to flush not to flush and if so when to start

[curious2garden]

The "mother nature does not flush" argument is getting old…. you're not following mother natures plan unless you're growing 100% natural organic in the ground (bat shit, worm castings ect..)

Mother nature does not use man mad (synthetic or organic) nutes so this argument is bunk. The nutes that 95% of growers use cause salt buildup and nutes remain in the medium and ppm on run off can get crazy, do non flushers ever check their run off? If you're 3 weeks from finish and your run off is 2k ppm and up not flushing ain't going to help anything you need to get that down low I water just ph'd water every other watering (though I've found a couple strains that don't dig that method, fixing that next time i run them) doing so keeps my run off ppm low and I just water with ph'd water for the last 2 weeks, no flush just normal watering. If you're watering every time with fert (and don't have a way to check your PPM) I would at least water with ph'd water the last week or 2 and if your ppm is way up there like I mentioned before… I'd do a flush at 2 weeks (run multiple gallons, if you're in 5gal pots use 5gal water is a safe bet) than just water with ph'd water as needed.

Grojak, you missed the subject the OP and I were discussing. He was asking about pre-harvest flushing and you are arguing about routine maintenance salt build up flushing which is something completely different.
hth,
Annie

 

[Grojak]

Grojak, you missed the subject the OP and I were discussing. He was asking about pre-harvest flushing and you are arguing about routine maintenance salt build up flushing which is something completely different.
hth,
Annie

You missed the last few sentences in my post… if someone doesn't know their PPM flushing won't hurt and is better safe than sorry and if they can check ppm and its high flushing should be done of course. Preharvest flushing IS / SHOULD be based on the PPM of your run off, if you run off is 150ppm 2 weeks before finsih you wouldn't need to flush but you probably don't have a good, healthy grow either. I was just getting a bit more technical in my explanation, sorry.

"If you're watering every time with fert (and don't have a way to check your PPM) I would at least water with ph'd water the last week or 2 and if your ppm is way up there like I mentioned before… I'd do a flush at 2 weeks (run multiple gallons, if you're in 5gal pots use 5gal water is a safe bet) than just water with ph'd water as needed."

 

[unwine99]

Motherfucker... that's my line little bitch.

I merely posted that what you claim is not conventional wisdom and is actually bad advice. It's you who resorted to being a little bitch when not only I but one of your own references turned out to disagree with you. And it's me who deals with little bitches like you all the time. You're such a cliche and will fit in nicely here.... parrot -> denial -> ad hominem -> reflecting -> being a little insecure bitch who's ego got hurt. Just another day at rollitup...

What ever tantrum you feel like throwing, it's not going to turn a common misconception into fact because you choose to be an ignorant fucktard.

And you are merely incorrect -- whether you or others find the conventional wisdom to be misguided or untrue is irrelevant -- it's still the conventional wisdom. The conventional wisdom used to be that the world was flat -- things change -- information changes -- and that's a good thing, however, I know many growers, real ones -- not wannabes -- who get paid top dollar, by professionals, for the product that they supply and they all follow the rules that I outlined in my first post -- maybe it is a misconception -- but it's also, still, whether you like it or not, the conventional wisdom. So in conclusion, you probably know where you can stick that superiority complex of yours and no need to reply because you already showed me what you're made of by resorting to 3rd grade name calling -- not much at all. Sorry giz2k for cluttering up your thread.

 

[curious2garden]

You missed the last few sentences in my post… if someone doesn't know their PPM flushing won't hurt and is better safe than sorry and if they can check ppm and its high flushing should be done of course. Preharvest flushing IS / SHOULD be based on the PPM of your run off, if you run off is 150ppm 2 weeks before finsih you wouldn't need to flush but you probably don't have a good, healthy grow either. I was just getting a bit more technical in my explanation, sorry.

"If you're watering every time with fert (and don't have a way to check your PPM) I would at least water with ph'd water the last week or 2 and if your ppm is way up there like I mentioned before… I'd do a flush at 2 weeks (run multiple gallons, if you're in 5gal pots use 5gal water is a safe bet) than just water with ph'd water as needed."

Nope sorry I read it completely through I simply disagree with you. You continue to conflate maintenance flushing with a low osmolarity fluid to pre-harvest flushing they are two very separate animals.

PS Please stop the ad hominem attacks.

 

[cannabineer]

The "mother nature does not flush" argument is getting old…. you're not following mother natures plan unless you're growing 100% natural organic in the ground (bat shit, worm castings ect..)

Mother nature does not use man mad (synthetic or organic) nutes so this argument is bunk. The nutes that 95% of growers use cause salt buildup and nutes remain in the medium and ppm on run off can get crazy, do non flushers ever check their run off? If you're 3 weeks from finish and your run off is 2k ppm and up not flushing ain't going to help anything you need to get that down low I water just ph'd water every other watering (though I've found a couple strains that don't dig that method, fixing that next time i run them) doing so keeps my run off ppm low and I just water with ph'd water for the last 2 weeks, no flush just normal watering. If you're watering every time with fert (and don't have a way to check your PPM) I would at least water with ph'd water the last week or 2 and if your ppm is way up there like I mentioned before… I'd do a flush at 2 weeks (run multiple gallons, if you're in 5gal pots use 5gal water is a safe bet) than just water with ph'd water as needed.

Those man mad synthetic nutes are precisely how we grew a bigger better German. How many Germans did you see on a hippie's bayonet?? QED

ceterum censeo Annie has this one. Preharvest flushing is a specialized term for deliberately starving one's plants when they need those tasty juicy Kosher ions the most.
The flushing you describe is distinct, and appending the modifier "preharvest" (technically EVERYTHING we do is in a grow is preharvest) doesn't make the argument come to heel.

 

[Grojak]

I'm sorry if you're having a bad day or if you just want an argument but I'm not giving you one. I know what I speak and I know how to flush. What is you're ppm at 2 weeks (whether you flush or not)?? High PPM means there are lots of nutes still in there and why do people flush? To get rid of nutes, allow the plant to eat up whats left in its roots and prevent it from taking nutes for the last few weeks, and when a flush is complete the PPM is down below 200 (after 2 weeks of flushing the worst I ever saw was a plant still around 400ppm), this will give you a smooth clean smoke, thus the coalition is spot on.

Nope sorry I read it completely through I simply disagree with you. You continue to conflate maintenance flushing with a low osmolarity fluid to pre-harvest flushing they are two very separate animals.

PS Please stop the ad hominem attacks.

 

[Grojak]

Those man mad synthetic nutes are precisely how we grew a bigger better German. How many Germans did you see on a hippie's bayonet?? QED

ceterum censeo Annie has this one. Preharvest flushing is a specialized term for deliberately starving one's plants when they need those tasty juicy Kosher ions the most.
The flushing you describe is distinct, and appending the modifier "preharvest" (technically EVERYTHING we do is in a grow is preharvest) doesn't make the argument come to heel.

Again… whats your PPM at 2 weeks? It's probably 1000+… what is it after 2 weeks of flush? I'm not confusing anything… but if after a 2 week flush I'm not down to 200ppm, I continue to water with just ph'd water until I get the 200ppm, than I know that the plants soaked up about all it can and that I've flushed out about all I can.

 

[Sativied]

Sorry giz2k for cluttering up your thread.

At least you realize your nonsense asshat replies are nothing more than clutter.

The conventional wisdom used to be that the world was flat -- things change -- information changes -- and that's a good thing, but it's also, still, whether you like it or not, the conventional wisdom.

Your analogy does not apply. You didn't suggest in your advice the world is no longer flat. On the contrary, you actually insist that it is because first High Times, DJ, now all those professionals you know...

Newsflash: the world is not flat. And you can continue to be a delusional dick and project your own flaws on me, it won't make the world flat. Welcome in the 21st century.

It's a common misconception, an old myth, that just won't die because ignorant insecure people like yourself just cannot stand being wrong about something - and then so typically project that on others... again you're such a cliche man. Your unfounded ad hominem comments and your desperate attempts to restore your ego by arguing semantics do nothing but show how you think.

 

[cannabineer]

Again… whats your PPM at 2 weeks?

I do not see how this is relevant. My PPM don't bear on the two types of flushing.

It's probably 1000+… what is it after 2 weeks of flush?

Again, I question the relevancy to the argument that drives this thread.

I'm not confusing anything…

but if after a 2 week flush I'm not down to 200ppm, I continue to water with just ph'd water until I get the 200ppm, than I know that the plants soaked up about all it can and that I've flushed out about all I can.

A fine description of prophylactic flushing, as distinct from preharvest flushing. But I might be wrong!

 

[unwine99]

At least you realize your nonsense asshat replies are nothing more than clutter.


Your analogy does not apply. You didn't suggest in your advice the world is no longer flat. On the contrary, you actually insist that it is because first High Times, DJ, now all those professionals you know...

Newsflash: the world is not flat. And you can continue to be a delusional dick and project your own flaws on me, it won't make the world flat. Welcome in the 21st century.

It's a common misconception, an old myth, that just won't die because ignorant insecure people like yourself just cannot stand being wrong about something - and then so typically project that on others... again you're such a cliche man. Your unfounded ad hominem comments and your desperate attempts to restore your ego by arguing semantics do nothing but show how you think.

Wow, school must have been a real struggle. Let me piece it together for you if I must. High Times and DJ Short and others have printed articles and books stating exactly what I said in my first post -- and that's where most growers used to get their information, along with first hand experience. Now, the conventional wisdom used to be that the world was flat and as it turned out that was a misconception, meaning, as it relates to our topic, perhaps all the information that was printed as fact not that long ago, is now misconception -- follow? It ALL may be a COMPLETE misconception and I have no problem with that -- I love to learn -- but my point is that there are still many many great growers who I know personally and who I've learned from personally and who still subscribe to the "old rules" of harvesting, that consistently get paid top dollar for their product -- they produce straight fire. Therefore it's impossible for you to say that it's bad advice unless you're willing to declare right now that cannabis grown before a certain number of years ago and much of the weed today was/is schwag -- give me a break. The conventional wisdom also used to be that a sativa dominant strain HAD to mature to at least 30-50 percent amber so your heart didn't take the keys to your car and race away -- all that weed must have been crap too. So you can cry and whine and "ad hominem" this and "you project" that and "you're a cliche" and blah blah blah -- it doesn't matter to me -- it's guys like you who need to get over themselves and realize that there are a million different ways to grow, dry, and cure this herb -- all of which produce different smells, tastes, and highs. If you really have a problem with the information floating around out there -- right a book and sell a million copies -- until then, grab a tissue and stop making mountains out of mole hills.

 

[hellmutt bones]

^^^^i too agree with unwine9 trics on a sativa sould b 30-50% amber or else u gonna have a bad tripp!

 

[waterdawg]

Here's my take on flushing. I typically do not flush due to the fact I typically grow a new strain every run and its hard to pinpoint the finish. In saying that I have flushed a couple of (hydro) runs after discovering they had a off taste due to additives. The flushing did improve the taste with those particular runs. Does it alter the taste in all instances? I'm not sure. As for trichomes I have seen different types of amber, one being cloudy and one being clear. IMO the clear is not a sign of degradation but when I see cloudy amber I will pull at the first sign. Has anyone here aactually compared the exact same strain after waiting for amber? That would be an interesting read.

 

[Smootherpete]

Mother nature does not flush
I use the same molecules mother nature uses
Therefore I do not flush

I'd try what insidagain suggested. Take a couple clones and then flush one group and don't flush the other and you make the decision for yourself.

Mothernature does flush, when grown in dirt, most leaves yellow towards the end as the plant has sucked all available nutrients from the ground and mother nature does not keep adding nutrients.
That said, I like to know how long a certain strain takes to rippen before making plans for flushing...seeds from the same batch can have 2 week differences between harvest times. Different phenotypes can make the havrest dates vary...after I have grown a plant once and know exactly when to harvest it, I flush 2 weeks prior using 1/4 strength formula on her clones.
Right now, the BC Blueberry i'm growing is ripe at 9 1/2 weeks of 12-12 so I start flushing with 1/4 strength at 7 1/2 weeks.

There is a difference in taste between clones in pro mix and clones grown in coco but I can't say for sure if there is a big difference in taste between flushed coco and unflushed though. I like to flush mostly cause it kinda re-conditions the
coco coir to be re used next time.

 

[Smootherpete]

I flush out of...just because. I don't believe they logic behind it. I mean farmers don't flush vegies right, so when you eat a pepper or tomato shouldn't you taste fertilizer?

Framers DO flush.

 

[Dr. Who]

Framers DO flush.

Hmm, being a FARMER......I sure don't hop on my tractor or use irrigation to spread/spray or water everyday for 1-2 weeks to "flush" anything. I (we) grow Organic veggies of many types (That are sold at farmers markets/Health food stores and the bulk to Spartan Stores for their organic section in produce). The "we" refers to 2 other farms. We have created a "co-op" that does Beef, pork, chicken and like I said, many types of veggies. We run 2 farms for the veggies and one for the meat.

The key to taste is a proper CURE (MM)!

Someone a page back or so said that he's harvesting a plant and will let us know about it in a week.......
Yeah, right,,,,,,GREAT cure dude! If it's even dry yet,,,it's GOING to taste like shit!
NO MATTER how much he "flushed" !!!!!!!!!


Sometimes you simply have to respond to flat out stupidity

 

[curious2garden]

Mothernature does flush, when grown in dirt, most leaves yellow towards the end ........snip..........

This is why I do not argue. If you believe for one minute there's an area of lower osmolarity that leaches salts in the soil away from the plants prior to harvest in the soil you have zero clue of the science behind this. Without that clue I can't even HAVE an argument with you because you do not understand what is going on. Take a basic science class then come back here.

Sigh.......

 

[curious2garden]

Wow, school must have been a real struggle. Let me piece it together for you if I must. High Times and DJ Short and others have printed articles and books stating exactly what I said in my first post -- and that's where most growers used to get their information, along with first hand experience. Now, the conventional wisdom used to be that the world was flat and as it turned out that was a misconception, meaning, as it relates to our topic, perhaps all the information that was printed as fact not that long ago, is now misconception -- follow? It ALL may be a COMPLETE misconception and I have no problem with that -- I love to learn -- but my point is that there are still many many great growers who I know personally and who I've learned from personally and who still subscribe to the "old rules" of harvesting, that consistently get paid top dollar for their product -- they produce straight fire. Therefore it's impossible for you to say that it's bad advice unless you're willing to declare right now that cannabis grown before a certain number of years ago and much of the weed today was/is schwag -- give me a break. The conventional wisdom also used to be that a sativa dominant strain HAD to mature to at least 30-50 percent amber so your heart didn't take the keys to your car and race away -- all that weed must have been crap too. So you can cry and whine and "ad hominem" this and "you project" that and "you're a cliche" and blah blah blah -- it doesn't matter to me -- it's guys like you who need to get over themselves and realize that there are a million different ways to grow, dry, and cure this herb -- all of which produce different smells, tastes, and highs. If you really have a problem with the information floating around out there -- right a book and sell a million copies -- until then, grab a tissue and stop making mountains out of mole hills.

First, white space will help people to actually read your arguments.

Second, if as you say you love to learn learn spelling, then grammar, follow up with with a basic botany class.

Third, just because you have anecdotal experience that seems to fly in the face of science doesn't mean anything except that you have some cool stories, bro.

Fourth, if you understand Sativas, and trust me that's all we imported back in the day (and I was there as an adult), they don't even TURN amber you harvested them clear, that's right. Mexican brick weed was harvested clear.

Fifth, learn about attribution and primary, secondary sources, this will assist you in vetting knowledge.

I could go on and on but you're right about one thing. There are a million and one ways to grow weed. So just go do it and enjoy your superiority. Frankly my side is with science then again I invested the majority of my life into school; mathematics and science. So I guess we simply pays our money and takes our chances eh?

 

[unwine99]

First, white space will help people to actually read your arguments.

Second, if as you say you love to learn learn spelling, then grammar, follow up with with a basic botany class.

Third, just because you have anecdotal experience that seems to fly in the face of science doesn't mean anything except that you have some cool stories, bro.

Fourth, if you understand Sativas, and trust me that's all we imported back in the day (and I was there as an adult), they don't even TURN amber you harvested them clear, that's right. Mexican brick weed was harvested clear.

Fifth, learn about attribution and primary, secondary sources, this will assist you in vetting knowledge.

I could go on and on but you're right about one thing. There are a million and one ways to grow weed. So just go do it and enjoy your superiority. Frankly my side is with science then again I invested the majority of my life into school; mathematics and science. So I guess we simply pays our money and takes our chances eh?

Gee curious, I hate to keep you from casting aspersions in your glass house but you're wrong. I know spelling. I know grammar. I know punctuation. And I know that you're trying your damnedest to fool me into believing that you're some sort of intellectual but you're barking up the wrong tree -- I can see right through it. I also happen to know that Mexican sativa is harvested with amber trichomes because I still smoke the stuff every now and then and I've looked at the trichomes many times. If you're looking for someone to argue with just for the sake of arguing, reach out to sativied -- I'm sure he'll oblige you.

 

[cannabineer]

Mothernature does flush, when grown in dirt, most leaves yellow towards the end as the plant has sucked all available nutrients from the ground and mother nature does not keep adding nutrients.
That said, I like to know how long a certain strain takes to rippen before making plans for flushing...seeds from the same batch can have 2 week differences between harvest times. Different phenotypes can make the havrest dates vary...after I have grown a plant once and know exactly when to harvest it, I flush 2 weeks prior using 1/4 strength formula on her clones.
Right now, the BC Blueberry i'm growing is ripe at 9 1/2 weeks of 12-12 so I start flushing with 1/4 strength at 7 1/2 weeks.

There is a difference in taste between clones in pro mix and clones grown in coco but I can't say for sure if there is a big difference in taste between flushed coco and unflushed though. I like to flush mostly cause it kinda re-conditions the
coco coir to be re used next time.

Mother Nature flushes? That is shattering news for all the farmers who've been planting winter crops. Millions of farmers for hundreds of years, and they've been doing it WRONG! Spread the news!

 

[RM3]

What Mom Nature and Farmers do is called leeching, google it and learn a few things lol