Liquid KoolBloom and pH

[Sureshot2]

So I decided to try using GH liquid koolbloom around week 3/4 or so of flower (now at week 7) to see what it was all about, not really sure if it's really doing much of anything, but one thing I did notice was that every time I have added it to my res the pH climbs to 6.1-6.2 and will hold there, regardless of how much pH down I add.

I can add the amount of pH down I would normally use to bring 6.2 to 5.7-ish and it will climb back to 6.1-6.2 after about 4-5 hours. This will continue to happen for at least 3-4 days before it starts to stabilize, but at this point I have added more pH down than I would have liked to. I stopped adding the liquid koolbloom last week and have considered picking up some of the powder but I'm not sure if its even worth it at this point.

For reference I am using GH FloraDuo as my base nutes along with GH calmagic in a 20 gal rdwc system. Wondering if anyone else has noticed this when using the liquid koolbloom.

 

[Cyluz]

thats odd
i was considering using LKB but i wonder if whats happening to you will happen to me in my 40 gallon water res with 2 air bubblers.
anyone have any tips?

 

[Sureshot2]

Alright so quick update. In an effort to isolate this problem and make sure it wasn't due to some interaction within my system, I decided to do a test using one gallon samples.

In my first sample I used one gallon of tap water (as I always do in my system) and tested the pH at about 7.8 from the tap. After testing the pH I then added 9ml of floraduo B and 3ml of floraduo A, which gives me roughly 700ppm of base nutes for blooming, and 2.5ml of calmagic, which is half strength. After stirring the solution for several minutes I checked the pH, which was around 6.6. I adjusted the pH down to 5.6, which took roughly 0.5 ml of pH down.

After preparing the first sample I filled a second container with 1 gallon of tap water, again at a pH of 7.8, and adjusted it down to 5.6 - this took 1.5ml of pH down. I did not add any additional nutrients or supplements to this sample, just plain pH adjusted water.

At this point I now had a sample that was fairly representative of the solution in my system minus the liquid koolbloom, and a sample that was plain pH adjusted water as a control. I then added 5ml of liquid koolbloom (label and feed charts suggest using between 5-10ml per gallon, so I stuck with the lower number) and again stirred for several minutes. After stirring I re-checked the pH and found that the sample with nutrients rose to a pH of 6.1, and the plain adjusted water sample rose to 6.2.

Now here's the interesting part: I added 1ml of pH down to each sample and stirred to try and get the pH back to the proper range, and found that in both samples the pH only went down to about 5.9. I then added a second 1ml dose to each container and was able to get the pH down to 5.6 in the nutrient solution, and 5.7 in the adjusted water.

Scale these figures up to real world values and we get an astonishing 40ml of pH down to lower the pH in my 20 gallon system from 6.1 to 5.6-5.7, which is in line with what its been taking to lower my pH after adding liquid koolbloom. The pH does not stay stable either, and generally drifts back to 6.0-6.1 shortyl after, and requires an additional 40ml of pH down 1-2 days later. Keep in mind I can lower the pH of my entire 20 gallon system from 7.8 to 5.6 with roughly 30ml of pH down, so for it to take 80ml over a few days to drop 0.5 points seems absurd.

I am surprised no one else has reported this problem with GH liquid koolbloom, considering it seems to have this problem even with plain water, so it's not an interaction with my nutes or anything else in my system. I will re-check the pH of the samples tomorrow night to see how much they have drifted up and add an update here.

 

[Sureshot2]

Not sure if anyone really cares due to lack of responses, but a quick check on the samples tonight showed a rise back to around 5.9. Not as bad as in the res, but still required additional pH down to bring back down.

 

[westcoast420]

Weird, used liquid kb for years and never had that issue. I wouldn't bother with the powder, I used it for years and in the last year it's changed and doesn't disolve properly anymore, better boosters out there.

 

[ChiefRunningPhist]

That swing could be beneficial. Different nutrient uptake rates at different pH?? I'm using LKB but use pH paper to tell pH and would not be able to be as accurate as you are getting.

 

[j to the c]

I used LKB for years and liked it. Also used the powder too. I now use canna 13/14 because it produces a nicer smell and use half their powder and half sonic bloom powder. Nicer than either alone. Tap water doesn’t like to change it’s ph. Maybe try to drop your ph before you add any nutes to your water. And maybe cut the cal mag too. Tap water usually has more than enough calcium and you don’t really need mag after week 4-5. I use a modified Lucas and have for many years. I use RO water to get my nutes in because I can get the ppm I want with the nutes I want although with top offs I use tap water, it helps with drifting between bi weekly change outs. It helps not needing to add as much ph down for me. Just keep experimenting, you’ll find it.

 

[Joint Monster]

Liquid KoolBloom is a bloom booster, P & K Supplament. I use it sparingly, or when plants call for more Phosphorous or Potassium. It definitely helps.

I have not noticed any abnormal PH swings with it. I like to pour it into a few gallons of water that contain a few air stones (as I am mixing my nutrients), then into the rez. Never noticed any mixing issues either.

 

[Joint Monster]

After preparing the first sample I filled a second container with 1 gallon of tap water, again at a pH of 7.8, and adjusted it down to 5.6 - this took 1.5ml of pH down. I did not add any additional nutrients or supplements to this sample, just plain pH adjusted water.

At this point I now had a sample that was fairly representative of the solution in my system minus the liquid koolbloom, and a sample that was plain pH adjusted water as a control. I then added 5ml of liquid koolbloom (label and feed charts suggest using between 5-10ml per gallon, so I stuck with the lower number) and again stirred for several minutes. After stirring I re-checked the pH and found that the sample with nutrients rose to a pH of 6.1, and the plain adjusted water sample rose to 6.2.

Now here's the interesting part: I added 1ml of pH down to each sample and stirred to try and get the pH back to the proper range, and found that in both samples the pH only went down to about 5.9. I then added a second 1ml dose to each container and was able to get the pH down to 5.6 in the nutrient solution, and 5.7 in the adjusted water.

Scale these figures up to real world values and we get an astonishing 40ml of pH down to lower the pH in my 20 gallon system from 6.1 to 5.6-5.7, which is in line with what its been taking to lower my pH after adding liquid koolbloom. The pH does not stay stable either, and generally drifts back to 6.0-6.1 shortyl after, and requires an additional 40ml of pH down 1-2 days later. Keep in mind I can lower the pH of my entire 20 gallon system from 7.8 to 5.6 with roughly 30ml of pH down, so for it to take 80ml over a few days to drop 0.5 points seems absurd.

Your experiment is not accurate. You should have had three water samples, one plain, one nute mix without KB, one nute mix with KB.

The reason being, you want to add your KB, THEN adjust Ph. In the experiment you add KB to already Ph nute solution, then you have to add more Ph Up/Down to re-adjust your Ph.

In an ~60Gal system, I found ~10ml. of Ph Down would take me from 6.6 to like 4.5-5.3.. which was a low for me. (Not that I would regularly just dump that much. You get a feel for it after a few feedings.)