what it means to be an anarchist in a capitalist society. A discussion on anarchy.
- Thread starter foreverflyhi
- Start date
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
No.
I'm talking about informed consent in the absence of coercion. Children cannot consent to sex for payment as they lack the wherewithal to make informed consent and because a goad exists in society that forces people to submit to working for a compensation that is not determined by themselves but by market demand.
I made no mention of criminal law or legality.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
The bolded is only because of the law
Where does the wherewithal come from when a person turns 18 that allows them to consent?
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
No. I'm a liberal. I've seen anarchy and its implications mean the destruction of modern society. I understand the attraction, but what is needed today is the end of corporate fascism and oligarchy, not the end of government entirely.
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
No it is not only because of the law. When did I mention the age of 18? Again CHILDREN can't make informed consent to sex for payment absent coercion.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
How do you define "child" in this context?
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
I define words with dictionaries. Clearly, you're trying to reduce my argument to legality in order to avoid the thesis of it which is a lack of wherewithal to make informed consent and the presence of coercion that exists when people have to choose between selling labor and eating.
Asking me to define the word child in a debate about pedophilia is also quite a telling question.
Asking me to define the word child in a debate about pedophilia is also quite a telling question.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
You're using ambiguous terms that don't clearly define your position. What does "a lack of wherewithal to make informed consent" mean?
When/how does someone get "the wherewithal to make informed consent"? And if you're not using a legal definition of the word 'consent', then what authority do you derive this information from?
I'm not trying to do anything but understand the different perspectives, don't take it so personally. I'm also getting pretty sick of the repetitiveness of reading the politics section, I think most of us get it, you guys think Rob is a pedophile, do you need to constantly spam that across multiple threads? It detracts from the discussion
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
Actually, you're the right devil's advocate for this. You genuinely are moderate. You're even moderate regarding some pretty vile stuff like rape and racism come to think of it.
So aside from your asinine approach to my arguments which is to claim that I have been vague or that my definitions differ from those of Anarchocapitalists, men's rights activists, racists and rape apologists, I'll take your argument by the horns.
First off, I never called Robroy a pedophile. I never even implied it really. I even went out of my way to point out that I was not making any assumptions based on his repetitive assertion and affirmation of his assertion that pedophilia is consensual.
Secondly, this is extremely pertinent to a discussion on anarchism. Talking about wherewithal to make informed consent and absence of coercion are indeed the most important parts of any discussion regarding anarchism and capitalism. They don't detract from the discussion, THEY ARE THE DISCUSSION.
Wherewithal to make informed consent and absence of coercion only become vague and nebulous concepts in the minds of exploiters.
If you're getting sick of hearing rebukes to vile views, maybe you have vile views.
UncleBuck
Well-Known Member
quick, spam another copy and paste article about muslims you dumb shit.
Padawanbater2
Well-Known Member
I tell you not to take it so personally and your response is to immediately take it as personally as possible and call me moderate on rape and racism.. Extremely mature of you, dude
Whatever, man, you and Buck have been spamming that across multiple threads when they have nothing to do with it. Then all the other dummies get into it and every thread ends up just like the last one; a schoolyard name calling match.. Don't you ever get sick of that? Honest question. What is the value in that? You get nowhere, the other guy gets nowhere, you just waste a bunch of time for nothing and end up more pissed off than before, I know that because I've done it too and it sucks
Peadophilia is not pertinent to a discussion about anarchism
I agree, but wtf does peadophilia have to do with it??? That's the criticism
Then why can't you explain what it means or how/when someone gets it without using the legal definition of it?
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
I would encourage you to consider that the root cause problem with corporate fascism and oligarchy, (coercion based mode of operation) is the same root cause problem that a coercive government embodies and embraces as an integral part of its existence.
To be against coercion wherever it manifests, would make your argument more consistent.
Anarchy is not a thing, it is really the absence of a thing and it doesn't always manifest the same way. It is just the absence of a central authoritarian power structure. What occurs in that absence can manifest many ways, some good, some bad.
A coercive government can, however, never escape its coercive basis.
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
There is so much wrong with this I'm not even going to bother debating it with you.
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Then it should be easy to refute shouldn't it?
ttystikk
Well-Known Member
If only you listened...
Rob Roy
Well-Known Member
Magic dust from the Adult Fairy that is sprinkled on you while you sleep, the night of your 18th Birthday.
foreverflyhi
Well-Known Member
Ah I see, well first off, I get what your saying, but i think you have the wrong idea of anarchism. I think the media did a great job in making people think anarchy is sort of a chaotic scene in which everyone is killing everyone. I personally think anarchy is a transitioning stage of civilization into becoming a true democracy. Instead of a elite ruler or class, the people pave the way into what they see fit for their society and culture.
abandonconflict
Well-Known Member
From start to finish, this post demonstrates a lack of ability to keep up with the arguments you responded to. We reached an impasse.
Particularly telling, was your retort to this: "Wherewithal to make informed consent and absence of coercion only become vague and nebulous concepts in the minds of exploiters."
If you need these concepts defined and laid out for you, your moral compass is broken.
Pretty much everything else you said missed the mark because you think I'm focused on someone being a pedophile or I'm taking personally a comment from yourself. I think you're the one taking it personally.
To answer your question regarding what I get sick of, you have done it since you started posting in the thread. You are retorting to arguments you clearly don't understand, either because you don't want to or because you indeed have the mindset of an exploiter.
You said: "pedophilia is not pertinent to a discussion on anarchism anarchism", you're more focused on it than I am. What a facile and obtuse response. I said wherewithal to make informed consent and absence of coercion are pertinent to a discussion on anarchism. Why are you still dwelling on pedophilia in particular? Guilty conscious?