Mau5Capades: builds & grow journal

BobCajun

BobCajun

Well-Known Member
https://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0ahUKEwjX2JfH_6TLAhXltIMKHdpAAyAQFggmMAE&url=http://www.geocities.ws/sash_elias/files/thesis1.pdf&usg=AFQjCNEquxn1tIzgQWKXNo7_5EcS8XO2Fg&sig2=4TBT0aMC-w7cplBDUzS0Ow&bvm=bv.115339255,d.amc
bicit said:
Well according to the paper the light flashes must be shorter than the dark period. Implying to me at least that there needs to be periods of total absence of light, not just reduced output. IE making it impossible to simulate the effects using a light mover or through the dimming wires of a meanwell B type driver.
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Some drivers can only dim to 50%, others can go right off. That pdf I linked may not be very relevant because it used equal on and off times, rather than shorter light pulses than dark, as the first article said was necessary. Also, all of the experiments except the 120 Hz one were too slow anyway. The normal flicker of LEDs also probably wouldn't do anything, because they also don't go completely off, just vary. Anyway, lots of possibilities here. Something is bound to work out to save power and give similar yields, even if there is no actual increase.

This article looks more useful.
 
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BobCajun

BobCajun

Well-Known Member
Here's a good one, just the abstract. It has more precise pulse times. Another good one. I don't know if intermittent light would work in flowering, due to the total amount of light in a day being less, but it should work for veg stage at least. Any power savings is good power savings, especially if you happen to have a warehouse full.

There's a patent related to this too. I guess you couldn't sell this unless you paid that person.
 
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BobCajun

BobCajun

Well-Known Member
I noticed another patent referenced in the one I linked earlier. This guy made a thing to adjust the pulses in a growing chamber he made. I think the patent is for the whole chamber though. I doubt if anyone could patent using particular pulses with LEDs. Those patents would be easy to get around by not exactly duplicating what they described.

What I get from the first patent is that best results are with either 100 or 400 microsecond pulses. One graph showed 100 as the highest bar and another showed 400. Don't know what that's about but apparently a 33% duty ratio is best, meaning on for 100, off for 200. Or with 400 it would be off for 800. The patent didn't say it used more light intensity during the pulses, so it looks like you would save 66% on power. Could that be right?
 
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alesh

alesh

Well-Known Member
Greengenes707 said:
So essentially PWM dimming. Not meanwell and others use of a PWM signal to dim CC...but true PWM, pulse width modulating of the DC output. It could be done on a set frequency, the dark time being longer was interesting.

I believe SDS was working on an automatic gradual full power-dimmed, not a quick repeated one.
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MW PWM (fixed 300 Hz output) series or LD* (not sure whether input frequency = output freq or if it's fixed) have a true PWM output.
 
alesh

alesh

Well-Known Member
robincnn said:
I like the hole in cutters heatsink to route wire. Looks like it will work for 3070, vero 29 and 3590. Vero 29 in datasheet looks like 43mm diameter for screw point. Cutters design seems to have 42mm. May be 42 works fine as well.

Tapping holes in heatsink can be a pain. I have been working on a heatsink kit but without cobs. 140mm diameter for now and may be a 120mm in future. Details on my web here
View attachment 3621713

If cutter can make a great kit and great shipping price then good for everyone. Saves me time too:grin:
These heatsinks work great for passive cooling and weigh much less than long flat extruded profiles
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Nice heatsink but $120 compared to the price of COBs seems too much to me.
 
robincnn

robincnn

Well-Known Member
alesh said:
Nice heatsink but $120 compared to the price of COBs seems too much to me.
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Not sure what would be equivalent Heatsink USA profile
For heatsink USA 8.460" Wide Extruded Aluminum Heatsink (Inches):36" $130.40 with shipping 15.5lbs total
For heatsink USA 7.280" Wide Extruded Aluminum Heatsink (Inches):36" $114.67 with shipping 13lbs total
And that is just the heatsink cost without any goodies or tapping on heatsink

Those Pin Heatsinks on my site are 140mm 800 grams or 1.8lbs each. 4 x1.8= 7.2lbs. They perform better than extruded profiles, weigh less, non conductive and look better
At source the heatsinks are cheep but still the shipping is too much for heatsinks. Heatsink cost me about $18 each , AS5 $7, Another $10 for Templates, screws and hangers, $18 to ship, $4-5selling fee
I don't make much on these heatsinks. Just trying to share some tested and good stuff with you all. I recommended Cooliance to sell pre tapped heatsinks for 3590and vero for DIY'ers but they were not interested in small orders.
If cutter can sell cheaper then i would not worry about selling them. I can order in bulk and get the current combo down to $99. may be add a few stuff to help with build. Also may be a cheaper 120mm version
 
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robincnn

robincnn

Well-Known Member
Looks like we cannot get 0%(dark) with PWM in mean well.
upload_2016-3-4_9-20-16.png
Switching AC input may not be a good idea with CC drivers. Also the capacitor would add a lag in on/off
Opening DC circuit may also not be good idea given constant current drivers. Driver DC side voltage will max if DC side is open and could damage cob.
Even the COB do not turn on immediately. Not sure if delay is due to diode, capacitor in high power drivers or light emitting phosphorus but this could limit frequency.

Switching DC side on Constant voltage drivers may work. I have some low power CV drivers and 18V LED strips. Will see if I can setup a small experiment for this.
 
Greengenes707

Greengenes707

Well-Known Member
https://www.rollitup.org/t/the-autos-dias-project.855633/
robincnn said:
Looks like we cannot get 0%(dark) with PWM in mean well.
View attachment 3623149
Switching AC input may not be a good idea with CC drivers. Also the capacitor would add a lag in on/off
Opening DC circuit may also not be good idea given constant current drivers. Driver DC side voltage will max if DC side is open and could damage cob.
Even the COB do not turn on immediately. Not sure if delay is due to diode, capacitor in high power drivers or light emitting phosphorus but this could limit frequency.

Switching DC side on Constant voltage drivers may work. I have some low power CV drivers and 18V LED strips. Will see if I can setup a small experiment for this.
Click to expand...
Need a relay. It's in all the meanwell's with 3in1 data sheets.

alesh said:
MW PWM (fixed 300 Hz output) series or LD* (not sure whether input frequency = output freq or if it's fixed) have a true PWM output.
Click to expand...
Ya, the whole off more than on is the issue for regular real PWM.
 
alesh

alesh

Well-Known Member
robincnn said:
Not sure what would be equivalent Heatsink USA profile
For heatsink USA 8.460" Wide Extruded Aluminum Heatsink (Inches):36" $130.40 with shipping 15.5lbs total
For heatsink USA 7.280" Wide Extruded Aluminum Heatsink (Inches):36" $114.67 with shipping 13lbs total
And that is just the heatsink cost without any goodies or tapping on heatsink

Those Pin Heatsinks on my site are 140mm 800 grams or 1.8lbs each. 4 x1.8= 7.2lbs. They perform better than extruded profiles, weigh less, non conductive and look better
At source the heatsinks are cheep but still the shipping is too much for heatsinks. Heatsink cost me about $18 each , AS5 $7, Another $10 for Templates, screws and hangers, $18 to ship, $4-5selling fee
I don't make much on these heatsinks. Just trying to share some tested and good stuff with you all. I recommended Cooliance to sell pre tapped heatsinks for 3590and vero for DIY'ers but they were not interested in small orders.
If cutter can sell cheaper then i would not worry about selling them. I can order in bulk and get the current combo down to $99. Also may be a cheaper 120mm version
Click to expand...
It's a great HS but passive cooling of CXB3590 @1.4A cost me less than $15 with extruded profiles...
 
BobCajun

BobCajun

Well-Known Member
Greengenes707 said:
They are usually equal on to off duty cycles.

I'm not actually interested at all in what bob brought up. I'm don't talking about it.
If you guys find something cool, I'll be watching.
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Yeah, something like that would require considerable circuit design expertise anyway. Not really something you can DIY. I just thought one of you might know of a simple way to do it but apparently not.
 
jewbag

jewbag

Well-Known Member
alesh said:
It's a great HS but passive cooling of CXB3590 @1.4A cost me less than $15 with extruded profiles...
Click to expand...
I second this. As someone who runs passive cooling @1.05A I simply don't need all that much aluminum. at the same time however I would love a product like this as opposed to basic heatsinksusa profiles, it would just have to compete with less than $13 per cob. a scaled down version for $15-20 each would be pretty sweet.
 
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