can people of color be racist?

londonfog

Well-Known Member
you need to remove the filter you see the world through , all of your victims are black, perhaps that is the way you like to see it
Sorry that your Irish slave talked was debunked so quickly. I tell you what lets play a game called "The DUMB DUMB"
The first person who can't name a famous name to represent their point is a DUMB DUMB.
I will name famous black slaves. You name famous Irish slaves.
Nat Turner
 

dr.gonzo1

Well-Known Member
Sorry that your Irish slave talked was debunked so quickly. I tell you what lets play a game called "The DUMB DUMB"
The first person who can't name a famous name to represent their point is a DUMB DUMB.
I will name famous black slaves. You name famous Irish slaves.
Nat Turner
The Edge

Your turn.
 

skunkd0c

Well-Known Member
Sorry that your Irish slave talked was debunked so quickly. I tell you what lets play a game called "The DUMB DUMB"
The first person who can't name a famous name to represent their point is a DUMB DUMB.
I will name famous black slaves. You name famous Irish slaves.
Nat Turner
so now you are back to denying European slavery or just Irish ?
do you have a problem with Spanish slaves arab slaves?

it would seem your cognitive dissonance is based purely on skin colour

so let me get this straight, you are saying you can't possibly believe that a person with white skin was ever enslaved
you can only accept that black people were enslaved ?
 

londonfog

Well-Known Member
so now you are back to denying European slavery or just Irish ?
do you have a problem with Spanish slaves arab slaves?

it would seem your cognitive dissonance is based purely on skin colour

so let me get this straight, you are saying you can't possibly believe that a person with white skin was ever enslaved
you can only accept that black people were enslaved ?
The Edge

Your turn.
I guess my point is made. No need for me to continue.

Next time stick with facts skunkd0c. Support you local library and stay away from JUST the internet.
 

skunkd0c

Well-Known Member
I guess my point is made. No need for me to continue.

Next time stick with facts skunkd0c. Support you local library and stay away from JUST the internet.
The facts are Irish folk were sold as slaves/servants and many were very badly treated
along with other Europeans, this does not fit in with your (black victim agenda)

ENGLAND'S IRISH SLAVES
by Robert E. West
PEC Illinois State Director*
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Records are replete with references to early Irish Catholics in
the West Indies. Gwynn in Analecta Hibernica, states: 'The
earliest reference to the Irish is the establishment of an Irish
settlement on the Amazon River in 1612."(1) Smith, in Colonists
in Bondage, reports: "a Proclamation of the year 1625 urged the
banishing overseas of dangerous rogues (Irish Political
Prisoners); kidnapping (of Irish) was common."(2)

Condon states that the first considerable emigration from
Ireland to the southern latitudes of America was to Guiana in
1629.(3) Newton declares that Antigua and Montserrat were
occupied as early as 1632 and that many emigrant Irish came out
among the early planters and servants in these islands.(4) Dunn,
in Sugar and Slaves, asserts that, in 1636, Ireland was already a
prime source of supply for servants: as early as 1637, on
Montserrat the Irish heavily outnumbered the English colonists,
and 69 percent of Montserrat's white inhabitants were Irish.(5)
Lenihan writes: in 1650 "25,000 Irishmen sold as slaves in Saint
Kitt's and the adjoining islands, petitioned for a priest..."(6)

In 1641, Ireland's population was 1,466,000 and in 1652,
616,000. According to Sir William Petty, 850,000 were wasted by
the sword, plague, famine, hardship and banishment during the
Confederation War 1641-1652. At the end of the war, vast numbers
of Irish men, women and children were forcibly transported to the
American colonies by the English government.(7) These people were
rounded up like cattle, and, as Prendergast reports on Thurloe's
State Papers(8) (Pub. London, 1742), "In clearing the ground for
the adventurers and soldiers (the English capitalists of that
day)... To be transported to Barbados and the English plantations
in America. It was a measure beneficial to Ireland, which was
thus relieved of a population that might trouble the planters; it
was a benefit to the people removed, which might thus be made
English and Christians ... a great benefit to the West India
sugar planters, who desired men and boys for their bondsmen, and
the women and Irish girls... To solace them."(9)

J. Williams provides additional evidence of the attitude of the English
government towards the Irish in an English law of June 26, 1657:
"Those who fail to transplant themselves into Connaught
(Ireland's Western Province) or (County) Clare within six
months... Shall be attained of high treason... Are to be sent
into America or some other parts beyond the seas..."(10) Those
thus banished who return are to "suffer the pains of death as
felons by virtue of this act, without benefit of Clergy."(11)

The following are but a few of the numerous references to
those Irish transported against their will between 1651 and 1660.

Emmet asserts that during this time, more that "100,000
young children who were orphans or had been taken from their
Catholic parents, were sent abroad into slavery in the West
Indies, Virginia and New England, that they might lose their
faith and all knowledge of their nationality, for in most
instances even their names were changed... Moreover, the
contemporary writers assert between 20,000 and 30,000 men and
women who were taken prisoner were sold in the American colonies
as slaves, with no respect to their former station in life."(12)
Dunn claims in Barbados the Irish Catholics constituted the
largest block of servants on the island.(13) Higham estimated
that in 1652 Barbados had absorbed no less than 12,000 of these
political prisoners.(14) E. Williams reports: "In 1656 Cromwell's
Council of State voted that 1,000 Irish girls and 1,000 Irish
young men be sent to Jamaica."(15) Smith declares: "it is
impossible to say how many shiploads of unhappy Irish were
dispatched to America by the English government," and "no mention
of such shipments would be very likely to appear in the State
Papers... They must have been very considerable in number."(16)

Estimates vary between 80,000 and 130,000 regarding the
amount of Irish sent into slavery in America and the West Indies
during the years of 1651 - 1660: Prendergast says 80,000(17);
Boudin 100,000(18); Emmet 120,000 to 130,000(19); Lingard 60,000
up until 1656(20); and Condon estimates "the number of Irish
transported to the British colonies in America from 1651 - 1660
exceeded the total number of their inhabitants at that period, a
fact which ought not to be lost sight of by those who undertake
to estimate the strength of the Celtic element in this
nation..."(21)

It is impossible to ascertain the exact number of those
unfortunate victims of English injustice during this period, but
we do know the amount was massive. Even though the figures given
above are but estimates, they are estimates from eminent
historians.

The flow of the Irish to the American colonies throughout
the remainder of the 17th century was large and continuous, but
not nearly as massive as between 1651 and 1660. Some of the many
statements by historians give evidence of this Irish tide. Higham
reports that in 1664 the Irish took the place of the French on
St. Bartholomew's.(22) Smith claims that during the four years
leading up to 1675, already 500 Irish servants were brought to
Jamaica by ships from Bristol, England that stopped in Ireland
for provisions.(23) During 1680 on the Leeward Islands, Dunn
posits: "with so many Irish Catholic servants and farmers... The
English planters became obsessed with the fear of popery."(24)
Dunn also states that in Jamaica in 1685 the 2nd Duke of
Aberlmarle, after his appointment by James II, a Catholic,
mustered his chief support from the Irish Catholic small planters
and servants and that the indentured servants who constituted the
island militia were mainly Irish Catholic.(25) In reporting on
Father Garganel's statements, Lenihan claims: "in 1699 Father
Garganel, S.J., Superior of the island of Martinique, asked for
one or two Irish Fathers for that and the neighboring isles which
were 'fill of Irish' for every year shiploads of men, boys and
girls, partly crimped, partly carried off by main force for the
purposes of slave trade, are conveyed by the English from
Ireland."(26)
 

skunkd0c

Well-Known Member
Smith has recorded that "Servants sailed from every port in
the British Isles, but by far the greater number came from
London, Bristol, Liverpool, Dublin and Cork, and, doubtless, it
was principally the merchants of Bristol, Whitehaven and
Liverpool which conducted trade with Ireland."(27) Emmet
clarifies Smith's statement in detail by asserting: "the early
and continued emigration of the Irish to this country during the
17th century has been lost sight of in consequence of this change
to English surnames and from the fact that no vessel was
knowingly allowed to sail from Ireland direct, but by law was
obliged first to visit an English port before clearance papers
could be obtained. Consequently, every Irish emigrant (slave,
servant, etc..) crossing in an Irish or English vessel from
either England or Ireland, appeared in the official records as
English, for the voyage did not begin according to law until the
ship cleared from an English port, and all passengers on arrival
in this country (American Colonies) were rated as English."(28)

It is also of importance to be aware of the fact, as Dunn
confirmed, that most population lists for Barbados, Jamaica and
the Leeward Islands concern only parish registers of the Church
of England, all other people were essentially ignored in the head
count."(29)

The English government variously referred to Irish to be
transported as rogues, vagabonds, rebels, neutrals, felons,
military prisoners, teachers, priests, maidens etc. All
historians call them servants, bondsman, indentured servants,
slaves, etc., and agree that they were all political victims. The
plain facts are that most were treated as slaves. After their
land was confiscated by England, which drove them from their
ancestral homes to forage for roots like animals, they were
kidnapped, rounded up and driven like cattle to waiting ships and
transported to English colonies in America, never to see their
country again. They were the victims of what many called the
immense "Irish Slave Trade."

All writers on the 17th century American colonies are in
agreement that the treatment of white servants or white slaves in
English colonies was cruel to the extreme, worse than that of
black slaves; that inhuman treatment was the norm, that torture
(and branding FT, fugitive traitor, on the forehead) was the
punishment for attempted escape. Dunn stated: "Servants were
punished by whipping, strung up by the hands and matches lighted
between their fingers, beaten over the head until blood ran,"
--all this on the slightest provocation.(30) Ligon, an eyewitness
in Barbados from 1647-1650 said, "Truly, I have seen cruelty
there done to servants as I did not think one Christian could
have done to another."(31)

It is a matter of great importance to realize that most of
the white slaves, servants and small farmers abandoned the West
Indies for the mainland colonies in America. Dunn reports:
"Between 1678 and 1713, Leeward sugar planters became more rich
and powerful and controlled all local councils and assemblies so
white servants and small farmers abandoned the Leeward
Islands."(32) Craven said that between 1643 and 1667, about
12,000 left Barbados for other plantations(33) and Dunn said the
white population of the Leeward Islands was reduced by 30 percent
between 1678 and 1708.(34) According to Craven, in Colonies in
Transition, prior to the 1680's, the hopes which sustained the
Carolina venture continued to depend chiefly upon the migration
of settlers from the older colonies, especially from the West
Indies.(35) Smith asserted that after 1670, the emigration of
whites from the smaller islands at least equalled the
immigration.(36) Condon declared: "In [the] course of time many
of those who had been transported to the West Indies in this
manner found their way to the colonies on the continent, in
search of greater freedom and a more healthful climate."(37)

All writers on the 17th century history agree that between
one-half and two thirds of white immigrants in the British West
Indies and mainland America were servants, most of them severely
mistreated. Most all Irish immigrants were 'servants.' Irish were
almost exclusively Catholic (at least they were when they left
Ireland) and most were of ancient Irish families even though they
appeared in English records as English, if recorded at all.
After 20,000 Puritans arrived in the American colonies from
1630-1640, migration of English colonists all but subsided. Some
writers say after 1640 only a trickle of English colonists
arrived. In 1632, many Irish were on Antigua. In 1637, 69 percent
of whites on Montserrat were Irish. In 1650, 25,000 Irish were on
St. Kitt's and Nevis and some were on other Leeward islands. In
1652, prior to the wholesale transportation of Irish, most of 12
thousand political prisoners on Barbados were Irish.

From 1651 to 1660, between 80,000 to 130,000 Irish were
transported. From 1660-1700, there was a large steady flow of
Irish immigrants. Most whites, especially servants, slaves and
small farmers went to the American mainland for more freedom, a
healthier climate and economic betterment.

There are no verifiable records on the white population of
all the American colonies in the 17th century. Some estimates
include blacks, some do not. Some list only members of the Church
of England. Estimates are made for Barbados for a certain year
while estimates are made for the Leeward Islands for other years.
The same applies to Jamaica and the mainland colonies. One
estimate for the mainland colonies, white and black included, was
given at 204,000 in 1689.

In the absence of reliable records, I believe it is necessary
to take the following into very serious consideration: migration
trends, prolificness of people of varying national origin, laws in
effect in the country from which people migrated; the prevailing
conditions in the country undergoing emigration; the amount of
control the emigrating people had over their own destiny; and the
fact that all American colonies both mainland and the West Indies
were very intertwined,

Well over one-half of white immigrants to the
West Indies during the 17th century were Irish Catholic servants,
most who, in the course of time, abandoned the West Indies for
the mainland American colonies.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
*This article comes from the newsletter of the:
Political Education Committee (PEC)
American Ireland Education Foundation
54 South Liberty Drive, Suite 401
Stony Point NY 10980
1-914-947-2726
 

UncleBuck

Well-Known Member
He sells pot on the black market in a legal state.

There are no words for his stupidity and level of hypocrisy, that is why he is the one permanent member of my ignore list.
no, it's because i stopped giving you a pass on your racism then you had a complete and utter meltdown.

it was hilarious.
 
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