Ben Carson says he would “intensify” the war on drugs

[Flaming Pie]

No, by ordering the DEA to crack down even on state compliant growers. In other words, he would intensify the war on drugs. I think that is what he meant when he said he would intensify the war on drugs.

Did you know he said he would intensify the war on drugs?

Thank you. Now I can do some research. I need a direction and in a proper debate you need to provide information like this to get the ball rolling.

 

[Flaming Pie]

My premises is flawed because you can't address the hypocrisy of your comments? A good step towards decriminalizing is not electing an idiot who wants to intensify the war on drugs and thinks Marijuana is a gateway drug.

You claim I should worry about the economy but then ignore how legalization and decriminlization can help improve our economy, while supporting a Presidential candidate that wants to intensify a failed drug war that already costs us $40 Billion annually.

I don't feel bad for looking at things objectively. Currently I do not see how a president could create any real change in the legalization of marijuana.

Abandon has offered a bit of info that I will check out later today.

I will come back when I have read up on the subject a bit more.

 

[abandonconflict]

Thank you. Now I can do some research. I need a direction and in a proper debate you need to provide information like this to get the ball rolling.

I'm guessing you have heard of Eric Holder? Well aside from being the black boogeyman from Faux Noose nightmare fame, he was the recipient of a memo known as (get this) "The Holder Memo". Start your research there and understand why so many people started growing like crazy in 2008, even though a California and Alaska and maybe other states had legalized MMJ long before.

 

[natro.hydro]

What do his words mean? What could he do?

I am honestly asking you to educate me and you refuse to do so.

Quit being an ass.

He could reschedule cannabis to schedule 2 drug to start, then maybe apoint a head of the DEA that doesn't think marijuana causes as much harm as heroine or meth....
that would be a nice start and not even that big of a jump for him since he says he believes marijuana has medicinal benefits. It doesn't even require him to trample on the constitution and could be a pretty retroactive step towards decrim

 

[Flaming Pie]

He could reschedule cannabis to schedule 2 drug to start, then maybe apoint a head of the DEA that doesn't think marijuana causes as much harm as heroine or meth....
that would be a nice start and not even that big of a jump for him since he says he believes marijuana has medicinal benefits. It doesn't even require him to trample on the constitution and could be a pretty retroactive step towards decrim

I have seen him say that he believes in the medical benefits and medical marijuana.

I will do some research guys and come back with what I find.

Thanks to those who gave me some keywords.

 

[abandonconflict]

http://www.justice.gov/opa/blog/memorandum-selected-united-state-attorneys-investigations-and-prosecutions-states

 

[Flaming Pie]

http://www.justice.gov/opa/blog/memorandum-selected-united-state-attorneys-investigations-and-prosecutions-states

To clarify, what did you want me to see in this? I'm trying to read it, but the coffee hasnt quite kicked in yet and it is looooong legal speak.

So any help would be appreciated.

 

[Flaming Pie]

Typically, when any of the following characteristics is present, the conduct will not be in clear and unambiguous compliance with applicable state law and may indicate illegal drug trafficking activity of potential federal interest: I am taking it as if the individual is not in full compliance with the state law in regard to medical marijuana that they will investigate and possibly prosecute.

• unlawful possession or unlawful use of firearms;
• violence;
• sales to minors;
• financial and marketing activities inconsistent with the terms, conditions, or purposes of state law, including evidence of money laundering activity and/or financial gains or excessive amounts of cash inconsistent with purported compliance with state or local law; Compensation for time and cost vs sale for profit?
• amounts of marijuana inconsistent with purported compliance with state or local law;Having more on hand then state law says is ok (lets not even get into that lol)
• illegal possession or sale of other controlled substances; or (cocaine, heroin etc)
• ties to other criminal enterprises. (gangs, theft, abuse)

Thats what I get out of it. Anything I am missing?

 

[Flaming Pie]

Indeed, this memorandum does not alter in any way the Department's authority to enforce federal law, including laws prohibiting the manufacture, production, distribution, possession, or use of marijuana on federal property. This guidance regarding resource allocation does not "legalize" marijuana or provide a legal defense to a violation of federal law, nor is it intended to create any privileges, benefits, or rights, substantive or procedural, enforceable by any individual, party or witness in any administrative, civil, or criminal matter. Nor does clear and unambiguous compliance with state law or the absence of one or all of the above factors create a legal defense to a violation of the Controlled Substances Act.

I am reading that basically they are saying lets not spend our resources on marijuana unless we see other violations but they reserve the right to do so anyways.

 

[abandonconflict]

I am reading that basically they are saying lets not spend our resources on marijuana unless we see other violations but they reserve the right to do so anyways.

That's correct. Seems meaningless, but look how things have changed as a result of this unilateral action by the administration. A direct result. The dawgs were told to git on down boy, go sit down. The result was that everyone got to see the research, the cartel's loss of market share, the tax revenue, the decreases in gov't expenditures on enforcement and incarceration regarding antiquated cannabis prohibition (and my how quickly did it antiquate). Now apparently a bunch of nonviolent cannabis offenders are being set free.

This is the opposite of intensifying the drug war, look at how much progress was made by such tiny steps.

 

[Flaming Pie]

That's correct. Seems meaningless, but look how things have changed as a result of this unilateral action by the administration. A direct result. The dawgs were told to git on down boy, go sit down. The result was that everyone got to see the research, the cartel's loss of market share, the tax revenue, the decreases in gov't expenditures on enforcement and incarceration regarding antiquated cannabis prohibition (and my how quickly did it antiquate). Now apparently a bunch of nonviolent cannabis offenders are being set free.

This is the opposite of intensifying the drug war, look at how much progress was made by such tiny steps.

Ok. I am seeing your side now.

I will look into this further.

Thank you for your detailed and thoughtful response. We really need to help each other understand because when we separate ourselves we are reducing the amount of information. There is so much to dig through out there and having someone say "hey look at this!" is very helpful.

 

[Flaming Pie]

After doing some more research on Ben and marijuana, my thoughts are:

1. He is correct that MOST teens and young adults should probably stay away from marijuana as it has been shown to have a effect on the developing brain. (I remember reading up on that several months back when in a thread about letting your teens smoke)

2. I personally think (I don't have the research at the moment to support, but I will look into it) that marijuana in young adults couldn't be more harmful than alcohol or even caffiene.

3. He needs to take a second look and take another approach to recreational cannabis or he will lose many votes. I don't know if it would be enough to lose the nomination/election, but he should look again.

4. Perhaps people who were interested in him before his "intensify" comment, should post on his twitter or something for him to reconsider his stance on recreational marijuana.

 

[Flaming Pie]

My position is flexible if I see the data to make me change my mind.

So feel free to post whatever you think is worth looking at.

I personally would like to ask Ben Carson why he sees marijuana as a hedonistic activity (in the sense that it is bad). I understand he was in college during the hippy free love movement. Perhaps that jaded his view of marijuana.

Jesus gave his disciples wine... i mean... come on..

 

[Flaming Pie]

A study in the journal Nutrition Research shows that every 10 milligrams of caffeine a 13-year-old boy drinks per day increases his chances of getting less than 8.5 hours of sleep by 12 percent.

I am beginning to see why you guys are so upset about this.

10 mg is nothing.

 

[Flaming Pie]

This reminds me of my car troubles.

One car will not start. The crankshaft sensor is the culprit. Repair would require either removing the transmission or engine so they have room to drill out the rust stuck screw holding it in place. They have tried for 5 weeks to loosen it with no luck. The only other problem with the car is the AC doesn't work because there is a leak in AC hose. The heat works fine and all other mechanical parts are good.

We have a running vehicle that I could use. However, it needs a new windshield, new rotors and brakes, it has frame damage on the right side, the rear struts are near dead, the hood takes two people to open, the battery cable is rusted, the front headlight needs replaced, it has a large oil leak and creates burning oil fumes that requires I keep the window cracked so I'm not breathing fumes.

I chose to repair the first car.

I will continue to look into ben carson. Right now he still looks like the better option to me. If I am forced to choose between a candidate that dislikes recreational cannabis and a candidate that goes against everything I believe in.. You get my point.

I am still open to any new info you guys dig up.

 

[natro.hydro]

A study in the journal Nutrition Research shows that every 10 milligrams of caffeine a 13-year-old boy drinks per day increases his chances of getting less than 8.5 hours of sleep by 12 percent.

I am beginning to see why you guys are so upset about this.

10 mg is nothing.

There is like 60 MG per mtn dew... my only problem with those studies saying kids shouldn't use pot is that no duh, on. A perfect world teens would not engage in any self destructive behavior. But unfortunately making terrible decisions is part of being a teenager. So maybe not ruining a kids life over a little weed would be nice to see.
On that note tho I have yet to read any of dr.carson's thought on criminal justice reform.
Not sure if that isn't a big issue to him, hasn't had time to address it or I am not looking hard enough. But if he doesn't have a plan to reform minimum mandatories then there isn't much hope that he is sincere with his stance on Marijuana being medical.

 

[natro.hydro]

This reminds me of my car troubles.

One car will not start. The crankshaft sensor is the culprit. Repair would require either removing the transmission or engine so they have room to drill out the rust stuck screw holding it in place. They have tried for 5 weeks to loosen it with no luck. The only other problem with the car is the AC doesn't work because there is a leak in AC hose. The heat works fine and all other mechanical parts are good.

We have a running vehicle that I could use. However, it needs a new windshield, new rotors and brakes, it has frame damage on the right side, the rear struts are near dead, the hood takes two people to open, the battery cable is rusted, the front headlight needs replaced, it has a large oil leak and creates burning oil fumes that requires I keep the window cracked so I'm not breathing fumes.

I chose to repair the first car.

I will continue to look into ben carson. Right now he still looks like the better option to me. If I am forced to choose between a candidate that dislikes recreational cannabis and a candidate that goes against everything I believe in.. You get my point.

I am still open to any new info you guys dig up.

So you are more open to a long overhaul rather than a quick fix that is still risky? Interesting... Maybe do some reading on bernie sanders instead of carson

 

[Flaming Pie]

There is like 60 MG per mtn dew... my only problem with those studies saying kids shouldn't use pot is that no duh, on. A perfect world teens would not engage in any self destructive behavior. But unfortunately making terrible decisions is part of being a teenager. So maybe not ruining a kids life over a little weed would be nice to see.
On that note tho I have yet to read any of dr.carson's thought on criminal justice reform.
Not sure if that isn't a big issue to him, hasn't had time to address it or I am not looking hard enough. But if he doesn't have a plan to reform minimum mandatories then there isn't much hope that he is sincere with his stance on Marijuana being medical.

This. You are absolutely right and I hope he clarifies/expands on his views on marijuana laws. There isn't much out there to go on right now.

 

[Flaming Pie]

So you are more open to a long overhaul rather than a quick fix that is still risky? Interesting... Maybe do some reading on bernie sanders instead of carson

It was a hard choice for sure.

 

[Flaming Pie]

I do believe that sometimes when people think they know what is "right" they cling to it. Without research and listening to other view points, their definition of right is never wrong.

Everyone has been guilty of it at one time or another. I was really bad up until having my daughter. I had to change the way I did things and fast. I made peace with my in laws, made peace with friends who I told to get out of my life basically, and I am still working hard to create a relationship with my father.

The main thing was forcing myself to stifle the knee jerk reactions. They cause nothing but trouble.