Sharing proven soil recipe!

[phil k]

im not here to sell my shit I've said it over and fucking over you do not like it don't draw attention to it and dis me or the soil as if you know anything about it. I'm here to help people all i did was say this guys soil program has a bit more amending needed to have a proper flower and every jumps me as if i don't know what the fuck I'm saying.

 

[greasemonkeymann]

no ass its first off 4$ a lb in small bags and its $3.80 a lb in larger purchases. please tell em what i make the ski for!? since you seem to know I'm doing this for MASSIVE fucking profis... why do i own a construction company if this soil company is so fucking profitable and I'm "raping people" please you know shit about whats in the soil nor do you know the ratios and costs that go into it so shut up and talk about something you actually know and not something your coming to a board lying about or misrepresenting like you have used the product or know anything about it.

you insist on being a cantankerous argumentative person don't you? I hope your customer service skills don't reflect that attitude...
I didn't say you were raping people, and you disrespected me again, you are immature, and don't understand the concept of organics, keep layering your shitty soil and have a nice life taking people's money.
you are a typical mouthy internet guy that talks shit when people disagree with you.
You were the one saying it was 5 dollars a lb, why that makes me an ass, i can't inderstand, but whatever your prices are... they are much higher than what anybody that has half an understanding on organics can do.

 

[phil k]

you insist on being a cantankerous argumentative person don't you? I hope your customer service skills don't reflect that attitude...
I didn't say you were raping people, and you disrespected me again, you are immature, and don't understand the concept of organics, keep layering your shitty soil and have a nice life taking people's money.
you are a typical mouthy internet guy that talks shit when people disagree with you.
You were the one saying it was 5 dollars a lb, why that makes me an ass, i can't inderstand, but whatever your prices are... they are much higher than what anybody that has half an understanding on organics can do.

no 20$ for 5lbs I'm very sorry if i misstated that.. then was rude about you restating my misstatement i didn't mean to mis post the price. but its cheaper than that even in larger purchases

 

[st0wandgrow]

no ass its first off 4$ a lb in small bags and its $3.80 a lb in larger purchases. please tell em what i make the ski for!? since you seem to know I'm doing this for MASSIVE fucking profis... why do i own a construction company if this soil company is so fucking profitable and I'm "raping people" please you know shit about whats in the soil nor do you know the ratios and costs that go into it so shut up and talk about something you actually know and not something your coming to a board lying about or misrepresenting like you have used the product or know anything about it.

Somebody linked your soil on eBay the other day. $22 for a 5lb bag.

You keep talking about your "system". So far all I can ascertain about your "system" is that you put the amended soil on the bottom of the container (which is backwards), then you have the grower bubble the water and add acid to the water to regulate ph. Some system.

You either don't know what you're taking about, or you're trying to appeal to the casual synthetic gardener that's looking for a new "system" and doesn't realize how easy and inexpensive it is to build their own soil.

You keep saying that you're not here to sell soil, but I have yet to see you come off of the super secret ingredients for your hot soil. Just here to help eh?

 

[Flaming Pie]

Phil,
I would like to take this opportunity to point out several flaws in your "system".
You took the time to critique my mix without first trying it so I will return the favor. I will also be doing my best to make your big head explode

1- It's a system.

2- Your website states "always ph your water". What? It is commonly known that one of the beautiful things about soil growing is that we don't have to worry about ph issues..in properly balanced soil. Your system takes away the ease of simply watering your soil straight from the tap. Now we have to buy containers, stage the water, ph it and then apply it. This is a big deal for those of us with large grows. The fact that you have to balance your water tells me your soil is not balanced.

3- Layering. From what I understand, per the pics on your website, the soil will be layered with the recommended promix on top and your blend on bottom at what looks to be a 60%\40% ratio of pro to kind. You show that the roots will sit on top of the kind blend and feed as needed. This creates a number of large problems during the veg cycle. (1) when your roots only utilize the top half of your pot then you have made unavailable to your plant half of the total moisture held in that pot. This is a HUGE deal in hot summer months. (2) when your roots are not grown into the bottom of the pot, the moisture in the bottom becomes stagnant and will promote an anaerobic environment in your pot..bad for roots, bad for micro organisms.

4- I see that you condone vegging up to 6mos in 10 gallon pots. We all know we will not see max plant potential with this practice. For customer sake you may want to present some larger soil quantity examples. Your site states that you will never see chemical burns. Well, this is true in the sense that it won't be "chemicals" burning your plants but from the pics you provided above we will see some burning.

5- Micro organisms need a natural well balanced rhizosphere. There will not be enough organic material in the promix for a micro organism to do what it does best and there will be an inhospitable environment for micros in your bottom layer. You have killed the very essence of what organic growing is about..the supercharging of soil by living organisms that break down organic matter into highly usable food for plants.

Sir I will put my simple mix against yours any day. You have exhibited ignorance about true organics in many ways. You have "organic" confused with "natural". Put that in your pipe and smoke it!

OMG I love you. I am saving this page to try one day. You have convinced me that you are an intelligent grower. Thanks for the recipe!

 

[phil k]

brother we haven't been on fucking ebay in a long ass time.. and when we were we obviously had different prices.. our soil is clearly priced on the website.. I'm lost at the stupid comment you posted and what purpose it even had? your quoting a old price. yes our price changes just like i F*cking said earlier every chance we can drop our cost we drop our soil cost.
and yes boy id love to share our recipe.. with all you that sit and bitch about me and our system.....

Somebody linked your soil on eBay the other day. $22 for a 5lb bag.

You keep talking about your "system". So far all I can ascertain about your "system" is that you put the amended soil on the bottom of the container (which is backwards), then you have the grower bubble the water and add acid to the water to regulate ph. Some system.

You either don't know what you're taking about, or you're trying to appeal to the casual synthetic gardener that's looking for a new "system" and doesn't realize how easy and inexpensive it is to build their own soil.

You keep saying that you're not here to sell soil, but I have yet to see you come off of the super secret ingredients for your hot soil. Just here to help eh?

 

[st0wandgrow]

brother we haven't been on fucking ebay in a long ass time.. and when we were we obviously had different prices.. our soil is clearly priced on the website.. I'm lost at the stupid comment you posted and what purpose it even had? your quoting a old price. yes our price changes just like i F*cking said earlier every chance we can drop our cost we drop our soil cost.
and yes boy id love to share our recipe.. with all you that sit and bitch about me and our system.....

But you're just here to help, right? Your words not mine.

I would think if you're here to help, and you have a soil recipe that blows everyone else's away, you'd share that recipe... you know, to help people.

 

[phil k]

sure am.. our portions are listed above have it.

 

[phil k]

im lost somehow me answering a post by saying he needs more amendments for a better flower.. comes to me not being helpful cause we aren't listing our recipe... LOL

 

[phil k]

jesus i even told him to swap his rose tone out for garden tone.. it would work much better all around.. but here i am mr.unhelpful ass hole

 

[Dgringo69]

OMG I love you. I am saving this page to try one day. You have convinced me that you are an intelligent grower. Thanks for the recipe!

Lol. Thanks. I will be running a kushberry grow in my mix this outdoor season in 50gal burlap raised beds. I'll journal it. The little ladies are just a couple inches tall at the moment.

 

[Dgringo69]

jesus i even told him to swap his rose tone out for garden tone.. it would work much better all around.. but here i am mr.unhelpful ass hole

I'm glad you said this because this reminded me that for my larger grow this year, I did amend my recipe. I mixed 4 cubic feet with rosé tone. Then upon mixing 8 more cubic feet, I used Plant Tone to carry them through a long veg period. I then mixed those three bales together making it more like 3c Rose Tone and 5c Plant Tone per 4 cubic feet. The straight rose tone recipe works fine for short veg times.

 

[Dr. Who]

Holy shit!

Phil came on and gave an opinion on the OP's post. He never attempted to "sell" the guy anything!
What he does is a system. So is what you do, I do and anyone else who does something different.
I don't like "layering" either.....with that said, I enjoy to "play" with growing and try different things alongside what I do.
I got a good "deal" from Phil to do just that...Try it, for shits and giggles.....I don't agree personally with everything he has in it, or how he does it. But, I sure like the idea of playing with it.
2 strains, Chemdawg (unknown origin, not 91 or #4 cut) and Blue Cheese (BB)
I did 2 plants with his instructions.
2 plants with a differing "layering" set.
And 2 plants my way.....His soil mixed with my base and no layering.
2 plants with my method.
JUST FOR FUN!

I am at the age where I don't trip over my pride and beliefs as much as when I was younger (I wish it was less).

Phil made a good point in his answer to the OP and, a few more in defending his "method".
Is it that you hate it because it's not your method? Is your method so good that everyone else's requires attack.
I'm so taken aback by this infighting over organic growing and it's methods by those that do it.....If it works,,,it works.
Some things/methods work better......I was curious to simply try what he offers so I could make factual comments on it!

In the end, I opened the bag and thought of cat piss,,,,alarming! Not what I would do! But,,,I'm trying it to simply be able to make the needed knowledge base to comment on it's results......Again, I may not agree in practice to some of the amendments he used to make it. I might not agree in practice to how he uses it (method).....But to speak on it without trying it........Leaves a big hole in what I know about IT, to say it's bad or what ever point your trying to make.....

Damn, you would think this was a thread about how fucking good AN is and we should all use that!
After all, he ain't PiK...Boosted!

I'm not at the point of taking pictures of the plants yet....just transplanted a week ago.
One of the plants that hit his method was a tad weak.....I did that on purpose to see what his method does with that in veg.

Maybe I will start pics now and post them all at once down the road......I want to see more and take notes before I start making statements on his product.

Doc

P.S. They are being vegged outdoors and moved into the testing area later.....I'll decide when by how they look.

 

[st0wandgrow]

Holy shit!

Phil came on and gave an opinion on the OP's post. He never attempted to "sell" the guy anything!
What he does is a system. So is what you do, I do and anyone else who does something different.
I don't like "layering" either.....with that said, I enjoy to "play" with growing and try different things alongside what I do.
I got a good "deal" from Phil to do just that...Try it, for shits and giggles.....I don't agree personally with everything he has in it, or how he does it. But, I sure like the idea of playing with it.
2 strains, Chemdawg (unknown origin, not 91 or #4 cut) and Blue Cheese (BB)
I did 2 plants with his instructions.
2 plants with a differing "layering" set.
And 2 plants my way.....His soil mixed with my base and no layering.
2 plants with my method.
JUST FOR FUN!

I am at the age where I don't trip over my pride and beliefs as much as when I was younger (I wish it was less).

Phil made a good point in his answer to the OP and, a few more in defending his "method".
Is it that you hate it because it's not your method? Is your method so good that everyone else's requires attack.
I'm so taken aback by this infighting over organic growing and it's methods by those that do it.....If it works,,,it works.
Some things/methods work better......I was curious to simply try what he offers so I could make factual comments on it!

In the end, I opened the bag and thought of cat piss,,,,alarming! Not what I would do! But,,,I'm trying it to simply be able to make the needed knowledge base to comment on it's results......Again, I may not agree in practice to some of the amendments he used to make it. I might not agree in practice to how he uses it (method).....But to speak on it without trying it........Leaves a big hole in what I know about IT, to say it's bad or what ever point your trying to make.....

Damn, you would think this was a thread about how fucking good AN is and we should all use that!
After all, he ain't PiK...Boosted!

I'm not at the point of taking pictures of the plants yet....just transplanted a week ago.
One of the plants that hit his method was a tad weak.....I did that on purpose to see what his method does with that in veg.

Maybe I will start pics now and post them all at once down the road......I want to see more and take notes before I start making statements on his product.

Doc

P.S. They are being vegged outdoors and moved into the testing area later.....I'll decide when by how they look.

My problem with Phil and his soil is simple. He's making some outrageous claims, and he comes off as a know it all asshole. His claims about how much better the weed will taste, and how much more you'll yield with his "system" is nonsense. There is no magic bullet with organics. It doesn't matter if he's using kelp meal, bat shit, rock fines, etc.... the plant only takes up nutrients as fast as the microbes will deliver it. Unless he's found a way to feed the microbes steroids, then I don't see how he can substantiate his claims. Considering he's using bagged castings, I seriously doubt that his micro herd is anything special.

If he wasn't such a loud mouth I might give his soil a try. As it stands, I wouldn't try it if he paid me to. He's the pk_boosted of organics.

 

[greasemonkeymann]

My problem with Phil and his soil is simple. He's making some outrageous claims, and he comes off as a know it all asshole. His claims about how much better the weed will taste, and how much more you'll yield with his "system" is nonsense. There is no magic bullet with organics. It doesn't matter if he's using kelp meal, bat shit, rock fines, etc.... the plant only takes up nutrients as fast as the microbes will deliver it. Unless he's found a way to feed the microbes steroids, then I don't see how he can substantiate his claims. Considering he's using bagged castings, I seriously doubt that his micro herd is anything special.

If he wasn't such a loud mouth I might give his soil a try. As it stands, I wouldn't try it if he paid me to. He's the pk_boosted of organics.

I never had a problem with him until he disrespected me...
Although his attitude leaves a lil to be desired.
Even his own pictures reveal my main complaint with the layering phenomena.
The pictures show little to no roots in that bottom part of the soil, anyone that has grown herb for any amount of time can plainly attest that cannabis' roots will "dive" to the bottom of the soil, almost within hrs of transplanting, in about 3-5 days I see white fuzzy roots out the bottom of my SMARTPOTs, that's through the fabric.
In his pictures you plainly see the roots almost air-pruning themselves when they get to that rich soil.
just look at the pictures.
Also his statement of the plant needing "pure" water, because the nutrients will somehow taint the water and damage the plant...
When his soil is being constantly watered down, and diluted each and every watering, until it's finally conducive to roots growing in it.
That is my complaint.
Also he has proven himself over and over to be rather rude, shaming others' plants and such, that's just, in my opinion? Not needed. and Not helpful.
I even was reluctant to go and point out these observations until he provoked me, anyone that knows me, will attest to me being rather mellow, unless provoked.

 

[Flaming Pie]

Rose tone is 4-3-2 but only 2.6 percent of it is slow release nitrogen.

So after the first couple waters it turns into 2.6-3-2. (Consider you do not put the plant into this mix until a week or two goes by. Then two weeks of watering brings the npk ratio down in nitrogen. One month old plant. Most people flower within 1 to 1.5 months of veg.)

Addition of green sand brings it up to 2.6-3-8 Because it contains 6% slow release potassium. Also contains alot of trace minerals. Espoma says it contains magnesium too.

When the plants are smaller they will be using up the soluble nitrogen and then when they get larger they will feed from the mix that breaks down.

8 cups of rose tone and 10 cups of green sand bring that to 18 cups of amendment plus the ewc creates a great environment for the Mycorrhizae and you also have the beneficial bacteria from the espoma to help as well.

I flower with 1-3-3 (after giving 2-1-3 for veg and transitioning them past the stretch) in a mix that is just Promix HP and approximately 10-12 cups of EWC mixed in a 20 gallon tote.

Espoma recommends 3 cups of rose tone to 1.5 cubic feet of soil. Or 1 cup per half cubic foot or twice the cups to cubic foot.So lets figure out the ratio of his recipe.

3.5 cubic feet = 8 cups rose tone.

Following espomas directions :

3.5 cubic feet would equal 7 cups of rose tone.

But he also added EWC. Does anyone know the cubic footage of 20lbs? I am going to assume 1 cubic foot.

With the addition of EWC and greensand I would say that his recipe should be pretty good. One more cup of rose tone if it were me tho.

4.5 cubic feet should equal 9 cups of rose tone.

 

[Flaming Pie]

We shouldnt forget that EWC also adds a minute amount of npk as well.

 

[greasemonkeymann]

Rose tone is 4-3-2 but only 2.6 percent of it is slow release nitrogen.

So after the first couple waters it turns into 2.6-3-2. (Consider you do not put the plant into this mix until a week or two goes by. Then two weeks of watering brings the npk ratio down in nitrogen. One month old plant. Most people flower within 1 to 1.5 months of veg.)

Addition of green sand brings it up to 2.6-3-8 Because it contains 6% slow release potassium. Also contains alot of trace minerals. Espoma says it contains magnesium too.

When the plants are smaller they will be using up the soluble nitrogen and then when they get larger they will feed from the mix that breaks down.

8 cups of rose tone and 10 cups of green sand bring that to 18 cups of amendment plus the ewc creates a great environment for the Mycorrhizae and you also have the beneficial bacteria from the espoma to help as well.

I flower with 1-3-3 (after giving 2-1-3 for veg and transitioning them past the stretch) in a mix that is just Promix HP and approximately 10-12 cups of EWC mixed in a 20 gallon tote.

Espoma recommends 3 cups of rose tone to 1.5 cubic feet of soil. Or 1 cup per half cubic foot or twice the cups to cubic foot.So lets figure out the ratio of his recipe.

3.5 cubic feet = 8 cups rose tone.

Following espomas directions :

3.5 cubic feet would equal 7 cups of rose tone.

But he also added EWC. Does anyone know the cubic footage of 20lbs? I am going to assume 1 cubic foot.

With the addition of EWC and greensand I would say that his recipe should be pretty good. One more cup of rose tone if it were me tho.

4.5 cubic feet should equal 9 cups of rose tone.

one thing to consider, if you are looking at greensand, is that it does almost nothing for at least six months if not a yr, I love greensand, for re-using your soil it's a great addition, but for it to be the primary mineral, I would change that, but if I remember correctly the tones will hae some mineral in it.
Forget about all the NPK talk.
Go look at a forest or a field, its green as hell, and nobody is giving them anything.
It's all from the soilweb already.
the NPK stuff is more for hydro growers that are growing in an inert media (or close to it).

 

[Flaming Pie]

one thing to consider, if you are looking at greensand, is that it does almost nothing for at least six months if not a yr, I love greensand, for re-using your soil it's a great addition, but for it to be the primary mineral, I would change that, but if I remember correctly the tones will hae some mineral in it.
Forget about all the NPK talk.
Go look at a forest or a field, its green as hell, and nobody is giving them anything.
It's all from the soilweb already.
the NPK stuff is more for hydro growers that are growing in an inert media (or close to it).

So maybe just add more rose tone? 9-10 cups would provide more than enough. EWC would provide trace minerals.

 

[Pattahabi]

I have a lot to say, and not a lot of time atm. So a couple of things. On average EWC weigh about 4-5 lbs per gallon. So 20lbs should be around 4-5 gallons (cu ft is 7.5 gallons).

Second, the reason people jump all over Phil is because he doesn't have the slightest sense of how the soil food web works and his "system" exemplifies this. This is why people keep referring back to "his system". If he can't get that right, then he has no business talking smack about the way other people garden. Then there is the whole price thing. $20 for 5lbs? So like $20 a gallon. Let's see, I have 5 x 100 gallon pots, so that would be what, like $10,000 in soil! Woohoo, I'm rich! LMAO!!!

This ain't rocket science...

P-