role in plant defense, especially with regard to phytophagous insects. In numerous species there is a negative correlation between trichome density and insect feeding and oviposition responses, and the nutrition of larvae. Specialized hooked trichomes may impale adults or larvae as well. Trichome may also complement the chemical defense of a plant by possessing glands which exude terpenes, phenolics, alkaloids or other substances which are olfactory or gustatory repellents. In essence, glandular trichomes afford an outer line of chemical defense by advertising the presence of "noxious" compounds. In some groups of plants, protection against large mammals is achieved by the presence of stinging trichomes. Intraspecific variation for trichome type and density is known in many species, and often is clinal in accordance with ecographic parameters. The presence of such correlations does not imply that differences in predator pressure are the causal factors, although this may indeed be the case

 

[furnz]

A grower from northwestleaf (doctor Scanderson, unsure of credentials) says this:
http://www.thenorthwestleaf.com/pages/articles/post/why-a-plants-final-3-4-weeks-of-grow-are-so-important
"Often, gardeners will deliberately stress the plant mildly right at the end of the flower stage. Many of the desirable characteristics about Cannabis are largely a result of the biological defense mechanisms employed by the Cannabis plant. By creating somewhat stressful environment, you "trick" the plant into focusing its last energy at protecting itself from the stress and recovering which can lead to increased resin and potency of cannabinoids as well as an increase in essential oils."
Any thoughts on this anyone, and any science to prove or dispel this? He doesn't list his source or reference and I'm unsure if he's put it out elsewhere. The following is written by Nebula Haze:
"Some growers say that harvesting different parts of the plant at different times is stressful for the plant, and that is true.
It's also been shown that stress near harvest time actually causes an increase in resin/cannabinoid production, which most growers find beneficial."
http://www.growweedeasy.com/thc-cbd-cbn-when-to-harvest-marijuana

Well I know from experience that my winter grows where my humidity is extremely low, I get a lot more resin production.
Whether that's from actually 'stressing' the plant or just a natural reaction to try an overcome the dry air.

 

[stankyyank]

An interesting documentary I saw, What plants talk about, or something like that, worth watching, as it offers up some insight (really in further discovery of man's understanding, or lack-therof)

Well I know from experience that my winter grows where my humidity is extremely low, I get a lot more resin production.
Whether that's from actually 'stressing' the plant or just a natural reaction to try overcome the dry air.

Thanks for sharing your observations. It is a well known practice, though I'm willing to bet results "may vary" for some. Anyone have any support for this? Trichome science is important when discussing the desired end product, as the abundance and quality of said trich's is important in terms of the quality and genetic potential of sensi (if grown in preferred conditions). It is common knowledge that plants do react to our input over their environment and even physical manipulation (lst, etc). The key is using the good and excluding the bad. Lowering temps in flowering purples many indica strains. I can't recall the source at the moment, but I am under the impression that it can have overly negative effects as well, although perhaps not as common.

 

[furnz]

An interesting documentary I saw, What plants talk about, or something like that, worth watching, as it offers up some insight (really in further discovery of man's understanding, or lack-therof)

Thanks for sharing your observations. It is a well known practice, though I'm willing to bet results "may vary" for some. Anyone have any support for this? Trichome science is important when discussing the desired end product, as the abundance and quality of said trich's is important in terms of the quality and genetic potential of sensi (if grown in preferred conditions). It is common knowledge that plants do react to our input over their environment and even physical manipulation (lst, etc). The key is using the good and excluding the bad. Lowering temps in flowering purples many indica strains. I can't recall the source at the moment, but I am under the impression that it can have overly negative effects as well, although perhaps not as common.

You might find this interesting.
After the first page you do need to make a free account to read the rest though. Which does work.

http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2822621?uid=3739800&uid=2129&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&uid=3739256&sid=21104902324167

 

[waterdawg]

I usually go from seed to seedling with 48 hours too, that's also around the time they start getting frosty.

Now who's getting off topic ....... Jeez lol! That girls as hairy as my first wife lol. But yes You can pop a seed pretty much anywhere. Had them grow out of the carpet in college don't ask , the bottom of a boat, and gravel on the driveway, pulled that one lol. Is there a right or wrong way? Hell if I know! I do want works for me. But if you dont do it my way your just doing it wrong, stupid lol.

 

[Uncle Ben]

Wow, UB "B.C." someone is really wrong, so it MUST BE ME!!, That is why I have been doing the research and whatever botanical article I can find or that will allow me access. That is why I know growing in soil in my super hot environment will produce crap, water is easier to control, and I never have to bake (kill) any micronutrients that an actual gardener would have worked so hard to make sure was in there, That is why I have seen the actual science theory and research and also the growers produce you attack in print with your diatribe. Clearly you ARE the GOD of growing pot, regardless of the proof you apparently didn't bother to disprove or investigate as you are stuck on your own "DO IT MY WAY, OR ITS WRONG. Its not that with every post you purposely mention IGNORANCE, You are CLEARLY the foundation of it. Do the experiment or keep yapping like the monkey you boast about. You have an inept way of dazzling anyone with brilliance, because no one can see through your B.S..
Nature 101(WITH NO HELP FROM MAN) Plant drop seed, water soil and light feed seed help to grow, nature attacks plant, sun/water/animal/insect/other plant. Plant produce fruit and flower and seed... Thats natures book, EVERYONE ELSE IS A COPY, trying to out perform GOD, (which in this case seems to be you) So I am way wrong, So verry wrong , SOOOO VERRRRRrrryyyYYYYY Wrong, that I even considered praying to an ignoramus such as yourself.,

I ONLY wrote that article to help those that were struggling with such an easy task. If a noob follows each step, it insures them 100% success, as long as the seed has a viable embryo. Now, you really don't think I go thru all that trouble of sanitizing the soil and such? Check out the basic principles of what I wrote - start with a hydrated seed, clean damp soil, sow 1/2" deep, don't water until it's up, start with a tall pot. (no peat pots). You can do it any way you wish.

I report, you decide,
UB

 

[Uncle Ben]

Trichome may also complement the chemical defense of a plant by possessing glands which exude terpenes, phenolics, alkaloids or other substances which are olfactory or gustatory repellents....

And the reason why some pot smokes smooth while some smokes harsh. The above explanation is why I refute the myth of flushing whenever it comes up. It's the nature and the mix of the phenolics, terpenes, etc. that drives taste, not what you've been fertilizing with and for how long.

UB

 

[Uncle Ben]

If you want to know the science, the factors, behind increasing resin and potency then read Mel Franks book. Only promoted it a million times.

 

[Uncle Ben]

... By creating somewhat stressful environment, you "trick" the plant into focusing its last energy at protecting itself from the stress and recovering which can lead to increased resin and potency of cannabinoids as well as an increase in essential oils."

The following is written by Nebula Haze:
"Some growers say that harvesting different parts of the plant at different times is stressful for the plant, and that is true.
It's also been shown that stress near harvest time actually causes an increase in resin/cannabinoid production, which most growers find beneficial."
http://www.growweedeasy.com/thc-cbd-cbn-when-to-harvest-marijuana

He also advocates harvesting when the goodies are ready. I just posted on this topic - harvesting based on optimum times and bud profile. https://www.rollitup.org/t/lollipopping-any-scientific-evidence.846126/page-26#post-11001634

The older bud material will have cannabanoids, chemicals, that will have changed over time based on exposure to elements that change the THC to less psychoactive stuff - air, light, heat.....all enemies of THC. It's a race against time and in the end, "no le hace"....doesn't matter. You're gonna mix it all up in a bag where it's homogenous anyway.

Now, advise an apple or a peach manager to pick all of his crop at one time. They'll laugh at you. Some times they're forced to because of prime market opportunities or impending stormy weather, labor availability, etc. but every farmer (and that includes me) knows that apples, grapes, pecans, cannabis etc. are at their prime over a continuum of time.

Also, have heard that stress stuff from snooty winemakers and vineyard owners...... claiming a stressed vine produces the best wine. Of course you will never have a chance doing a taste test from the same vineyard from wines made out of healthy vines versus stressed.

UB

 

[Sativied]

I've always enjoyed your breeding projects sativied

Very cool to see trichomes on a plant that young...

And you take amazing photos, makes me want to buy a real camera...

Hey thanks man, a good camera certainly adds to the fun. You actually wouldn't be the first who bought a real camera after seeing my pics. It's 98% camera (nikon d3200) and 2% me though (just aim and shoot).

Now who's getting off topic ....... Jeez lol! That girls as hairy as my first wife lol. But yes You can pop a seed pretty much anywhere. Had them grow out of the carpet in college don't ask , the bottom of a boat, and gravel on the driveway, pulled that one lol. Is there a right or wrong way? Hell if I know! I do want works for me. But if you dont do it my way your just doing it wrong, stupid lol.

Too late, hijacked That's the thing, they pop regardless and often despite the germination method, and not thanks to. I've popped hundreds of seeds this year in various mediums and I get a 100% germination rate regardless. The "fastest" for me is to soak like 20 over night in cup of warm water, and the next day pick the ones that sunk to the bottom or already cracked open. Which in my case are all 20, but I still do it anyway. The main advantage of the soaking is that I can have seedlings that are very similar in size which is handy for my small space.




I cut a couple of them open and removed the embryo and they still popped in a couple of days.


The shell is just for physical protection, given a healthy seed, i.e. with a healthy embryo, all it needs is a little water to expand and break the seed.

For those in a rush, I got the impression it reduced the time with least another 2-3 hrs

 

[skunkd0c]

Your seedlings will be alot better off if you germinate directly in soil

hydroponic growers should start/germinate seeds in soil first ?

Spread cheeks, gently insert, don't remove until you feel a gentle tickling sensation.

You're attempting to avoid my question with the use of some homo-erotic innuendo, nice move

i am still intrigued as to what method YOU would suggest is the best way for hydroponic growers to start seeds >?
since you do not favour the paper towel method

 

[Hydroburn]

Can we stay on topic please? This thread is about defoliation

So, where were we... ah yes, removing these nasty fan leaves.

View attachment 3281146

I think I'll just keep mine.

wouldn't you rather those trichs be on the buds? unless you are planning on smoking the leaf...

 

[Hydroburn]

i am still intrigued as to what method YOU would suggest is the best way for hydroponic growers to start seeds >?
since you do not favour the paper towel method

who cares what UB thinks; it's not like anyone is going to stop using paper towels because some anonymous fuck on the internet makes a retarded comment.

 

[Sativied]

wouldn't you rather those trichs be on the buds? unless you are planning on smoking the leaf...

No dude, not as clever as you think that is... typical forum-grower logic, another false dilemma. It's not on the leaves "instead" of the buds... I rather have it on both so I can make some hash and/or bho too. Only so much space for trichs on the calyxes and sugar leaves...

 

[Sativied]

I didn't know you can't blast buds and that trichs can't stick to other trichs.

Again, not as clever as you think that is. If I wanted more trichs on buds I would need more bud and not less leaves.... 2+2=4 not 22. There's only so much bud the plant will grow, which I prefer to smoke as bud. The trichs need space to grow 'on', of course they can stick together all they want, they aren't going to grow on top of each other. Your argument will remain invalid regardless of your childish responses as the trichs being on the leaves simply doesn't mean I could have those as extra on the buds.

Try again...

 

[Hydroburn]

there is nothing clever about lollipopping and training to focus energy and maximize the light. more buds, less leafy garbage. but I guess you pretty much just decided more fan leafs = more hash