Flushing and nutes

[crawlintbss]

First full grow so I guess Im a newbie.

Im having some issues and need to do a flush. I see some post and say like flush with 2-3x the amount then feed with 1/2 strength of the nutrients.

So does that mean to do the flush, let it drain then do a feeding with the nutrients right after the flush or let the flush dry out first then next watering is with feed?

Sorry if its a dumb newbie question. Finally picked up some botanicare but im having a calcium issue and my soil ph has spiked hard to like 7.5 and higher in some hot spots, so i think i need to do a flush. Never done a full proper flush on this plant due to starting with some MG potting mix that had time release. so i couldnt flush to overflood it with nutrients. Got past the problems with that and moved to foxfarm and now it deff needs food but I need a flush first.

Thanks in advance any input is greatly appreciated!

 

[TheYokel]

I used to use botanicare on my outdoor plants. I now do mainly organic indoors, but if I were ever to recommend a brand of synthetics, I would start with botanicare. Good stuff

Did you get a bottle of their Cal-Mag to go with the Bloom formula? Their regular mixes don't have any micros in them, so you will need to get some to supplement your plants with.

I would also recommend getting some Hi-Brix molasses. I love that stuff and it's pretty dang cheap. Like $10 for a gallon at my local store.

About your flushing. What size containers are you using, and how well does it drain?

I use 2 gallon grow bags with some amended Happy Frog and I can use 2 quarts to flush a plant and get almost a whole quart of run-off.

I swear people go way overboard with their "2-3 times the amount of soil" shenanigans.

If your soil is *really* bad, you can let them sit for a few hours and then hit them with a second mini-flush. Then I would let them go for a few days until they need another watering. The next time they need watering, use straight water til you get a small run-off and check your ph. If it's where you want it to be, feed them a 1/4 strength dose of nutes and work your way back up from there.

In my grow I only fertilize every other feeding up until the last 4-5 weeks anyways. I'll push them harder when they really start chunking up, but the rest of the time you are just wasting nutes and run the risk of burning your plants or ruining your soil.

I've only just finished my first indoor grow myself, but I think it came out pretty nice all things considered. I have grown outdoors for years though, and that includes in pots, so remember this is all coming from a fellow noobie indoor grower just like you, lol

 

[Ninjabowler]

Theres too many variables and unknowens to answer this question correctly. Idk if your high and not conveying the story to the degree needed to help but i just dont get it man.
So mg time release? What sized pots? How long was it in there for?
Then it went into ffof? What sized pots and how long has it been in there for?
What did you do to fix the "calcium" "deficiency" ?
What have you fed it? How many times?
How do you water it? Do you always have run off? Does the plant sit in the run off or is it a drain to waste system?
What kind of water are you using? RO water may need cal suppliments, tap water may not.
Whats the ph of the water you plan on flushing with?
Are you planning on running ph down with it?
Have you tested the ec or ppm of the runoff? Runoff is a good test of if you need a flush. If your running 1800 ppm out of the soil or higher.....you may need a flush. If its low ppm like 600 then dont leach out what you dont have to. Or add nutes to the ph down water if your low ppm.
I hope some of this made sence and you dont make people think so hard in the future about your problems. Details man, details.

 

[crawlintbss]

well i didnt want to ramble off on a basic question but here you go. 4 plants random bag seed.

seeded in MG potting mix ( shit ass premix with time release fertizlier balls in it ) in solo cup. realized it was junk, moved to MG Organic ( coco perlite, soil mixture with bonemeal/bloodmeal traces. no crazy nutes ) on day 6 to 1 gal. I was watering with purified water that was phd for awhile ( had some cal n mag in it on label. gerber kids water ) then switched to distilled. Then waterings with Distilled water phd to 6.5ish. no nutes since it had the mg stuff still in there. Started to get slight leaf cerosis spots for overferts from the time release crap when i watered everytime. ppm run off was 1400ish. kept running water til i got it down to like 700 but didnt feel comfortable adding more water at that point. everything cooled out for about 2 weeks. great growth. kept watering when needed by weight ( i work with gardening daily so i know when shit needs watering ) they where drinking maybe 2-3qts at this time. run off is caught in trays and i wait until fully done before putting back in, still on a tray with gap to catch run off. i watered til about 10-20% run off. like i said,never really gave a full flush due to some of the MG stuff. kept watering. Most of the time when i checked soil ph with meter it was around 6.5-6.8. Then 1 of 4 plants started spotting which i believe to be calcium deff. then all plants started showing it. I did a watering with epsom and molasses and it seemed to help stop it. many leaves got damaged. I then transplanted to 3gal on day 27 for 2 of them and 1.5s for hte others that where severly damaged and i really dont care about anymore due to space anyway. I recently was able to find local place with botanicare so i picked up the grow,bloom and calmag. Gave 1 feeding 2 days ago with grow and calmag. Still showing signs of cal def with top new growth being very skinny and curly in some places. i checked soil ph as they where still had some water weight to them from feeding 2 days ago, and its hitting very high 7.5 , 7.8 , 9.5 hot spot.

So, i feel as i need to do a proper flush on these guys before giving them a proper feeding with my new stuff. Ive never had a overwatering problem. drainage is good with about 30% perlite mixed in.

hope that helps. Didnt wanna ramble on, was more just wanting to know what most meant when they say flush then feed. Is it to flush and let dry then feed, or flush let run off complete and then do a feeding until runoff.

thanks for the responses!

 

[TheYokel]

Theres too many variables and unknowens to answer this question correctly. Idk if your high and not conveying the story to the degree needed to help but i just dont get it man.
So mg time release? What sized pots? How long was it in there for?
Then it went into ffof? What sized pots and how long has it been in there for?
What did you do to fix the "calcium" "deficiency" ?
What have you fed it? How many times?
How do you water it? Do you always have run off? Does the plant sit in the run off or is it a drain to waste system?
What kind of water are you using? RO water may need cal suppliments, tap water may not.
Whats the ph of the water you plan on flushing with?
Are you planning on running ph down with it?
Have you tested the ec or ppm of the runoff? Runoff is a good test of if you need a flush. If your running 1800 ppm out of the soil or higher.....you may need a flush. If its low ppm like 600 then dont leach out what you dont have to. Or add nutes to the ph down water if your low ppm.
I hope some of this made sence and you dont make people think so hard in the future about your problems. Details man, details.

I was taking him to mean that after jacking up his original soil, that he transplanted into the fox farm. I may be reading too much into it though. I was assuming (such a terrible thing) that he was looking to flush his root mass after transplanting to get the salts off and have a fresh start.

Then again, maybe I'm too high, lol.

I try to keep the water I feed my plants between 6.2 and 6.7 ... that seems to work well in my amended Happy Frog. I've never used FFOF, but I here it runs a little hotter.

 

[TheYokel]

hope that helps. Didnt wanna ramble on, was more just wanting to know what most meant when they say flush then feed. Is it to flush and let dry then feed, or flush let run off complete and then do a feeding until runoff.

You don't want to feed them the same day you flush them. Give them time to leach the rest of the stuff out of the soil and to recover before you start back in with the nutes.

 

[Ninjabowler]

I use ffof, never ph, pull 2lbs a light. Fuck ph impo. Others will argue to the grave that every ph point is important. I say in hydro...maybe. Dirt? Meh. Every one does it different and if your system works, do it.

 

[Ninjabowler]

You don't want to feed them the same day you flush them. Give them time to leach the rest of the stuff out of the soil and to recover before you start back in with the nutes.

On the other hand, if your flushing salts out, salts cling to salts, so youll get more out if you add a small amount of fertilizer to the water.

 

[crawlintbss]

Thanks Yokel!

Yeah i wouldnt say i have tooo much foxfarm in the pots right now, one 12qt bag did the trans for 2 3gals. I know OF is hot on seedlings but this thing is getting big so i know it can take a little food now.

 

[crawlintbss]

I use ffof, never ph, pull 2lbs a light. Fuck ph impo. Others will argue to the grave that every ph point is important. I say in hydro...maybe. Dirt? Meh. Every one does it different and if your system works, do it.

i have seen many say just ph the water to 6.5area and just go. dont worry about the soil ph. i only check it maybe once a week and i was just alarmed a bit with having my cal problem and noticing high ph in the soil.

 

[Ninjabowler]

Thanks Yokel!

Yeah i wouldnt say i have tooo much foxfarm in the pots right now, one 12qt bag did the trans for 2 3gals. I know OF is hot on seedlings but this thing is getting big so i know it can take a little food now.

View attachment 3288724 View attachment 3288725

Ya, shes getting nice and big. The plant itself is super green which means its getting what it needs right now. Those leaves dying at the bottom are normal. Thats the plant shedding some dead weight. Those leaves arent receiving enough sun so the plant discards them. Lots of new growers stress over it but its totally normal. I dont see any "deficiencies" in your plants. Most people tend to over think it and just dump a bunch of shit in there hopeing to fix a problem that never existed. Then they have to dump some more shit in to fix the new problem they created. Less is more. Ffof is full of everything she needs to get by with minimal feedings. Try once a week or every third watering after flower starts at 75 % dose and tell me how she turns out. A couple drops of cal mag on top of that and finish with sweetener. Dont over think it.

 

[TheYokel]

Ya, shes getting nice and big. The plant itself is super green which means its getting what it needs right now. Those leaves dying at the bottom are normal. Thats the plant shedding some dead weight. Those leaves arent receiving enough sun so the plant discards them. Lots of new growers stress over it but its totally normal. I dont see any "deficiencies" in your plants. Most people tend to over think it and just dump a bunch of shit in there hopeing to fix a problem that never existed. Then they have to dump some more shit in to fix the new problem they created. Less is more. Ffof is full of everything she needs to get by with minimal feedings. Try once a week or every third watering after flower starts at 75 % dose and tell me how she turns out. A couple drops of cal mag on top of that and finish with sweetener. Dont over think it.

Completely agree with Ninja.

In my Happy Frog I can take my plants all the way to the 2nd week of flowering without adding much to the soil except water.

Until it really starts packing on weight, less is more.

If its green and growing, it's probably happy. It's hard to starve a weed plant to death, but it's reeeeally easy to love one to death, lol.

 

[crawlintbss]

this is why im overthinking a bit. I cannot tell if Im having a Cal issue or Rust. This started on one plant, then started showing on the next plant the next day, then teh big one showed it hte next day now as well. Spots all over the fans , especially near the top. Thats why i leaned towards Cal more. Has the spotting, skinny new growth with curl too.

my last of the 4 didnt show any problematic signs and now yesterday one of its leaves is turning as well like the others.

 

[Ninjabowler]

Completely agree with Ninja.

In my Happy Frog I can take my plants all the way to the 2nd week of flowering without adding much to the soil except water.

Until it really starts packing on weight, less is more.

If its green and growing, it's probably happy. It's hard to starve a weed plant to death, but it's reeeeally easy to love one to death, lol.

Nicely put. Ninja vanish.

 

[TheYokel]

Looks like a Calcium lock-out...

Plants only take up certain nutrients and minerals at certain ph ranges. If you ph was that high and out of wack your plant wasn't able to absorb any Calcium.

Flush it, get the ph in check, throw some cal-mag in some water and ph adjust it, and give it a light feeding. It will clear up as the ph stabilizes.

 

[crawlintbss]

Started as this on 1 plant. then moved to another and did the light spotting pictured above
then moved to this

then it seemed as it stopped and was just dying out.
now my last plant is showing this on 1 leaf.

 

[Ninjabowler]

Ya, i can see your concern. There is some dots there. Could be a minor issue with cal mag. Calmags cheap, i run it, a couple drops every time or other time. One quart bottle for twenty bucks will last you for two years at that size of a grow. Giver, it cant hurt if you sont overdo it. Good luck. Now real ninja vanish

 

[crawlintbss]

Looks like a Calcium lock-out...

Plants only take up certain nutrients and minerals at certain ph ranges. If you ph was that high and out of wack your plant wasn't able to absorb any Calcium.

Flush it, get the ph in check, throw some cal-mag in some water and ph adjust it, and give it a light feeding. It will clear up as the ph stabilizes.

Thanks. that what i was pretty much getting at with this all. I was just hoping to save the last one before it was gonna show any problems.

 

[Ninjabowler]

View attachment 3288741 Started as this on 1 plant. then moved to another and did the light spotting pictured above
View attachment 3288742 then moved to this

View attachment 3288743 then it seemed as it stopped and was just dying out.
View attachment 3288744 now my last plant is showing this on 1 leaf.

Dude these pictures would have helped an hour ago......face palm.

 

[crawlintbss]

haha sorry i had posted in the Plant problem area with no real help, more or less just did RIU reading for past few days to really figure it out.

Hence why i want to FLUSH! LOL my only wierd concern is that it started at 1 plant, then the next one had it, then so on and so forth til all 4 have it. Im wondering if with my change from the purified to distilled made it worse as well but now i know.

Thanks guys! Greatly apprecaited!