1000 watt true led = 1000 watts hps?

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sourdieselyumyum

Well-Known Member
Just wondering what u led growers think I was looking at these mars 2 1200 led fixtures says they pul 520-600 watts I was thinking 4 in a agromax 4 x 8 tent would be equivalent to 2 1000 watt hps in yield I'm looking to pull 4 lbs per cycle I can pull 2 lbs + off a 1000 watt hps in a 4 x 4 do u guys think this would be do able with 4 of these in a 4 x 8 people have been telling me 2 would be great for 4 x 8 but that's about equivalent to 2 600 watt hps what do u guys think? Any help and advice would be great before I take a leap and spend 1700$
 
rob333

rob333

Well-Known Member
sourdieselyumyum said:
Just wondering what u led growers think I was looking at these mars 2 1200 led fixtures says they pul 520-600 watts I was thinking 4 in a agromax 4 x 8 tent would be equivalent to 2 1000 watt hps in yield I'm looking to pull 4 lbs per cycle I can pull 2 lbs + off a 1000 watt hps in a 4 x 4 do u guys think this would be do able with 4 of these in a 4 x 8 people have been telling me 2 would be great for 4 x 8 but that's about equivalent to 2 600 watt hps what do u guys think? Any help and advice would be great before I take a leap and spend 1700$
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about 10 pounds and i like honey
 
SupraSPL

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
In all honesty, I believe the HPS setup will run cooler for you. Those LEDs are "generic" despite the claim to be Crees etc. So the efficiency of the LEDs is potentially very low (15-20%) and when it comes to LEDs I advise to assume the worst. The HPS is 35-36% efficient.

Here is some ugly math:
Mars X 2 = 1200W, 15% of that is driver/fan losses (180W of heat)
So we have 1020W left, 20% of that becomes light (204 PAR W)
The rest becomes heat (816W)
So that is 816+180=996W of heat in your grow space

The 1000 HPS is the actual bulb dissipation, so no drivers losses included
35% of it becomes light (350 PAR W)
650W of heat in your grow space.

Something to consider about these generic LEDs, check out the picture of the aluminum board. I guarantee there is a very bad thermal interface between the board and the heatsinks and probably a low quality thermal paste, maybe even air pockets? Since they are low efficiency LEDs the last thing they need is to be running smokin hot. A poor thermal interface will actually lead to a cool heatsink, masking a very hot LED on the other side.

Although these generics are only $1/dissipation W, since they create so much more heat than HPS we should consider that an HPS setup can be as cheap as $0.31/dissipation W.

Aluminum boards.jpg
 
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Bad Karma

Bad Karma

Well-Known Member
sourdieselyumyum said:
Just wondering what u led growers think I was looking at these mars 2 1200 led fixtures says they pul 520-600 watts I was thinking 4 in a agromax 4 x 8 tent would be equivalent to 2 1000 watt hps in yield I'm looking to pull 4 lbs per cycle I can pull 2 lbs + off a 1000 watt hps in a 4 x 4 do u guys think this would be do able with 4 of these in a 4 x 8 people have been telling me 2 would be great for 4 x 8 but that's about equivalent to 2 600 watt hps what do u guys think? Any help and advice would be great before I take a leap and spend 1700$
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Stay far away from the Mars II LED lights, they are bad, bad, news. Some members on here have bought them and quickly regretted it. They are made with the cheapest parts available, which adds up to piss poor penetration, above average heat (for an LED light), and terrible efficiency.
If you want a true LED replacement for a 1000W HPS, you have three choices, Apache Tech's AT600, Area 51's RW-150 (x4), or a DIY COB panel.

- Apache Tech's AT600 is a one piece panel, pulling around 650W, and it will give you a 4x4 footprint. Member Greengenes has some great documented grows using the AT600. This light can be had for around $2000 with a discount code if you buy it from Apache Tech's website.

- Area 51's RW-150, you would need four of theses panels to replace a 1000 HPS, they would pull a bit over 600W between them, and cover a 4x4 space. They are one of the most tried, and true, panels on the forums, a real workhorse. At $420 each, you'd be looking at a sum total around $1680, for a group of four.

- DIY COB (Chip On Board), the latest, and greatest, craze to hit our forums. With parts becoming more accessible, and affordable, many members have opted to make their own lights. I believe you would need between 600-700W to properly cover a 4x4 area with COBS. The price, which depends on the quality of the parts you choose, will be around the price of the previously mentioned A51's, or lower. There are many threads on our forum that will walk you through the DIY process step by step.
 
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sourdieselyumyum

Well-Known Member
Yea I was originally gonna get a apache at600 back in the day but honestly it's more like a 600 watt hps I seen green genes Vids on YouTube against a 1000 watt hps and he basically pulled a gram per watt with the apache but for me to do watt I want I'd have to pull of 1.5 grams per watt with a apache which I don't think i could do honestly I'd need 3 or 4 the price is the deal breAker for me
 
Bad Karma

Bad Karma

Well-Known Member
sourdieselyumyum said:
Yea I was originally gonna get a apache at600 back in the day but honestly it's more like a 600 watt hps I seen green genes Vids on YouTube against a 1000 watt hps and he basically pulled a gram per watt with the apache but for me to do watt I want I'd have to pull of 1.5 grams per watt with a apache which I don't think i could do honestly I'd need 3 or 4 the price is the deal breAker for me
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I can't say that I follow your line of logic, sir. I understand everything that you said, but if you think any of the Mars II panels are going to out yield a AT600, you're mistaken. So instead of running 1100W for $4000, you want to run 2400W for $1700? I know $1700 is the cheaper investment, but you'd be running over double the watts, and that electric bill is going to catch up to you fast. Also, the quality of the bud produced by a Mars II will leave you kicking yourself in the end for even spending a penny on them. If this is all about money, you're better off going with Vipar LED on Ebay, than you are with Mars II.
 
SupraSPL

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
Since you are already pulling .9gr/W with 1000 HPS you are already outyielding the best results that GG or myself have achieved with HPS in organic soil. You may be using higher yielding varieties, a hydro/chem setup or simply a better grower. So you probably should not judge LED potential based on our numbers directly, I do think 1.5gr/W is possible with the best commercial LED panels, although I would expect a significant sacrifice of quality to achieve it.
 
FrozenChozen

FrozenChozen

Well-Known Member
SupraSPL said:
Since you are already pulling .9gr/W with 1000 HPS you are already outyielding the best results that GG or myself have achieved with HPS in organic soil. You may be using higher yielding varieties, a hydro/chem setup or simply a better grower. So you probably should not judge LED potential based on our numbers directly, I do think 1.5gr/W is possible with the best commercial LED panels, although I would expect a significant sacrifice of quality to achieve it.
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A well dialed genetic is something you'll need to get you there too... poor genetics + great lights = poor quality end product still...
 
iliadtattoo

iliadtattoo

Well-Known Member
for me , every 90w actual draw from 3w emitters = about a 250w hps. as far as yield and coverage. typically I see about 1/3 draw vs advertised w. in a 3x3 with 113w actual draw I can get a pound from 5 indicas about 30" after stretch not LST, just kiss nutes.Hope this is helpful.
 
SupraSPL

SupraSPL

Well-Known Member
FrozenChozen said:
A well dialed genetic is something you'll need to get you there too... poor genetics + great lights = poor quality end product still...
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GG has access to clone-onlys and I have searched through over 150 different ladies from top breeders, keeping only the very best. So far I have not found a single lady that can yield massive and maintain the highest quality. Green crack, big bud, critical, skunk etc, almost everything geared toward yield has been bunk for me, lacking flavor and does not test well with patients. BUT I have found a handful that yield very well and do have very high quality, but they will not yield as well as the big commercial varieties no matter how good you are at growing.

On top of that, GG and I use organic soil so hydro/chem setups might be able to coax more roots and more yield out of a plant than we can.

Based on all that, I encourage commercial growers not to use our numbers as a guideline for LEDs potential. My best so far with LED was 1.4gr/W and I expect many growers could exceed that. Also worth mentioning, I have not been able to maintain that. The last run was 1.15gr/W.
 
Greengenes707

Greengenes707

Well-Known Member
I'm a little late to this party but supra has said pretty much all that needs to be said. A better grower can get better results than me. My most recent run pulled 1.2g/w. It was a great run for me, but I know a better grower could push more out than I can. And DIY cobs are a great option if your down to build one.
 
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