So I made myself some CalPhos...

[relect]

You can use phosphoric acid instead of acetic acid to up the phosphorus.

 

[iHearAll]

So are we getting 5% phosphorus out of it? And can you add bones to the egg mixture to up the phosphorus?

something like that yea.

thats a good chem question actually. """"""""mols of cal carb +mols of cal phos >into> (volume)vinegar>>?????""""" . i imagine yes and i have done this but i really dont know how much i got out of it. plants remained healthy and i was using it in a plant that didnt ask for it too.... so im no help

except we would need to find our potential mols of each first. which is grams we have divided by 1mol of the compound

 

[calliandra]

Yeah....
I don't get chemistry lol
You guys have fun with that and let me know what comes out in the end K

Meanwhile, I've tried applying this - whatever-it-is haha - to get a feel for it.... I didn't lol
added it to the PE'S water and foliared & watered the rose, but it just doesn't fit somehow.
I will be giving the softened shells to the worms, but won't be making this again anytime soon I think

The star today was the SST
The Alfalfa & a mix of lentil, mung bean, and fenugreek filled the glass with their sprouts

and got mixed with the same amount of water



Day 12 for the Sour Stompers, last time we'll see this 3some

the tomato got culled and the 2nd SS repotted (ugh, I couldn't kill it - again LOL)

Sour Stomper #1 got 250ml of the SST - opened a trench in the sand (and scared 2 earthworms in the process ), poured in the SST & watered it in some more before refilling the trench with sand

She has been growing lots these past days, I hope the mircobes & worms have a party with this!

@DonBrennon sorry I couldn't find exact ingredient proportions for the chlorophyll water anywhere.
I guess it really is as I had surmised and you'll just have to trust your own instincts on that
On the bright side, all that reading gave me a plan for a new garden experiement next year I'm going to try and replicate how he grows his onions lol

 

[DonBrennon]

Yeah it is isn't it!

I'll check whether he gives any tips as to amounts somewhere and get back to you on that (I need to browse through a book, a few articles and his online vids )
But I can almost hear him saying, "aah, not so tragic" (with a germanic accent to his English and a dismissing gesture of the hand and a chuckle haha)
I'd say just try it with a handful of greens for starts? And fill the mixer with water to cover it well, like max 1L?
All you're doing is adding fresh organic material after all, and a handful never maKes heat mulching (for example comfrey or clover), only when I add a fat layer of it. Just my gut feeling speaking there

I'm really excited to see whether it helps her!

So I've gone ahead and tried the method for the chlorophyll water, but with a bit of tweaking, I can't help myself, lol........this is what I used for my green input, I've always got extra plants to use
but I also added a few aloe vera leaves and some kelp meal. Blended everything up and poured the 'mush' into the soil.

I let you know how she likes it.

 

[calliandra]

So I've gone ahead and tried the method for the chlorophyll water, but with a bit of tweaking, I can't help myself, lol........this is what I used for my green input, I've always got extra plants to useView attachment 3791332
but I also added a few aloe vera leaves and some kelp meal. Blended everything up and poured the 'mush' into the soil.

I let you know how she likes it.

Haha one man's chlorophyll water is another's main crop
Hoping that lets her perk up!

Interesting your choice of further additions - basically, it's the sum of what I've decided to give my sour stomper - 2-3 plant smoothies, weekly aloe foliars, and intermittent kelp meal juice (thinking of mid veg and the stretch?).

Speaking of aloe foliars, have you used powder?
I haven't been able to get an aloe plant myself, I think I need to research some more as there are different aloes on sale everywhere but they're not aloe vera?
So I've impatiently defaulted to powder for now.

It says it's got a 200:1 concentration, so I just diluted a teaspoon to a liter of water - so actually just rehydrated - and foliared that & watered the rest in.
But isn't fresh aloe kind of slimy though (the powder solution isn't)? Do you dilute fresh aloe for foliars? Maybe I should dilute more too?
Though tbh, I didn't see any special reaction* in the plants, which of course may be due to the fact that they're pumped up with so many goodies anyways and the soil is alive and active. Also, I wasn't really expecting one, as the way I understand the aloe, it's more of a fortificant, making the plants more resilient in general?

*edit: I was just uploading some pix to my computer and saw that actually, the SS is exploding, unfurled her 3rd tier in the night after the foliar, still expanding that whilst also starting to grow side shoots & the 4th tier leaves.

I REALLY love this plant, you can just see how it's the genetics making those side shoots go!
Also I love how she first grows her leaves straight up and held together like hands getting ready to dive into a lake and then opens them up in a wide arc when the next tier is ready to emerge from its safely tucked "incubator" - it really looks like she's swimming into the air, not just growing

Here she is, day 15, you can really see the "diver" leaves there:




Cheers!

 

[Rasta Roy]

Haha one man's chlorophyll water is another's main crop
Hoping that lets her perk up!

Interesting your choice of further additions - basically, it's the sum of what I've decided to give my sour stomper - 2-3 plant smoothies, weekly aloe foliars, and intermittent kelp meal juice (thinking of mid veg and the stretch?).

Speaking of aloe foliars, have you used powder?
I haven't been able to get an aloe plant myself, I think I need to research some more as there are different aloes on sale everywhere but they're not aloe vera?
So I've impatiently defaulted to powder for now.

It says it's got a 200:1 concentration, so I just diluted a teaspoon to a liter of water - so actually just rehydrated - and foliared that & watered the rest in.
But isn't fresh aloe kind of slimy though (the powder solution isn't)? Do you dilute fresh aloe for foliars? Maybe I should dilute more too?
Though tbh, I didn't see any special reaction* in the plants, which of course may be due to the fact that they're pumped up with so many goodies anyways and the soil is alive and active. Also, I wasn't really expecting one, as the way I understand the aloe, it's more of a fortificant, making the plants more resilient in general?

*edit: I was just uploading some pix to my computer and saw that actually, the SS is exploding, unfurled her 3rd tier in the night after the foliar, still expanding that whilst also starting to grow side shoots & the 4th tier leaves.

I REALLY love this plant, you can just see how it's the genetics making those side shoots go!
Also I love how she first grows her leaves straight up and held together like hands getting ready to dive into a lake and then opens them up in a wide arc when the next tier is ready to emerge from its safely tucked "incubator" - it really looks like she's swimming into the air, not just growing

Here she is, day 15, you can really see the "diver" leaves there:
View attachment 3791597
View attachment 3791598


Cheers!

Looks like she's off to a good start! I gotta know...how heavy are those pots with that sand on top? I've always wanted to experiment with some sand but the additional weight worries me (my L3 hangs out to the left of the rest of my spine).

 

[DonBrennon]

Haha one man's chlorophyll water is another's main crop
Hoping that lets her perk up!

Interesting your choice of further additions - basically, it's the sum of what I've decided to give my sour stomper - 2-3 plant smoothies, weekly aloe foliars, and intermittent kelp meal juice (thinking of mid veg and the stretch?).

Speaking of aloe foliars, have you used powder?
I haven't been able to get an aloe plant myself, I think I need to research some more as there are different aloes on sale everywhere but they're not aloe vera?
So I've impatiently defaulted to powder for now.

It says it's got a 200:1 concentration, so I just diluted a teaspoon to a liter of water - so actually just rehydrated - and foliared that & watered the rest in.
But isn't fresh aloe kind of slimy though (the powder solution isn't)? Do you dilute fresh aloe for foliars? Maybe I should dilute more too?
Though tbh, I didn't see any special reaction* in the plants, which of course may be due to the fact that they're pumped up with so many goodies anyways and the soil is alive and active. Also, I wasn't really expecting one, as the way I understand the aloe, it's more of a fortificant, making the plants more resilient in general?

*edit: I was just uploading some pix to my computer and saw that actually, the SS is exploding, unfurled her 3rd tier in the night after the foliar, still expanding that whilst also starting to grow side shoots & the 4th tier leaves.

I REALLY love this plant, you can just see how it's the genetics making those side shoots go!
Also I love how she first grows her leaves straight up and held together like hands getting ready to dive into a lake and then opens them up in a wide arc when the next tier is ready to emerge from its safely tucked "incubator" - it really looks like she's swimming into the air, not just growing

Here she is, day 15, you can really see the "diver" leaves there:
View attachment 3791597
View attachment 3791598


Cheers!

Aloe is multi-purpose I suppose, I'm mainly using it's saponins as a wetting agent, but the salicylic acid also acts as some kind of plant tonic, boosting it's immune system. I've also just found this little tidbit of info -

Aloe Vera’s Active Ingredients
Aloe vera could be considered a superfood, the leaf is filled with a gel containing at least 75 nutrients, 20 minerals, 12 vitamins, 18 amino acids, and 200 active enzymes.

With regards to the powder you're using, you're probably going a little heavy with it, it's extremely concentrated. 1 teaspoon makes 1 liter of aloe juice. For me to get 1 liter of aloe juice I'd have to use about 20 good sized leaves, whereas I use 1-2 leaves per liter of water. I don't think you can over apply aloe, but there's a limit where adding more is not going to give you any further benefits, you're just wasting the resource.
I'm not sure , it's been a while since I used the powder, but I think I added about 1/8th of a tea spoon to a cup of water, mixed that thoroughly, then added that to a liter of water.

I did see benefits using the powdered aloe, but I find it just as quick to blend up a couple of fresh leaves, I don't bother filleting em unless I'm planning a foliar, then I have to fillet/ blend and strain which can be a bit of a PITA, but my plants only get 3-4 foliar's in total during their life (UNLESS they've not got bugs).

 

[DonBrennon]

Sorry for de-railing your Cal-phos thread Calli, but I know you're into this kind of thing

Anatomy
The plant has triangular, fleshy leaves with serrated edges, yellow tubular flowers and fruits that contain numerous seeds. Each leaf is composed of three layers: 1) An inner clear gel that contains 99% water and rest is made of glucomannans, amino acids, lipids, sterols and vitamins. 2) The middle layer of latex which is the bitter yellow sap and contains anthraquinones and glycosides. 3) The outer thick layer of 15–20 cells called as rind which has protective function and synthesizes carbohydrates and proteins. Inside the rind are vascular bundles responsible for transportation of substances such as water (xylem) and starch (phloem).3

Active components with its properties: Aloe vera contains 75 potentially active constituents: vitamins, enzymes, minerals, sugars, lignin, saponins, salicylic acids and amino acids.4–6

1. Vitamins: It contains vitamins A (beta-carotene), C and E, which are antioxidants. It also contains vitamin B12, folic acid, and choline. Antioxidant neutralizes free radicals.
2. Enzymes: It contains 8 enzymes: aliiase, alkaline phosphatase, amylase, bradykinase, carboxypeptidase, catalase, cellulase, lipase, and peroxidase. Bradykinase helps to reduce excessive inflammation when applied to the skin topically, while others help in the breakdown of sugars and fats.
3. Minerals: It provides calcium, chromium, copper, selenium, magnesium, manganese, potassium, sodium and zinc. They are essential for the proper functioning of various enzyme systems in different metabolic pathways and few are antioxidants.
4. Sugars: It provides monosaccharides (glucose and fructose) and polysaccharides: (glucomannans/polymannose). These are derived from the mucilage layer of the plant and are known as mucopolysaccharides. The most prominent monosaccharide is mannose-6-phosphate, and the most common polysaccharides are called glucomannans [beta-(1,4)-acetylated mannan]. Acemannan, a prominent glucomannan has also been found. Recently, a glycoprotein with antiallergic properties, called alprogen and novel anti-inflammatory compound, C-glucosyl chromone, has been isolated from Aloe vera gel.7,8
5. Anthraquinones: It provides 12 anthraquinones, which are phenolic compounds traditionally known as laxatives. Aloin and emodin act as analgesics, antibacterials and antivirals.
6. Fatty acids: It provides 4 plant steroids; cholesterol, campesterol, β-sisosterol and lupeol. All these have anti-inflammatory action and lupeol also possesses antiseptic and analgesic properties.
7. Hormones: Auxins and gibberellins that help in wound healing and have anti-inflammatory action.
8. Others: It provides 20 of the 22 human required amino acids and 7 of the 8 essential amino acids. It also contains salicylic acid that possesses anti-inflammatory and antibacterial properties. Lignin, an inert substance, when included in topical preparations, enhances penetrative effect of the other ingredients into the skin. Saponins that are the soapy substances form about 3% of the gel and have cleansing and antiseptic properties.

I didn't know about it's anti-bacterial properties, maybe a good reason not to mix it so heavily, I might re-assess how often I was planning to use it in future too. The '4 plants steroids sound great, but at the expense of knocking my bacterial colonies back? Maybe best to stick to using it just for foliar's.

 

[calliandra]

Looks like she's off to a good start! I gotta know...how heavy are those pots with that sand on top? I've always wanted to experiment with some sand but the additional weight worries me (my L3 hangs out to the left of the rest of my spine).

Ah well, I don't really move my pots around at all, though lifting them out of the closet occasionally does happen.
They're (28L, er 7g?) very heavy for me at the mo, as I've been fighting a tendonitis in both hands since May, and I almost died lugging that innocently small-looking, but 25kg bag of sand onto my bike and home into the cellar haha! Especially since I had a 40L bag of compost with me too, which was much lighter though double the size.
The gardening center had stocked the sand outdoors - so it was sogging wet lol

It's waaaay lighter when it's dry though.
OK the bag has less sand in it now, but is exponentially easier to lift.
In the pot, the water seeps right through the ~4cm sand layer, so it's usually pretty dry - and hence probably light.
So I'm figuring it's not going to be any heavier than your usual soil.
Sorry I can't be any more specific!

 

[calliandra]

Oh and for those of you wondering how the hell I would transport that on a bike, this is my ride (bit older version )

I think I was building my tomato house there haha
Cheers!

 

[Rasta Roy]

Oh and for those of you wondering how the hell I would transport that on a bike, this is my ride (bit older version )
View attachment 3792561
I think I was building my tomato house there haha
Cheers!

I just assumed you had super strength and balance. Riding the bike no hands, bag of sand on one shoulder, bag of compost on the other. Your little trailer seems like a better idea though lol.

 

[calliandra]

Sorry for de-railing your Cal-phos thread Calli, but I know you're into this kind of thing

Not at all! Actually I tried to change the title afterwards (to, "So I made myself some CalPhos, but didn't use it" lol) but it wouldn't let me
This thread isn't about CalPhos, that was just a step on the way to finding a coherent way of going about organically indoors, and not just there

So thank you for sharing!
Where did you find this? I love exploring sources, sometimes I find things I wasn't even looking for but should have been haha

Good thing I asked about the concentration - sheesh!
Will definitely go easier on the amounts next time Considering the iffey aspects of the aloe, I think I'll be foliaring 2x in veg and then only if the plant seems to be needing protection.

When I read through that text, I mainly get the impression of a very diversely rich substance.
The problem with these kinds of information, I don't really understand them.
So what does that mean, the salicylic acid is antibacterial? Does it make the bacteria shrivel up and die? All, or just certain kinds? And how much of it is typically in aloe juice?
It's usually the amount that makes the poison
So using less and less often would cater to that, and close the circle.
Problem solved? LOL

 

[calliandra]

I just assumed you had super strength and balance. Riding the bike no hands, bag of sand on one shoulder, bag of compost on the other. Your little trailer seems like a better idea though lol.

Buahaha! I hope you don't mind I'm not going to try that to compare the experience! LOL

 

[iHearAll]

i picked one up from the grocers but this thing refuses to grow

Oh and for those of you wondering how the hell I would transport that on a bike, this is my ride (bit older version )
View attachment 3792561
I think I was building my tomato house there haha
Cheers!

those dandelion root can make some nice coffee!! and the heads can make a humus rich compost starter!

 

[Nugachino]

What's the seedy stuff in the jar? I know the CalPhos stuff. I've got some brewing too.

 

[calliandra]

i picked one up from the grocers but this thing refuses to grow

those dandelion root can make some nice coffee!! and the heads can make a humus rich compost starter!

Ah yeah too bad they're not in bloom right now. I'm getting ready to make a compost and just realized I don't have much for the hi N part LOL
may end up having to pick up some sheep manure from a village nearby...

I do have a whole veggie bed of alfalfa (planted exactly for that purpose, and as cover crop), but discovered it's NOT hi N.
Because alfalfa is only hi N if it is actually fixing nitrogen, meaning the roots have to have nodules and they have to be red when you cut them open. Anything else (no nodules, nodules with different inner colors), and the alfalfa is just plain greens.
Neat to know, but annoying haha!

 

[calliandra]

What's the seedy stuff in the jar? I know the CalPhos stuff. I've got some brewing too.

Hi Nugachino
Those were a mix of seeds (alfalfa and leftovers of a sprouts mix actually meant for people) that were getting soaked for sprouting
How I used them is described in a later post: https://www.rollitup.org/t/so-i-made-myself-some-calphos.921606/page-2#post-12988943

 

[calliandra]

Sour Stomper day 17, this gal is taking off now


I love how the side shoots are growing all on their own, no cajoling needed - I'm putting that down to the genetics - most Mephisto plants I've seen have fat bushes under their main cola.



Fricking big leaves too haha, that pot is 36cm diameter on top.
Haven't had that in this closet and not sure it's just the strain.....or let's say it the way it is:
I WISH it's not the strain but proof that the soil & additional food is perfect for her LOL

Speaking of soil. I finally got round to checking a sample out of this pot today.
What I like most about it is I know there are earthworms in there and that the consistency is really spongey and springey.
Smell is lovely mushroomy too, but nothing to show for it?
I still hardly saw any fungal hyphae in my sample. :/

I do think the bacterial side is OK.
Saw lots of different shapes and concatenations, but only one single actinobacterium, so assuming all the little ones are pretty much aerobic too. Flagellates, 3 bacterial feeding nematodes in the sample of which 2 were active, and tons of testate amoebae, which I find irritating, as they are usually an indication of former forest-type soil having suffered some disturbance. And still, fungi are slow to colonize...

My "fear" is that I simply don't have the biology in my inputs. I mean there were always few hyphae, but I was hoping there were spores that would then do me the favor of germinating in the pot. Seems not.
Had there been massive fungal growth in my input, leading to this result, I'd start thinking about whether something in there was fungicidal or contained some nasty chemical....

In any case, I've decided to start a continuous fungal culture as an innoculant for my future composts.
Just a container that aerates but also holds moisture in with wood chips where I can deposit samples from walks in nature and precultivate them.

 

[iHearAll]

Ah yeah too bad they're not in bloom right now. I'm getting ready to make a compost and just realized I don't have much for the hi N part LOL
may end up having to pick up some sheep manure from a village nearby...

I do have a whole veggie bed of alfalfa (planted exactly for that purpose, and as cover crop), but discovered it's NOT hi N.
Because alfalfa is only hi N if it is actually fixing nitrogen, meaning the roots have to have nodules and they have to be red when you cut them open. Anything else (no nodules, nodules with different inner colors), and the alfalfa is just plain greens.
Neat to know, but annoying haha!

woa had no idea. i have never really cut open my legume nodules. im finishing up a new bed of legume peas though. when i till it ill have to check this out!

 

[iHearAll]

Sour Stomper day 17, this gal is taking off now
View attachment 3793714

I love how the side shoots are growing all on their own, no cajoling needed - I'm putting that down to the genetics - most Mephisto plants I've seen have fat bushes under their main cola.

View attachment 3793715

Fricking big leaves too haha, that pot is 36cm diameter on top.
Haven't had that in this closet and not sure it's just the strain.....or let's say it the way it is:
I WISH it's not the strain but proof that the soil & additional food is perfect for her LOL

Speaking of soil. I finally got round to checking a sample out of this pot today.
What I like most about it is I know there are earthworms in there and that the consistency is really spongey and springey.
Smell is lovely mushroomy too, but nothing to show for it?
I still hardly saw any fungal hyphae in my sample. :/

I do think the bacterial side is OK.
Saw lots of different shapes and concatenations, but only one single actinobacterium, so assuming all the little ones are pretty much aerobic too. Flagellates, 3 bacterial feeding nematodes in the sample of which 2 were active, and tons of testate amoebae, which I find irritating, as they are usually an indication of former forest-type soil having suffered some disturbance. And still, fungi are slow to colonize...

My "fear" is that I simply don't have the biology in my inputs. I mean there were always few hyphae, but I was hoping there were spores that would then do me the favor of germinating in the pot. Seems not.
Had there been massive fungal growth in my input, leading to this result, I'd start thinking about whether something in there was fungicidal or contained some nasty chemical....

In any case, I've decided to start a continuous fungal culture as an innoculant for my future composts.
Just a container that aerates but also holds moisture in with wood chips where I can deposit samples from walks in nature and precultivate them.

ive been considering colonizing wood loving mycellium and break up the cake into my compost/leaf mould/soil/worms?(not sure theyd eat it)

that experiment of yours is looking sweeeeet