Organic vs. Synthetic Nutrients

Darth Vapour

Well-Known Member
truth fully speaking this thread is organic vs Synthetic is it not ?? there fore its relevant to say not only does Chem nutrients grow plants faster it also proves that chemical out yield s organics
one line is readily available and other needs to be broken down to become available doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out .. I grow organic out door and start off plants indoor organic but as i feed them i feed them Chemical not only do my plants excell in growth there healthy as fuck.
people tend to think that cause growing organic all pesticides are also organic therefore its safer ..
but little do people actually know that organic farming does in fact use chemical pesticides
Ask your self one thing if your plant is infested with mites do you put 10 applications of organic pesticide or one chemical pesticide to rid the problem
and whats the odds that the 10 applications to the plant will infact be more in trace elements of the pesticide in the plant ..
think about it
And what about the amendments added to soil remember organic is not fertilizer but a soil conditioner and why cause they cannot guarntee percentages huge difference my friends and most importantly break down to natures rules ?? how dialed in is your room compared to outside environment

The words “organic” or “natural” in this case simply means that the product is only minimally processed, and the nutrients remain bound up in their natural forms, rather than being extracted and refined. In the case of fertilizer, “organic” does NOT refer to the standards of processing associated with food.

Organic fertilizer is usually made from plant or animal waste or powdered minerals. Examples include manure and compost, as well as bone and cottonseed meal. They are usually sold as “soil conditioners” rather than as fertilizer, because the nutrient ratios are difficult to guarantee. Organic fertilizers may be processed in a factory, or, in the case of manure and compost, at a farm.

There is also a growing selection of more highly processed products now available, with labeled analysis of nutrients and contents. For example, Scotts Miracle-Gro Organic Choice Plant Food is a manufactured product composed entirely of chicken litter and ground up feathers, with an N-P-K ratio of 7-1-2.Garden Safe Organic Plant Food is made of poultry manure with a label very similar to chemical fertilizers.



Advantages of Organic Fertilizer:

  • In addition to releasing nutrients, as organic fertilizers break down, they improve the structure of the soil and increase its ability to hold water and nutrients. Over time, organic fertilizers will make your soil–and plants–healthy and strong.
  • Since they are the ultimate slow-release fertilizers, it’s very difficult to over fertilize (and harm) your plants.
  • There’s little to no risk of toxic buildups of chemicals and salts that can be deadly to plants.
  • Organic fertilizers are renewable, biodegradable, sustainable, and environmentally friendly.
  • Although rather expensive in packages, you can make your own organic fertilizer by composting or find inexpensive sources—such as local dairy farms—that may sell composted manure.
Disadvantages of Organic Fertilizer:

  • Microorganisms are required to break down and release nutrients into the soil. Since they need warmth and moisture to do their job, the effectiveness of organic fertilizer is limited seasonally. The good news is that these microorganisms obtain energy from decaying plant and animal matter, so an application of organic fertilizer provides a complete package of nutrients for your soil.
  • Organic fertilizers break down according to nature’s rules, so they may not release nutrients as soon as you need them. You have to be patient – you won’t see improvement overnight. In fact, you may actually see a deficiency in your plants during the first couple of months until the first application breaks down. Hang in there! You’ll most definitely be rewarded.
  • Nutrient ratios are often unknown, and the overall percentage is lower than chemical fertilizers. However, some organic products are actually higher in certain nutrients.


Chemical Fertilizers
Chemical fertilizers (also called inorganic, synthetic, artificial, or manufactured) have been refined to extract nutrients and bind them in specific ratios with other chemical fillers. These products may be made from petroleum products, rocks, or even organic sources. Some of the chemicals may be naturally occurring, but the difference is that the nutrients in chemical fertilizers are refined to their pure state and stripped of substances that control their availability and breakdown, which rarely occurs in nature.

Advantages of Chemical Fertilizer:

  • Since nutrients are available to the plants immediately, improvement occurs in days.
  • They are highly analyzed to produce the exact ratio of nutrients desired.
  • Standardized labeling makes ratios and chemical sources easy to understand.
  • They’re inexpensive.


Disadvantages of Chemical Fertilizer:

  • Chemical fertilizers are primarily made from nonrenewable sources, including fossil fuels.
  • They grow plants but do nothing to sustain the soil. The fillers do not promote life or soil health, and even packages labeled “complete” do not include the decaying matter necessary to improve soil structure. In fact, chemical fertilizers don’t replace many trace elements that are gradually depleted by repeated crop plantings, resulting in long-term damage to the soil.
  • Because the nutrients are readily available, there is a danger of over fertilization. This not only can kill plants but upset the entire ecosystem.
  • Chemical fertilizers tend to leach, or filter away from the plants, requiring additional applications.
  • Repeated applications may result in a toxic buildup of chemicals such as arsenic, cadmium, and uranium in the soil. These toxic chemicals can eventually make their way into your fruits and vegetables.
  • Long-term use of chemical fertilizer can change the soil pH, upset beneficial microbial ecosystems, increase pests, and even contribute to the release of greenhouse gases.


Making a Choice
If you wish to live in harmony with nature and make a lasting improvement in your own patch of earth for generations to come, organic fertilizers outweigh chemicals by leaps and bounds.

Can a shot of chemical fertilizer make your containers spill over with blossoms, and give you the biggest tomatoes and greenest lawn in the neighborhood? Absolutely. Just be sure you understand what’s really happening to the earth under your feet, so that you’ll make your choice consciously.
 

Darth Vapour

Well-Known Member
One minute organic gurus are trying to save the carbon foot print of emission gasses so we can breath better yet on other hand polluting our water supply from the leaching of nitrates into our under ground water supply whats it going to be 25 years from now
Headline news Organic farming has become the worst enviromental disaster since the invention of the atom bomb

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/02/140218114311.htm
 

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
truth fully speaking this thread is organic vs Synthetic is it not ?? there fore its relevant to say not only does Chem nutrients grow plants faster it also proves that chemical out yield s organics
one line is readily available and other needs to be broken down to become available doesn't take a rocket scientist to
Disadvantages of Organic Fertilizer:

  • Microorganisms are required to break down and release nutrients into the soil. Since they need warmth and moisture to do their job, the effectiveness of organic fertilizer is limited seasonally. The good news is that these microorganisms obtain energy from decaying plant and animal matter, so an application of organic fertilizer provides a complete package of nutrients for your soil.
  • Organic fertilizers break down according to nature’s rules, so they may not release nutrients as soon as you need them. You have to be patient – you won’t see improvement overnight. In fact, you may actually see a deficiency in your plants during the first couple of months until the first application breaks down. Hang in there! You’ll most definitely be rewarded.
  • Nutrient ratios are often unknown, and the overall percentage is lower than chemical fertilizers. However, some organic products are actually higher in certain nutrients.
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I feel those "disadvantages" are simply not applicable. At least not to me.
All of us organic growers have microbial life out the wazoo.
And when I assemble my compost pile, with all the ingredients in it, and let it compost and age along with the leaves, there is no shortage of nutrients available.
So if those are the "disadvantages"??
I think i'll be just fine.
 

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
One minute organic gurus are trying to save the carbon foot print of emission gasses so we can breath better yet on other hand polluting our water supply from the leaching of nitrates into our under ground water supply whats it going to be 25 years from now
Headline news Organic farming has become the worst enviromental disaster since the invention of the atom bomb

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2014/02/140218114311.htm
At the risk of sounding like an asshole, are we not arguing with somebody that thought the moon landing was faked?
just sayin man...
perhaps you are growing too strong of herb for your own good my brother.
(that is only half serious man, i'm just heckling you)
You do have a point, in fact I remember the amish getting into trouble with the EPA and their manure usage.
Point is, I don't even trust organic fruits man, i've seen too many "omri" pesticides.
Sadly the best thing is to grow your own (sound familiar?)
 

Darth Vapour

Well-Known Member
I am just saying grow the best you can there will always be a fight amounst which is better but the truth is both are better for your circumstance ..
organic is far from the be all end all the best way to grow ,, and like i said 20 years from now when actual tests of enviroment , ground water and so on will be more evident
does organic grow fuck yeah my out door plant is proof does chemicaal grow fuck yeah its been proven over n over you get stupid good results in growth and yield in both indoor and in agriculture
Is one better then the other well that is up n the air really i mean scientific tests are out and there still testing we will know in years to come ..
so far there is not much if any of a difference other then YIELD conventional does produce more Facts its just what you think is better
Just like muslim or being catholic which one is right which one is wrong cause one person applies a amendment that was man made does it make it organic ? rock dust crushed by machinery oill n gas spilled on product handling in transit as a truck driver have seen over n over where contamination occurs with products chemical into non chemical ,
bone meal heated up crushed again man made see what i am getting at
 
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greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
I am just saying grow the best you can there will always be a fight amounst which is better but the truth is both are better for your circumstance ..
organic is far from the be all end all the best way to grow ,, and like i said 20 years from now when actual tests of enviroment , ground water and so on will be more evident
does organic grow fuck yeah my out door plant is proof does chemicaal grow fuck yeah its been proven over n over you get stupid good results in growth and yield in both indoor and in agriculture
Is one better then the other well that is up n the air really i mean scientific tests are out and there still testing we will know in years to come ..
so far there is not much if any of a difference its just what you think is better
Just like muslim or being catholic which one is right which one is wrong cause one person applies a amendment that was man made does it make it organic ? rock dust crushed by machinery oill n gas spilled on product handling in transit as a truck driver have seen over n over where contamination occurs with products chemical into non chemical ,
bone meal heated up crushed again man made see what i am getting at
I gotcha man.
There is sadly NO way that man can inhabit the earth as we are now.
Compared to every other animal that has ever been on the planet, WE, are the ones that are changing things for the bad.
And mother nature will find a way to eradicate us... just wait and see.
in 25 to 40 yrs?
it's going to be a VERY different place...
water, fuel, food, overpopulation.. pollution.
It's funny, since we discovered/invented the combustion engine, which was LESS than 200 yrs ago, we have essentially fucked this planet up.
And hey, that's not bad, considering the earth has been here for roughly 4.5 BILLION yrs, but yea, we fucked it up in less than 200 yrs.
Not bad.
I'm not the smartest mofo, but it seems like the dinosaurs did a better job than we have.
they will have lasted millions and millions of yrs longer than we will.
 

Darth Vapour

Well-Known Member
I feel those "disadvantages" are simply not applicable. At least not to me.
All of us organic growers have microbial life out the wazoo.
And when I assemble my compost pile, with all the ingredients in it, and let it compost and age along with the leaves, there is no shortage of nutrients available.
So if those are the "disadvantages"??
I think i'll be just fine.
Again its a guessing game on what nutrients you think you might have maybe to much ?? maybe not enough cause remember its a soil conditioner not Fertilizer
Are you saying organic grown plant and chemical grown plant started at same time and 5 weeks later in veg will be the same size //? i beg to differ
here 5 week vegged plants you got any that size from grown in organic /? in that time frame ?? cause i think a persons thoughts should be when growing indoor is speed of plant growth cause at the end of the day it cost money now on electricity and obviously the bigger the plant the bigger the harvest becomes right. A lot of people use the well we drain to waste that is far from the truth i feed chemicals to my girls i run a much tighter ship as i Know how much my plant is taking there fore adust accordlingly
If my plant drank 600 ppm of nutrients and when a person checks rez and there is 250 ppm i mix 350 ppm of chem nutes and water to get it back up to the 600 etc i do not drain or flush volume down the toilet those days are over and not to many growers do either gallery_11738_4816_297449.jpg
 

Sunny Organics

Well-Known Member
organic all the way!!

Put it this way, would you rather eat McDonalds everyday? or a nice piece of ribeye steak with smashed potatoes and veggies... sorry im hella munchin...
 

Darth Vapour

Well-Known Member
you herd the old saying just because high brix goes into one end of the cow does not mean the other end coming out is going to be high brix actually its waste with little to non brix value
So as years go by instead of your soil becoming more fertile the opposite happens it gets depleted meaning less nutrient value for the cow and less going back to the soil
People blindly add compost or amendments not knowin what there soil really needs
How many here actually do a soil analysis ??? but go about blindly adding dolomite lime , biochar and what have you , you know the new craze of soil amendments but are blind to there is a fine balance in all of the elements , but today we do not worry about that right
We worry about keeping the micro life alive lol
 

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
Again its a guessing game on what nutrients you think you might have maybe to much ?? maybe not enough cause remember its a soil conditioner not Fertilizer
Are you saying organic grown plant and chemical grown plant started at same time and 5 weeks later in veg will be the same size //? i beg to differ
here 5 week vegged plants you got any that size from grown in organic /? in that time frame ?? cause i think a persons thoughts should be when growing indoor is speed of plant growth cause at the end of the day it cost money now on electricity and obviously the bigger the plant the bigger the harvest becomes right. A lot of people use the well we drain to waste that is far from the truth i feed chemicals to my girls i run a much tighter ship as i Know how much my plant is taking there fore adust accordlingly
If my plant drank 600 ppm of nutrients and when a person checks rez and there is 250 ppm i mix 350 ppm of chem nutes and water to get it back up to the 600 etc i do not drain or flush volume down the toilet those days are over and not to many growers do either View attachment 3527143
no sir, not saying that. But if I did a side by side, I don't think it'd be as far behind as you think.
I just said, the three things you listed as the "disadvantages", ain't shit man, any organic grower can take care of those with no problem.
Never overfed anything, and I use a LOT of nutrients in my compost, I can reuse the same soil for three runs and not have to add anything.
It would be interesting to see, side by side...
Telling you, I've NEVER seen growth rates this fast from organics.
Not sure if its' the different CEC rate of the leaf mold, or what, but its pretty fast man...
 

Dr. Who

Well-Known Member
All this shit for a thread from 2007???

REALLY?

Choose how YOU want to grow and just do it......

FYI Darth.....Bone heads like "The Rev" and Sub "tool" and their adding this that and the other thing and too much of them anyway.....Are wrong!

A simple few amendments are all you need to make a great water only soil.......

Doc
 

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
you herd the old saying just because high brix goes into one end of the cow does not mean the other end coming out is going to be high brix actually its waste with little to non brix value
So as years go by instead of your soil becoming more fertile the opposite happens it gets depleted meaning less nutrient value for the cow and less going back to the soil
People blindly add compost or amendments not knowin what there soil really needs
How many here actually do a soil analysis ??? but go about blindly adding dolomite lime , biochar and what have you , you know the new craze of soil amendments but are blind to there is a fine balance in all of the elements , but today we do not worry about that right
We worry about keeping the micro life alive lol
I don't NEED to do an analysis man.
Why?
And I don't add d-lime to my mix either. As far as biochar, how is that going to hurt anything? It's essentially a fancy form of aeration.
If it ain't broke, LITFA.
 

since1991

Well-Known Member
Well you have all convinced me. I will drag in my wheel barrel full of super soil compost and bust out my raised beds again. And go back to organic soil in under my gavitas, mitsu split and santefe dehuey. Oh and my 1200 ppm co2 injected sealed room. So i can help out the planet, smoke "cleaner" better tasting buds so i wont get "sick". Thats how you grow indoors huh? Fuk it, Iam going back to the ways i did it years ago to get the best possible. Lol. You guys were rite. Damn. I want steak not a hamburger.
 

since1991

Well-Known Member
Man made processed fertilizers are inferior to to fertilizers processed my microbes. Indoors. Thats the way for sure.
 

since1991

Well-Known Member
How about using bottled organic fertilizers like pura vida, earth juice, general organics, iguana juice in say an active nft, drip, dwc or aero system? Yeah? No? Would it pass for you best taste, clean, not make u sick cannabis smokers???? If not then what is the "magic" that happens in an organic heavy compost based super soil that makes that smoke so superior? No one has been able to answer me that in 20 years.
 

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
Well you have all convinced me. I will drag in my wheel barrel full of super soil compost and bust out my raised beds again. And go back to organic soil in under my gavitas, mitsu split and santefe dehuey. Oh and my 1200 ppm co2 injected sealed room. So i can help out the planet, smoke "cleaner" better tasting buds so i wont get "sick". Thats how you grow indoors huh? Fuk it, Iam going back to the ways i did it years ago to get the best possible. Lol. You guys were rite. Damn. I want steak not a hamburger.
if you ever have used "super soil" ... then you shouldn't be saying anything man.
the whole concept of THAT shitty technique is totally idiotic.
 

VTMi'kmaq

Well-Known Member
get yourself a solid no -till recipe...........learn its needs........put in your love and attention. Watch your ladies love you back for giving them what there ancestors grew in........all your doing when going organic is giving this weed what it requires in nature imvho.
 

greasemonkeymann

Well-Known Member
How about using bottled organic fertilizers like pura vida, earth juice, general organics, iguana juice in say an active nft, drip, dwc or aero system? Yeah? No? Would it pass for you best taste, clean, not make u sick cannabis smokers???? If not then what is the "magic" that happens in an organic heavy compost based super soil that makes that smoke so superior? No one has been able to answer me that in 20 years.
What "magic"? it's botany and photosynthesis, there is no magic.
humus, fulvic and humic acids, CEC rate, all that is where the organic "magic" happens.
Nothing spectacular man.
who have you been asking for 20 yrs?
It's simple it's the way plants have been growing for millions of yrs.
I replicate mother nature as close as possible, I use a wormbin and compost pile for damn near most of my garbage, I have solar panels for my electricity, I don't use dehumidifiers, co2 enrichment, or anything like that.
The "carbon footprint" argument is humorous.
Much, much, MUCH bigger things that will fuck the world up, before us cannabis growers.
what I am saying is that if you are intelligent about it, the impact from an organic grow is less than a hydro grow.
I am not going to argue about this. Don't really see how it's arguable.
 
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