LED vs HPS

[budterrorizt]

Not to bust into another arguement here but i have always understood that lumens dont really matter when comparing led to hps.... I have been through roughly 6 different led and hps setups, the best led lights are the ones that are backed by testing and knowledge and most importantly that offer the best PAR spectrum, because honestly hps sucks for full par spectrum, dont care whT bulbs and other stuff people put up, nothing compares to led when it comes to full PAR output. Most importantly.... Alot of people talk about led lights, but lets talk brands, actual wattage usuage and full testing compared to hps.... These cheap crap china lights are whats making led growing so poopy! I went down that road and it sucked.... But man when i got my hands a lumigrow and a solarstorm!! Yeah thats a huge difference!!

One thing to inwas told by a very VERY seasoned and well known grower is this, your gonna pay damn near $1 a watt when it comes to led.... If its 49$ for a 180w ufo ..... Your wasting your time and money, not to mention embarrassing yourself and everyone else growing under led!!!

I have had numerous grows under led, went back to hps and absolutely hate it, thats why im switching back after this harvest.... If done properly, you will otice the difference and begin to see what everyone is talking about. I gained weigt, density with the loss of heat and had fewer defcs as well, and considering i use dwc, my buckets and res stayed roughly 10-15' cooler.... And they are insulated as well.

In a nutshell everyone has they own way of doing things, i make my fried chicken in buttermilk and cornmeal, but my gma makes it with egg and flour... But boh are very effective and taste great!!!

 

[fishdeth]

Anyone mentioned these?
CDM... Ceramic Discharge Metal halide
1 lamp for Veg AND Flower.
315 Watts, outperforms 600W HPS/MH
Way better light spectrum, AND it runs WAY cooler than a 400W HPS/MH

I am LOVING this baby !!!

 

[DirtyMcCurdy]

How do they compare to double ended bulbs? Or the newer ceramic metal halide, or ceramic discharge metal halide. The spectrum of the ceramic halides is about unbeatable in my opinion. >92 cri.

Not to bust into another arguement here but i have always understood that lumens dont really matter when comparing led to hps.... I have been through roughly 6 different led and hps setups, the best led lights are the ones that are backed by testing and knowledge and most importantly that offer the best PAR spectrum, because honestly hps sucks for full par spectrum, dont care whT bulbs and other stuff people put up, nothing compares to led when it comes to full PAR output. Most importantly.... Alot of people talk about led lights, but lets talk brands, actual wattage usuage and full testing compared to hps.... These cheap crap china lights are whats making led growing so poopy! I went down that road and it sucked.... But man when i got my hands a lumigrow and a solarstorm!! Yeah thats a huge difference!!

One thing to inwas told by a very VERY seasoned and well known grower is this, your gonna pay damn near $1 a watt when it comes to led.... If its 49$ for a 180w ufo ..... Your wasting your time and money, not to mention embarrassing yourself and everyone else growing under led!!!

I have had numerous grows under led, went back to hps and absolutely hate it, thats why im switching back after this harvest.... If done properly, you will otice the difference and begin to see what everyone is talking about. I gained weigt, density with the loss of heat and had fewer defcs as well, and considering i use dwc, my buckets and res stayed roughly 10-15' cooler.... And they are insulated as well.

In a nutshell everyone has they own way of doing things, i make my fried chicken in buttermilk and cornmeal, but my gma makes it with egg and flour... But boh are very effective and taste great!!!

I knew someone would bring PAR up... again. Eye hortilux came out with new T5 bulbs. In their own advertisement against "the leading competitor" they showed their lamps, with a meter, offer WAY LESS PAR. They pretty much claim PAR isn't nearly as important as all you guys keep preaching... "Its not lumens, its par". I figure they know more than any of us since they design freakin bulbs! All these numbers and charts make me want to fucking bust out laughing. You guys are way over thinking this whole thing.

 

[DirtyMcCurdy]

Anyone mentioned these?
CDM... Ceramic Discharge Metal halide
1 lamp for Veg AND Flower.
315 Watts, outperforms 600W HPS/MH
Way better light spectrum, AND it runs WAY cooler than a 400W HPS/MH

I am LOVING this baby !!!

View attachment 3522202 View attachment 3522203

Agree. I'm running those exact bulbs. Spectrum is awesome. No more HPS and regular MH. Now I just run these in place of both. Awesome, effective and cheap. Kind of the opposite of leds

 

[ttystikk]

Anyone mentioned these?
CDM... Ceramic Discharge Metal halide
1 lamp for Veg AND Flower.
315 Watts, outperforms 600W HPS/MH
Way better light spectrum, AND it runs WAY cooler than a 400W HPS/MH

I am LOVING this baby !!!

View attachment 3522202 View attachment 3522203

The 315W light will perform like 400W of HPS. Don't believe the hype. Btw, it's the ballast that makes it better, I've been running the 860W CDM lamps for years.

 

[Michael Huntherz]

Awesome, effective and cheap. Kind of the opposite of leds

You mean traditional LEDs, of course. The COB LES (Light Emitting Surface) type like Cree CXB and Bridgelux Vero 29s are expensive, no doubt, and one pretty much has to DIY. But they are awesome (efficient) and effective (frosty and near 2g/W results) beyond anything else. Yes, I'm asserting that. Thanks to @ttystikk I'm a believer in the CDM stuff, but I am headed the LES route myself. The efficiency of something like the 36V CXB3590 (CB-DD bin) is unbeatable. Maybe you're just trolling, I don't know, but it made my butthole itch when I read that.

 

[MonsterDrank]

if all you can afford is a cheapy led,, dont get it,, go with HID . Mh instead or DIY or area 51

AGREED.

Listen to Tim. Stay away from the cheap Chinese garbage.

Unless you have real cash to spend on a nice light.. avoid LED. Those Mars Hydro Lights are junk.
I run both HPS and LED, but I invested close to $1k on my LED light.. at the lower price level you'd be much better off grabbing a cheap ballast and bulb. You'd get much better performance and something that probably won't break within the first year of turning it on.

 

[ttystikk]

You mean traditional LEDs, of course. The COB LES (Light Emitting Surface) type like Cree CXB and Bridgelux Vero 29s are expensive, no doubt, and one pretty much has to DIY. But they are awesome (efficient) and effective (frosty and near 2g/W results) beyond anything else. Yes, I'm asserting that. Thanks to @ttystikk I'm a believer in the CDM stuff, but I am headed the LES route myself. The efficiency of something like the 36V CXB3590 (CB-DD bin) is unbeatable. Maybe you're just trolling, I don't know, but it made my butthole itch when I read that.

I'm a believer in CDM lighting, but if there's something better- read more efficient- I'm all over it.

 

[ttystikk]

AGREED.

Listen to Tim. Stay away from the cheap Chinese garbage.

Unless you have real cash to spend on a nice light.. avoid LED. Those Mars Hydro Lights are junk.
I run both HPS and LED, but I invested close to $1k on my LED light.. at the lower price level you'd be much better off grabbing a cheap ballast and bulb. You'd get much better performance and something that probably won't break within the first year of turning it on.

For @Deadlytalon2014 and others new to the LED grow lighting industry; Here's the inside story, just to spell it out; us growers have discovered a better lighting system than HID. The newest COB LED chips, underdriven to boost efficiency, produce more bud per watt than anything else out there. These are NOT the 'blurple' lights you may have seen in the past.

Trouble is, the established LED manufacturers are still stuck with a supply line full of the old stuff and they don't want to/can't upgrade that fast.

Again, us growers have a solution; DIY lighting systems. You buy COB chips, drivers, heat sinks and some assorted bits like COB holders, lenses, thermal paste and wiring and build your own world class lighting system.

It's not even that expensive and the chips will last for a lifetime of growing... not sure on the drivers but they last a long time too.

In five years COB LED will be hailed by the industry as an electricity conserving messiah. At that point you won't be able to give away a used HID setup. By then the manufacturers will be up to speed producing panels with the new chips for retail and the usual hype will ensue.

Meanwhile, the DIY lights you've built will still be quietly doing their job. Cheap.

Some people will read this and laugh. Check back with me in five years and we'll see who's right.

 

[Michael Huntherz]

For @Deadlytalon2014 and others new to the LED grow lighting industry; Here's the inside story, just to spell it out; us growers have discovered a better lighting system than HID. The newest COB LED chips, underdriven to boost efficiency, produce more bud per watt than anything else out there. These are NOT the 'blurple' lights you may have seen in the past.

Trouble is, the established LED manufacturers are still stuck with a supply line full of the old stuff and they don't want to/can't upgrade that fast.

Again, us growers have a solution; DIY lighting systems. You buy COB chips, drivers, heat sinks and some assorted bits like COB holders, lenses, thermal paste and wiring and build your own world class lighting system.

It's not even that expensive and the chips will last for a lifetime of growing... not sure on the drivers but they last a long time too.

In five years COB LED will be hailed by the industry as an electricity conserving messiah. At that point you won't be able to give away a used HID setup. By then the manufacturers will be up to speed producing panels with the new chips for retail and the usual hype will ensue.

Meanwhile, the DIY lights you've built will still be quietly doing their job. Cheap.

Some people will read this and laugh. Check back with me in five years and we'll see who's right.

I've been making these same sort of predictions for about a year now. I could not agree more.
There are a lot of people who simply refuse to believe the day will come when "you won't be able to give away a used HID setup." - but I think those folks should think about how the local buggy-whip salesman must have felt when motorized carriages (automobiles) hit the scene. "Just a fad, it will never catch on. That's unreliable, unproven technology" they must have said. People felt the same way about computers, too. In 1980 it was assumed by most people and businesses alike that there was no real consumer market for computers. 35 years later and it is hard to imagine we ever believed such things. When I was a kid I had a rotary phone, now I have an incredible touch-screen computer in my pocket, and it makes calls too. Progress is inevitable, and COBs are going to kill everything else, soon.

Too bad we can't all just grow in the sun, like it was meant to be. It's like, free, man. Unless of course some cock-headed billionaires figure out how to sell it to us and put us in jail for unauthorized use. I'm sure they have people working on it.

 

[fishdeth]

I'm a believer in CDM lighting, but if there's something better- read more efficient- I'm all over it.

More efficient would be cool, but with my small grow, I don't care.
This thing is WAY brighter than my backup 400W HPS/MH setup, and the spectrum is SO much better and my plants will attest to how much they like it.
In my honest opinion, it is WAY better, and I keep my old system on standby for emergency backup, but I would be SCRAMBLING to get another CDM back up and running ASAP should anything fail!
I'm just a little guy growing for wifey's meds and our own personal use, only 2 plants at a time.
I get very up close and personal with my garden and I noticed right away the dif in this lamp/ballast setup
It's the bee's knees I tell ya !

 

[ttystikk]

More efficient would be cool, but with my small grow, I don't care.
This thing is WAY brighter than my backup 400W HPS/MH setup, and the spectrum is SO much better and my plants will attest to how much they like it.
In my honest opinion, it is WAY better, and I keep my old system on standby for emergency backup, but I would be SCRAMBLING to get another CDM back up and running ASAP should anything fail!
I'm just a little guy growing for wifey's meds and our own personal use, only 2 plants at a time.
I get very up close and personal with my garden and I noticed right away the dif in this lamp/ballast setup
It's the bee's knees I tell ya !

Oh yeah. Spectrum is fantastic, isn't it?

 

[house34]

I just took my Mars hydro out of my box, the Mars hydro ran to hot, go to led section and look at thread another Mars in the dumpster, none of those three or five watt LED can compete with a hid mh light, the only LED we recommend around here is cob lights, come over to led section and see for yourself

Grown under Mars Hydro II 700w w/ 5 watt leds.

 

[harris hawk]

There is some talk about LED's not producing the "specifications" listed - concerning strength and spectrum - Still feel that LED's need a bit more time to "dial" in their products - and maybe in time the price will come down - don't get me wrong Led's do work like any other light system but would still choose HPS or CFL's for now

 

[Tim Fox]

View attachment 3524221
Grown under Mars Hydro II 700w w/ 5 watt leds.

I call bogus, a Mars light would not cover the size tent shown, Mars seems to have thier group of minions who are either new members or they have not posted much, and yet they swear by their Mars panel, the same trash most of us led guys have ditched for diy cob lights

 

[Chex lemeneux]

View attachment 3524221
Grown under Mars Hydro II 700w w/ 5 watt leds.

think i see a nanner in there, better watch out for seeds.

 

[nk14zp]

I'm a believer in CDM lighting, but if there's something better- read more efficient- I'm all over it.

Do cdm bulbs need different ballasts than mh/hps?

 

[Tim Fox]

Do cdm bulbs need different ballasts than mh/hps?

yes

 

[Siino Gardens]

I call bogus, a Mars light would not cover the size tent shown, Mars seems to have thier group of minions who are either new members or they have not posted much, and yet they swear by their Mars panel, the same trash most of us led guys have ditched for diy cob lights

They do however veg better than cfls , much tighter node spacing and shorter plants are a positive of using the mars hydro for veg. Plus you can replace a cfl fixture for about the same price. I am flowering under some cheap chinese leds on one side and some more expensive ones on the other. Gonna see what I can get out of them.

You seem to try and speak for the whole forum when you talk about cobs, while many agree that cobs are the way to go I have seen plenty of success on these forums using 3w and 5w diodes. Honestly the only thing you don't get is coverage space.

Just saying, maybe you shouldn't make blanket statements it doesn't do anything but make a toxic conversation.

 

[Tim Fox]

They do however veg better than cfls , much tighter node spacing and shorter plants are a positive of using the mars hydro for veg. Plus you can replace a cfl fixture for about the same price. I am flowering under some cheap chinese leds on one side and some more expensive ones on the other. Gonna see what I can get out of them.

You seem to try and speak for the whole forum when you talk about cobs, while many agree that cobs are the way to go I have seen plenty of success on these forums using 3w and 5w diodes. Honestly the only thing you don't get is coverage space.

Just saying, maybe you shouldn't make blanket statements it doesn't do anything but make a toxic conversation.

Dude,, sadly Mars housings are about the least efficient led out there, they make more heat than they do light,, sadly, if you already own CFL's I would just keep using those,, if you need a veg light you would be FAR BETTER off building a cob fixture from 5000k cobs, several guys have build threads here for veg lights,