UV LIGHT ON DURING NIGHT DURING FLOWERING PERIOD THEORY!

[Pinworm]

I don't think it is, I think vert takes longer and requires a more complex system to really only break even (over time) with the more simple top lighting system. But if you want monster plants then you want monster plants, who am I to judge.

What's gained is instead of having a 16 inch zone of proper lighting for good bud development you have 8 foot zone of proper lighting for good bud development and no wasted floor space.

You waste at least one full big plants worth of space by hanging a HID down low and vertically without a reflector for a HID vert design.

We are talking about mostly T5/T8 or strips of 1w or less LEDs. These are distributed light sourced that the plants can touch or almost touch. Smaller HIDs can still be used for the ceiling lights. And if you want you can get into floating CFLs, LED bulbs, or rope lights for a perfectionist approach.

Going on your 5th edit, here. Are you quite finished?

 

[ttystikk]

I don't think I would use a HID for vert. Makes you waste a big circle of space around the HID bulb. I think vert is where distributed lighting really shines, it wastes less space since it can be much closer to the plants. That would be florescent or low power LEDs and a lot of them on the walls or even hanging or stranded through the space. Save the HIDs for overhead lighting where a gap can be maintained without costing grow space.

The stupid attachment only grabbed part of the chart, but I don't really like the chart from that bulb you linked to (SON GreenPower Plus), big spike in green and almost no blue, zero UVB from that bulb based on the chart.

I would go with normal HPS over that bulb.

I look for something like 50% red spectrum, 35% blue spectrum (including UVB), and 20% green spectrum. That hits the all the key targets harder than the rest of the spectrum, but also hits every wavelength in visible and a bit beyond.

LOL- he said HID doesn't work in vertical grows...

 

[Pinworm]

LOL- he said HID doesn't work in vertical grows...

It's impossible to respond to him. He seems like he's honestly trying to bring up some facts, but insists on changing his answer to the point where no matter how I respond, I look like some kind of asshole for not addressing the thing he edited in. I would be frustrated if I didn't think it was adorable.

 

[ttystikk]

I don't think it is, I think vert takes longer and requires a more complex system to really only break even (over time) with the more simple top lighting system. But if you want monster plants then you want monster plants, who am I to judge.

What's gained is instead of having a 16 inch zone of proper lighting for good bud development you have 8 foot zone of proper lighting for good bud development and no wasted floor space.

You waste at least one full big plants worth of space by hanging a HID down low and vertically without a reflector for a HID vert design.

We are talking about mostly T5/T8 or strips of 1w or less LEDs. These are distributed light sourced that the plants can touch or almost touch. Smaller HIDs can still be used for the ceiling lights. And if you want you can get into floating CFLs, LED bulbs, or rope lights for a perfectionist approach.

We? Have you actually tried any of this, or are you just talking out your ass?

I've been running vertical exclusively for years now, and no one who's seen it- especially those with experience in commercial warehouse grows- thinks there is any 'wasted space'.

Ditto for your 'intricacy' thing... that's so vague a colander looks watertight by comparison.

I'm being harsh specifically to hold you accountable for what YOU have ACTUALLY DONE. Or, not.

Don't try to blow smoke up our ass with fancy talk- we'll see right through it, every time.

You will be qualified to make judgements about vertical gardens only when you've run a few.

 

[nomofatum]

It's impossible to respond to him. He seems like he's honestly trying to bring up some facts, but insists on changing his answer to the point where no matter how I respond, I look like some kind of asshole for not addressing the thing he edited in. I would be frustrated if I didn't think it was adorable.

just quote my whole post and you show what it said when you were replying. sorry but it's better than having me post 6 times in a row.

 

[Pinworm]

just quote my whole post and you show what it said when you were replying. sorry but it's better than having me post 6 times in a row.

Not if you want to be taken seriously.

 

[nomofatum]

We? Have you actually tried any of this, or are you just talking out your ass?

I've been running vertical exclusively for years now, and no one who's seen it- especially those with experience in commercial warehouse grows- thinks there is any 'wasted space'.

Ditto for your 'intricacy' thing... that's so vague a colander looks watertight by comparison.

I'm being harsh specifically to hold you accountable for what YOU have ACTUALLY DONE. Or, not.

Don't try to blow smoke up our ass with fancy talk- we'll see right through it, every time.

You will be qualified to make judgements about vertical gardens only when you've run a few.

I don't do vert, first vert is actully the trash can setup. But don't be so silly to think that experience is the only teacher. Intelligence + knowledge can teach us just as much if not more than experience. Neither should be reduced in value or shunned.

The fact is that a high power HID requires a spacing from plants otherwise they will burn. Lower power lights do not require that space, so more plants can fit within the same room. The best use of a space from my reading and knowledge, not experience would be a shelved warehouse with top lighting. That way vertical space isn't wasted with the top lighting design. Also tends to be the design used in the biggest hydro companies.

 

[Pinworm]

 

[ttystikk]

I don't do vert, first vert is actully the trash can setup. But don't be so silly to think that experience is the only teacher. Intelligence + knowledge can teach us just as much if not more than experience. Neither should be reduced in value or shunned.

The fact is that a high power HID requires a spacing from plants otherwise they will burn. Lower power lights do not require that space, so more plants can fit within the same room. The best use of a space from my reading and knowledge, not experience would be a shelved warehouse with top lighting. That way vertical space isn't wasted with the top lighting design. Also tends to be the design used in the biggest hydro companies.

Number one, where exactly do you think that 'knowledge and intelligence' originates? If your answer is anything but 'experimentation' then we are done having an 'intelligent' conversation.

Number two, show me that warehouse. I've never seen one remotely like that, and neither have any of my friends- WHO WORK AT THEM.

Your credibility is rapidly draining away... time to go back and plug all the holes in your arguments. Might I suggest duct tape?

 

[nomofatum]

Number one, where exactly do you think that 'knowledge and intelligence' originates? If your answer is anything but 'experimentation' then we are done having an 'intelligent' conversation.

Number two, show me that warehouse. I've never seen one remotely like that, and neither have any of my friends- WHO WORK AT THEM.

Your credibility is rapidly draining away... time to go back and plug all the holes in your arguments. Might I suggest duct tape?

Yes, but not always my experimenting, sometimes mine, sometimes gathered from reading the methods and results of other peoples experiments. Methods being just as or more important than the results.

CSA agriculture, could show you a link, but the example is pretty near by and I don't need to give that away. I wouldn't look to the cannabis industry for inspiration, the brighter minds design the indoor food crop setups. If you want to see space used well look at a Japanese indoor farm setup.

 

[ttystikk]

Yes, but not always my experimenting, sometimes mine, sometimes gathered from reading the methods and results of other peoples experiments. Methods being just as or more important than the results.

CSA agriculture, could show you a link, but the example is pretty near by and I don't need to give that away. I wouldn't look to the cannabis industry for inspiration, the brighter minds design the indoor food crop setups.

Wow, really? I'm sure your accountant just loves this logic.

I'm well aware of who's nearby and what they're up to. Any assumption that they're smarter than us 'Potheads' is probably proven by your 'experience and intelligence' method- as opposed to the 'scientific method'.

 

[Pinworm]

Wow, really? I'm sure your accountant just loves this logic.

I'm well aware of who's nearby and what they're up to. Any assumption that they're smarter than us 'Potheads' is probably proven by your 'experience and intelligence' method- as opposed to the 'scientific method'.

Notice he just edited that post again.....for the 3rd time, I think. I stopped counting after it stopped being adorable.

 

[ttystikk]

Notice he just edited that post again.....for the 3rd time, I think. I stopped counting after it stopped being adorable.

I'm off to bed. All this skewering of his arguments is making me hungry for shish kabobs.

 

[nomofatum]

Wow, really? I'm sure your accountant just loves this logic.

I'm well aware of who's nearby and what they're up to. Any assumption that they're smarter than us 'Potheads' is probably proven by your 'experience and intelligence' method- as opposed to the 'scientific method'.

You miss the point, many people run experiments and don't follow the scientific method or anything close to it, they leave variables, different plants, different lights, growing at different times, ... , those don't get much consideration, experiments only get much consideration by me if they appear to have a decent chance of fairly testing what they intend to test, aka follow something close to the scientific method. You learn from those who came before you, if you could only learn through experience we would never progress. Science is about building upon the knowledge that came before, theorizing and testing. I'm offering theory when I don't have personal experience, but it's based on solid backing and reasoning.

Edit 1: What I said above is why the methods matter as much or more than the results. Results can't be considered proof of anything if there are a bunch of variables between the control and the test.

 

[Pinworm]

I'm off to bed. All this skewering of his arguments is making me hungry for shish kabobs.

Some chow sounds killer. Have yourself a good night.

 

[Pinworm]

You miss my point.....I'm offering theory when I don't have personal experience, but it's based on solid backing and reasoning..

Sounds legit.

 

[nomofatum]

The fact is that a high power HID requires a spacing from plants otherwise they will burn. Lower power lights do not require that space, so more plants can fit within the same room.

Unless either of you can argue with this statement you are just talking shit, aka trolling.

 

[Pinworm]

Unless either of you can argue with this statement you are just talking shit, aka trolling.

How many times are you going to move the goal posts to save what scrap of dignity you might actually have left?

Am I safe to post this, or are you planning on editing in a few zingers later?

 

[Pinworm]

All that knowledge and intelligence and still no response?

 

[BarnBuster]