Opinions on CMH lighting for flower

[mountain dweller]

Well I was talking to the owner of a local hydro store about switching from two 1000 watt lights to four 600 watt lights and he started pointing at these Phantom CMH ballasts saying they will outperform 600's and they use a full spectrum bulb and better light that the plants need. Being as he is the owner I am skeptical of his claims cause i have not really heard of these not finding much definitive info on any search.

 

[verticalgrow]

Well I was talking to the owner of a local hydro store about switching from two 1000 watt lights to four 600 watt lights and he started pointing at these Phantom CMH ballasts saying they will outperform 600's and they use a full spectrum bulb and better light that the plants need. Being as he is the owner I am skeptical of his claims cause i have not really heard of these not finding much definitive info on any search.

https://www.rollitup.org/t/chemist77-315-watt-cdl-grow.880895/

edit: https://www.rollitup.org/t/630w-lec-4x4-tent-grow.899399/#post-12332632

 

[verticalgrow]

Well I was talking to the owner of a local hydro store about switching from two 1000 watt lights to four 600 watt lights and he started pointing at these Phantom CMH ballasts saying they will outperform 600's and they use a full spectrum bulb and better light that the plants need. Being as he is the owner I am skeptical of his claims cause i have not really heard of these not finding much definitive info on any search.

CMH are full spectrum lights & build quality superior to hps because
they are ceramic making bulbs last 20,000hrs+ thats why they cost a bit more.

 

[Budget Buds]

Less heat and good performance, high price tag though. I stick with hps until the LED pulls me over to them, the cmh really have no comparison to an led IMO

 

[dbkick]

Solid lights, I've ordered a hydrofarm 315 cmh ballast to fit my SS luxor hood, already have two SS lec 315 hanging.. Also just picked up a hortilux platinum ballast to run an allstart 860 .
1000 watts of low freq square wave signal cmh.

 

[verticalgrow]

Well I was talking to the owner of a local hydro store about switching from two 1000 watt lights to four 600 watt lights and he started pointing at these Phantom CMH ballasts saying they will outperform 600's and they use a full spectrum bulb and better light that the plants need. Being as he is the owner I am skeptical of his claims cause i have not really heard of these not finding much definitive info on any search.

This guy loves them so much he bought 400 CMH lights
https://www.rollitup.org/t/50000-square-feet-colorado-legal-rec-grow.883667/

 

[dbkick]

Less heat and good performance, high price tag though. I stick with hps until the LED pulls me over to them, the cmh really have no comparison to an led IMO

315 kits can be had for 2 bills and that includes the lamp, all you do is add a hood.

 

[dbkick]

This guy loves them so much he bought 400 CMH lights
https://www.rollitup.org/t/50000-square-feet-colorado-legal-rec-grow.883667/

He got a rebate from excel on them too.

 

[ElBartoe]

Get yourself 1000watt double ended and don't get fooled by marketing. There's a reason big companies use just that, sometimes supplemented by 300watt plasma's. Cmh gives you airy buds and led still doesn't yield like hps.

 

[dubekoms]

Get yourself 1000watt double ended and don't get fooled by marketing. There's a reason big companies use just that, sometimes supplemented by 300watt plasma's. Cmh gives you airy buds and led still doesn't yield like hps.

Got any sources for that bro? I've seen some very nice cmh grows here on rollitup, as well as led.

 

[nomofatum]

It's a lie that a 315 CMH will match or beat a 600w HPS on yield. Flat out lie. Just like the flat out lie that LEDs, even the most efficient on the market, can beat twice the watts in HPS.

What is true is that it puts out a better spectrum and will result in a higher quality final product.

The best LEDs are about 20% more efficient/better than HPS. So 1200w of HPS would be roughly equivilent in light output to 1000w of CXB LEDs. Again though, the CXB will put out a better spectrum, so better quality.

The most cost effective option for lighting tends to be HPS + supplemental to match the better quality of other lights. Adding 6500k and UVB bulbs to HPS will give you a better spectrum than CMH, CXB LEDs, or fancy HPS bulbs.

If the 20% extra heat from the HPS is problematic, switch to the CXB LEDs and depending on color temp you may not need 6500k, but the UVB would still be required for best results.

I currently run HPS + CMH (I got a hell of a deal) + Tanning bulbs (UVB). Next upgrade will be to add CXB LEDs.

The CMH lights are very nice and work very well. The only issues I've seen are where someone believed the lies and undersized their lighting for their space. 3x3 is about the max size for a 315 CMH alone for flower.

CMH is actually less efficient than HPS. This is a fact. It puts out less lumens and less par watts per watt of electricity used.

CXB LEDs are the way to go if you want a lower power light to compete with a higher power light. They will allow you to run the same amount of light with 20-30% less power used, but will cost you an arm and a leg to buy, just like the CMH option.

 

[GroErr]

Get yourself 1000watt double ended and don't get fooled by marketing. There's a reason big companies use just that, sometimes supplemented by 300watt plasma's. Cmh gives you airy buds and led still doesn't yield like hps.

Like I haven't heard that one from an hps user who's never used these Philips 315's. 1 to 1.5 gpw easy with these depending on strains, you don't get those numbers with airy buds, bud.

 

[ElBartoe]

I get the drift for innovation but until to date nothing beats hps. Big companies like bayer,roche,every greenhouse in the netherlands in winter, they all use hps. I don't say cmh is bad but for coverage for example, you need 4 315's to cover 5x5, 1 1000watt does the same for you.

 

[mountain dweller]

hmmm i wish i could just use four 1K watt but unless i get a controller that will use too much amperage plus its a 8x10 room that gets blazing hot with the two 1K's so four would be killer

 

[greasemonkeymann]

Well I was talking to the owner of a local hydro store about switching from two 1000 watt lights to four 600 watt lights and he started pointing at these Phantom CMH ballasts saying they will outperform 600's and they use a full spectrum bulb and better light that the plants need. Being as he is the owner I am skeptical of his claims cause i have not really heard of these not finding much definitive info on any search.

why are you wanting 4 600s?
unless you have a really oddly shaped room, two 1000s will be more efficient.
4 600s will put out more heat than 2 1000s..
I'd get one 1000 as a hps and one as a mh

 

[nomofatum]

why are you wanting 4 600s?
unless you have a really oddly shaped room, two 1000s will be more efficient.
4 600s will put out more heat than 2 1000s..

The 600w ones are actually slightly more efficient than the 1000w version. That is measuring efficiency as light output/watts of electricity.

Now obviously 1200w > 1000w, but it's delivering more light... and more yields.

4 lights would give much better coverage than 2 in a 8x10 room.

OP needs to handle heat better though, because 2400w is below par for 800 square feet. I would use mylar curtains and make a walkway outside the light footprint. That will reduce the sqft and increase light intensity. Fix/improve venting or add A/C to handle heat issues. Hot plants make buds that taste bad and aren't as dense. Quality of your end product won't be good if temps exceed 85f consistently during lights on.

 

[ElBartoe]

The 600watts where more efficient in the past, today however the 1000watt 400v DE are the most efficient lights on the market.

 

[nomofatum]

The 600watts where more efficient in the past, today however the 1000watt 400v DE are the most efficient lights on the market.

Except the CXB leds are still more efficient. But the DE's and 1000w lights in general (or for that matter all HIDs) come with another disadvantage, they are too intense for the plants to get close to, you need high ceilings or you will need much shorter plants under the light to avoid burning the plants or causing continual stress that ruins the quality of the buds.

There is a big advantage to spreading out your light sources, getting more even light distribution and reducing/eliminating overly-hot zones and weak zones. If 500w lights existed and were exactly as efficient as 1000w lights, I would prefer 2 500w lights over 1 1000w light, the results would be better...

 

[ElBartoe]

True with the de you do need the space to hang your lamps, in the gavita manual it says to keep 4 feet between the lamp and the canopy i think. And where i live, heat isn't a problem but for some it is, maybe thats a reason to invest in led then.

 

[GroErr]

hmmm i wish i could just use four 1K watt but unless i get a controller that will use too much amperage plus its a 8x10 room that gets blazing hot with the two 1K's so four would be killer

I get the drift for innovation but until to date nothing beats hps. Big companies like bayer,roche,every greenhouse in the netherlands in winter, they all use hps. I don't say cmh is bad but for coverage for example, you need 4 315's to cover 5x5, 1 1000watt does the same for you.

I've done a watt for watt conversion for my son and he's consistently getting 25% more weight & better quality. Depending on the room config, they cover 3.5 x 3.5' well under a hood, with multiple units you get some benefit from overlap/bleeding. At 30-35w/sq. ft. they grow a lot of top shelf bud.