Spidermite spray causing more damage than good, what's next?

S

Sick of Spider Mites

Member
PS - "You should always test a spray on a smaller area and see what the results are before nuking a plant with it. Just FYI for the future."

I'm probably going to try this as well, :P haha
 
S

SSHZ

Well-Known Member
I should also mention the negative effects of spraying multiple products on your plants. I've researched numerous reports/reviews about this subject and it's definitely NOT GOOD. I guess what I'm saying is that some people state it's best to rotate products you apply for maximum effectiveness........and that's probably true for eliminating mites but it's not healthy for plants. These products build up on the leaves, clogging stomata and although I don't fully understand why- I've read reports about how bad it could be for plant health.

If I was applying numerous things, I'd make sure I'd wash the plants off well with clean water (and let dry) before each new application. But even better than that, stop using everything else and just use what I've recommended from now on. It's also better to try and eliminate issues before switching into flowering.
 
S

SSHZ

Well-Known Member
I'm 99% sure Forbid comes with warnings that it's only to be used on ornamentals.....which basically means not for human consumption in any manner i.e. eating, smoking, etc.

Found it, here's what it says on the warning label:

"RESTRICTIONS Do not use on vegetable gardens. Do not use on plants intended for use as feed or forage. Not for use in commercial greenhouses or nurseries, or on fruit or nut trees"

The above means it can cause cancer if consumed. I've used it, it worked temporarily, BUT it's dangerous if consumed. Here's the entire label if you care to read it all:

http://www.domyownpestcontrol.com/msds/Forbid 4F Ornamental Label.pdf
 
S

Sick of Spider Mites

Member
OK SSHZ and Some Guy :) I wasted no time! I just wanted to ask you a few questions SSHZ if you don't mind since you are the one that has used this tek before and knows whats up.

I will follow the directions from your first post as closely as possible - lights, timing, and all. I just wanted to ask you what you would do if you were in my situation at the moment.

I sprayed these plants probably 3 days ago with "No Spidermites" Spray (that's the actual name), washed them off yesterday with tap h2o, they are under major stress, with more than 25% of leaves dying in 3 days and at least another 15% more aren't looking too good today, that plant might be done, but in regards to my others, they aren't as bad, but still equally stressed out. Washing the leaves on my first plant was what stopped the rapid death of my leaves, so I hope I can catch this one, then I'll just veg it for another month so it gets its leaves back, if it even survives. I got others I can flower as long as they are mite free.

SO - My question to you SSHZ is: Since I already sprayed these plants and put them under stress, are they ok to wait a week or so before I treat again for mites with the new spray? or should I go ahead and spray them now after I give them another wash and let them dry?

Secondly, I am just confused because of your last post in regards to mixing products and using them in alternation, I'm guessing you were meaning other products and not the ones you mentioned. Am I still to follow the directions and mix the Azamax and Monterey accordingly in the same bottle? or should I alternate? if alternating, how?

Do you wash your plants at all with h2o before reapplying? or say before flower? once a month? once a quarter? when I flush, wash the leaves too maybe? idk. (of course not during flower though, only veg)

Tek I will be using: Spray at night, when the lights turn off, but let the plants "cool down" for 15 minutes or so before you spray, and make sure your lights don't come on for 4 hours after spraying. (I use Floros for vegging, so they aren't as powerful as a MH lamp for sure). Water the plants very well, 2-3 hours before spraying. Mix 4 teaspoons of both products into a gallon of water - use for sprayer. (I don't have a gallon sized sprayer) - Make sure to cover every single millimeter of the plant, underneath leaves, stems, even top of soil (am I really to soak the soil? that scares me, so just checking). The key here is to make sure you missed no where, I'm guessing. I'll also be steam cleaning my tent and then spraying with clorox.

I repeat this process in 3 days, then once every week for the next 2 months, then every other week for ever after that for preventative? or once a month? What is your method for making sure they never come back. What's a good preventative spray schedule.

Thanks SSHZ & Some Guy. You've been a great help.

20150415_143857[1].jpg
 
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S

SSHZ

Well-Known Member
I'm not trying to toot my own horn but I'll say this last bit and move on to my Blue Rhino grow.....

I know what I'm talking about, most of these others (but not all) are just small growers with some hair brained comment they've seen elsewhere. I was the General Manager for the 2nd largest organic farm in the country (875 acres) and I helped run a large group of garden stores where most of these products are sold. I know quite a bit more than the average Joe, along with large scale pot growing experience since 1988.

Follow what I've said and you'll take care of your problem. You don't need these other products which could be dangerous to your health. It took me 3 years to completely eliminate my mite problem, learn from my experience, stop the experimenting and be done with it. 3 proper sprays 1 week apart will kill the buggers and eggs dead.......

Good luck to all.........
 
SomeGuy

SomeGuy

Well-Known Member
SSHZ said:
I'm not trying to toot my own horn but I'll say this last bit and move on to my Blue Rhino grow.....

I know what I'm talking about, most of these others (but not all) are just small growers with some hair brained comment they've seen elsewhere. I was the General Manager for the 2nd largest organic farm in the country (875 acres) and I helped run a large group of garden stores where most of these products are sold. I know quite a bit more than the average Joe, along with large scale pot growing experience since 1988.

Follow what I've said and you'll take care of your problem. You don't need these other products which could be dangerous to your health. It took me 3 years to completely eliminate my mite problem, learn from my experience, stop the experimenting and be done with it. 3 proper sprays 1 week apart will kill the buggers and eggs dead.......

Good luck to all.........
Click to expand...

You are also the only other person besides myself (that I have seen) recommend spinosad for mites. I found this out by accident and have been trying to tell people it works. I found it worked better rotating a few different products. 95% of the time i am just using spinosad as prevention.

I am a "home" grower. But I have a solid background, lots of higher education, and close to a decade of cultivation behind me. I only give advice I have personally tried and seen results from.

I too believe if he treats the plants regularly as you outlined he will have no more mites.
 
S

SSHZ

Well-Known Member
Briefly..........sometimes it's better to cut your loses and start over if the problem is too far gone. The plants health is compromised and yield and quality will definitely suffer. For people who are fighting them and losing, kill the plants off, and clean, clean and clean again the room, lights, fans, pots, floor, walls, everything! Then start over, using the Azamax.Monterey around week 3 and 4 and 1st week of flowering- that should do it. I use chlorox bleach to clean at the end of each harvest.......

Personally, when I see any mites, I start removing the worst of the leaves. This alone can greatly reduce the problem, at least temporarily. It wills slow growth, but help you get control of the problem. MIX 4 teaspoons of Azamax and 4 tablespoons of Monterey in a gallon (or 1 teaspoon of Azamax and 1 tablespoon of Monterey in a quart) together and spray. Make sure you keep shaking the container to keep things well mixed while spraying.

What is "NO Spidermites" made out of? Then maybe I can help answer your question. Is it citrus based?

Mix up fresh spray each time. You are spraying the same 2 products each time you spray, once a week.
 
S

Sick of Spider Mites

Member
SSHZ said:
I'm not trying to toot my own horn but I'll say this last bit and move on to my Blue Rhino grow.....

I know what I'm talking about, most of these others (but not all) are just small growers with some hair brained comment they've seen elsewhere. I was the General Manager for the 2nd largest organic farm in the country (875 acres) and I helped run a large group of garden stores where most of these products are sold. I know quite a bit more than the average Joe, along with large scale pot growing experience since 1988.

Follow what I've said and you'll take care of your problem. You don't need these other products which could be dangerous to your health. It took me 3 years to completely eliminate my mite problem, learn from my experience, stop the experimenting and be done with it. 3 proper sprays 1 week apart will kill the buggers and eggs dead.......

Good luck to all.........
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Most definitely man, Thank you for the help. That's why I went and bought the things you recommended. I really think this way will work. I really liked your write up man, you gave me exactly what I was looking for. A complete method for making sure they get removed and that they don't come back. You covered all bases and that's why I went ahead and purchased the two products you told me to.

I just had a few questions, mentioned above, if you don't mind. :3 tell me if you can't see the picture or post and I'll repost it. I posted a pic of the Monterey Garden spray and Azamax bottles I just purchased ^^ haha
 
S

Sick of Spider Mites

Member
Ok, thanks SSHZ, I didn't see your last post when I posted sorry!

Yes you are correct my friend, "No Spider Mites" is a Cintronella/Rosemary based organic spray. It was recommended to me by grasscity and for the most part it worked, for a while. but it honestly kills the leaves if you use too much of it, and theres no directions stating this, warnings online, or anything else, so I was pretty dumbfounded for a minute there.

I really appreciate your help because you actually explained how it works. You explained how to disrupt their complete life cycle and make sure they stay away. That helped alot bro. Thank you.
 
S

SSHZ

Well-Known Member
You can read about Spinosad here.....it's actually a "bacteria".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinosad

We used to use it on thripes when plants were delivered from other growers and the issue was detected. I happened to read something about it working on a wide range of different mites too and that's when I began using it. It was very effective.

Some Guy seems to know his stuff too!!!!!
 
S

SSHZ

Well-Known Member
Sick of Spider Mites said:
Ok so Once a week, spray with both. For the rest of eternity? :P

cleaning each tent as a whole plant passes though (Its easy due to steaming and clorox anyways)
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You should only need to spray 2-3 times to kill off all the mites you are currently having problems with. Then the next crop, spray a few time in veg to stop any problem that might happen. The residual effect last about 30 days, which is plenty long enough to stop a mite population for the grow. Now you are killing them, later use as a preventative.
 
S

Sick of Spider Mites

Member
Ok, Thanks very much man. I really appreciate it. so after the first few times, switch to spraying once every 3 weeks to month? just as preventative? and once 1-2 weeks into flower to ensure no mites made it through?

I'm sorry this probably seems stupid to you, but I'm just a bit confused on how to actual keep them at bay after I take care of them. Trying to get a solid preventative strategy down.

Again, thank you so much for your help.

I should mention that I have a perpetual garden, which has made all this extra tricky. I have one tent for small plants/clones/mothers, one medium sized tent for vegging, and one large tent for flowering, all of which are constantly full of plants. So as for when you say "next crop", theres multiple different stages of flowering and vegging plants in each tent, which are staggered in order to get a harvest every month. I kind of have to treat them all. The only room I've had no mites in yet is the flower room, but I know it's just a matter of time really. Now you see why I'm a little confused on the preventative strategy, I have like 6 stages of plant growth going at the moment.

Thank you sir.
 
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SSHZ

Well-Known Member
Let me be clearer......for an active infestation, the plan to get rid of them should be 3 sprayings of both products together 3 times over a 1 month period. If it's real bad or getting worse, do it more often i.e. once a week over 3 weeks. If you are doing it as a preventative measure (no active mites), two sprays in veg or early flowering should do it. I typically spray in week 3 and 4 of veg when the plants are a little larger. You can safely spray up until week 2 of flowering, after that when the buds are really growing- any spraying can damage or retard bud growth for a short while but they will come back in 3-6 days depending. 2-3 sprays, if done properly, should eliminate any and all infestations of most bugs........

Again, always water the plants a few hours before hand as hydrated plants won't absorb as much of the spray and just do better with a hydrated system. I put one light on at 500 watts in the room, spray quickly but thoroughly, and then lights off for at least 4 hours. Don't run fans either as they will blow the spray off the plants. Just let them dry naturally. Make sure you wipe the light shield glass the next morning- the spray seems to dirty the shield quite a bit.

For your particular problem with multiple rooms (tents) and plants at different stages, spray everything at the same time each time you spray. Mites will easily travel to your plants on your shoes/pets/pants/etc. room to room.
 
S

Sick of Spider Mites

Member
Alright, that's crystal clear my friend. You sir deserve a fat spliff and a hand shake haha. Thank you much SSHZ. You are the man. I really appreciate your help, and I'll shoot you a message here in a few weeks letting you know how it goes.

You are very kind to take so much time out of your day to explain all this to me. If there's anything I can ever help with, just let me know. No clue what that'd be, but I'd be willing to help!

Take care bro, Happy gardening.

:)

I was seriously starting to feel like I was too dumb to grow a plant anymore, I was losing to a microscopic beast! and each time I sprayed for them, it did more damage than good!

At least now I see light at the end of the tunnel. I will follow your directions to the dot. I seriously hope more people see this information, as there is alot of information out there that is definitely incomplete.

Edit - Alright to spraying all at once. I also have my flower garden where one fan pulls the heat of my lamps through 6" tubing, Inlet vents from outside the tent, pulling in fresh air, and then it pushes it right out the back window. I then have another 6" fan with 6" tubing that pulls air out of the tent and filters it through a carbon filter for smell. So my flower tent is the least susceptible to contaminates from ventilation. But I know that's just a matter of time before they jump over, so I'll just make sure to spray and get rid of all of them, and then next plant thats going to flower, gets sprayed 1.5 weeks into flower to make sure its de-pested for flowering. That's my worst fear is web-covered nugget :(.

I really feel like if I spray them and then use this as a preventative spray through veg and early flower, I should be ok, because they will never have a chance to take hold. I hope at least.
 
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SSHZ

Well-Known Member
I can't emphasize the importance of spraying properly for this to work. If you miss JUST 1 MITE, they'll be back. Investing in a plastic gallon sprayer for $17-$20 would probably go a long way towards success too. Hand spray bottles that have to be trigger squeezed won't cut the mustard. I buy the cheapest I can find at ACE Hardware, and replace them often. Keep shaking the contents so the 2 items don't separate out.....shake, shake, shake.

I never did ask what kind of mite you think you have.....if you don't know, can you describe it i.e. color, size, spots?
 
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