CHITOSAN Sources & Use

[SheepsBlood]

Please do not answer this unless you ACTUALLY are contributing. I don't care if you're stoned or about any other side bar. (Can you tell I am tired of these blogs when no one can make progress due to side bars)​

I have found this bottle of Chitosan Finings. I am assuming that the only ingredients with a product such as this would be H20 and Chitosan. Considering it is a product that is used in the process of wine making and ultimately will be consumed by humans.
AMAZON


The level of chitosan is 1%. I am estimating that 1ml / 20Gal. I am basing this off of a product called Agri-House ODC™ Colloidal Chitosan. Which, is at 0.25% chitosan and suggests 1ml / 5gal.
Agri-House


The intention is to incorporate this product or any viable and cheaply sourced chitosan into my hydroponic solution and replace overly expensive Bud Factor X.

 

[NaturalFarmer]

Can you tell me the difference between Chitin and Chitosan? Will my Chitin from crab shell in my soil break down to become chitosan?

 

[SheepsBlood]

SIDE BAR (I accept side bars from Mainer's)- Not exactly, Chitosan comes from Chitin.

Chitosan causes SAR in plants which means it causes them to put up their defenses.
On the west coast they use Chitosan on their Pine trees to ward off Pine Beetles. It causes the pine trees to exude more sap and pine jizz. As for cannabis it causes stinkier buds, more density, more flowering spots... The list goes on... Lots of trichomes.

 

[NaturalFarmer]

Chitin and Chitosan Preparation from Marine Sources. Structure, Properties and Applications

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4377977/

Also some good answers here, however none sound like organic options....but hope it helps in your quest.

https://www.researchgate.net/post/I_want_to_make_10_solution_of_chitosan

 

[SheepsBlood]

I don't use 100% organic indoors. I run hydro.
I do organic for my outdoors though.

 

[SheepsBlood]

Chitin and Chitosan Preparation from Marine Sources. Structure, Properties and Applications

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4377977/

Also some good answers here, however none sound like organic options....but hope it helps in your quest.

https://www.researchgate.net/post/I_want_to_make_10_solution_of_chitosan

Yeah, I saw those. They were helpful to an extent.
Thanks for posting your "GARDEN MYTHS" website
That has some great information that makes wicked good sense...

 

[Jaybodankly]

I have found organic outdoor tougher because animals like to dig up plants for bone meal, blood meal, alfalfa, kelp and other tasty bits.

 

[SheepsBlood]

I have found organic outdoor tougher because animals like to dig up plants for bone meal, blood meal, alfalfa, kelp and other tasty bits.

Put spikes in the ground for those assholes, traps, anything. Or you can be nice and put The Walking Dead mobile alarm kit around them... Soda cans and shiny metal to make noise, that should deter them.

 

[wheresthelambsbread]

I found a homebrew recipe for Scorpion Juice (product that BFX replaced) on another forum while searching for the same information. I have not tried it, and the person who did wound up with a viscus product... (also in that thread they posit bfx is using harpin protein in addition to chitosan)


The thread is basically what this thread is but they got a bit farther into it...
Annoyingling I can't post a link but if you copy and paste some of the post into Google I'm sure you'll find it.


Posted by Budboy299, March 3 2011,
thcfarmer; Scorpion Juice Knockoff

"Man this one took me a while....

Scorpion Juice uses chitosan, salicylic acid and Thiamine mononitrate (a form of vitamin B1)


Now for a 1 litre bottle....


2.5% Chitosan listed on label = 28.75 grams of 85% pure Chitosan


____________________________________________________

3% of Thiamine mononitrate = 30 grams
can be found here.... *


If you look up Vitamin B1, there are actually a few compounds that are listed that are B1. MOAB uses Thiamine hydrochloride as B1....so either of these should be perfectly safe alternatives to each other.
___________________________________________________

Salicylic Acid....same stuff as uncoated aspirin

this was a tough one as the ingredient is not listed BUT....I dug up 3 different studies that showed that chitosan and Salicylic acid together are the most potent way to boost the plants (any plants) own immune system to help with all forms of invaders. (fungal and pests)

All 3 studies showed a rate of .24 grams per gallon of salicylic acid to be the most effective for foliar spraying.
Since Scorpion Juice is listed at 20ml per gallon for foliar...that works out to
12.187 grams of Salicylic Acid per 1 litre of Scorpion Knockoff.

Salicylic acid is mearly...uncoated aspirin


So long and short is.... 1 Litre of Scorpion Juice knock off is

30 grams of Thiamine mononitrate 2.80
28.75 grams of 85% pure Chitosan 13.00
12.187 grams of salicylic acid 1.50
top up to 1L mark with distilled H2O


This will make a similar strength mixture to Scorpion Juice for only 17 bucks
Warning though....AN and many brands do not always put as much in their mixes as what they say....so start with less and build up

Just noticed that AN discontinued this....guess the profit margins were not there or not enough demand for it. Still there is the recipe for all you budding DIY'ers"

*I had to erase all the links they provided in their post

 

[Miyagismokes]

Lots of chitin in insect frass, maybe if one were to make a frass tea with high pH water, it would convert to chitosan...

 

[Groat21]

I found a homebrew recipe for Scorpion Juice (product that BFX replaced) on another forum while searching for the same information. I have not tried it, and the person who did wound up with a viscus product... (also in that thread they posit bfx is using harpin protein in addition to chitosan)


The thread is basically what this thread is but they got a bit farther into it...
Annoyingling I can't post a link but if you copy and paste some of the post into Google I'm sure you'll find it.


Posted by Budboy299, March 3 2011,
thcfarmer; Scorpion Juice Knockoff

"Man this one took me a while....

Scorpion Juice uses chitosan, salicylic acid and Thiamine mononitrate (a form of vitamin B1)


Now for a 1 litre bottle....


2.5% Chitosan listed on label = 28.75 grams of 85% pure Chitosan


____________________________________________________

3% of Thiamine mononitrate = 30 grams
can be found here.... *


If you look up Vitamin B1, there are actually a few compounds that are listed that are B1. MOAB uses Thiamine hydrochloride as B1....so either of these should be perfectly safe alternatives to each other.
___________________________________________________

Salicylic Acid....same stuff as uncoated aspirin

this was a tough one as the ingredient is not listed BUT....I dug up 3 different studies that showed that chitosan and Salicylic acid together are the most potent way to boost the plants (any plants) own immune system to help with all forms of invaders. (fungal and pests)

All 3 studies showed a rate of .24 grams per gallon of salicylic acid to be the most effective for foliar spraying.
Since Scorpion Juice is listed at 20ml per gallon for foliar...that works out to
12.187 grams of Salicylic Acid per 1 litre of Scorpion Knockoff.

Salicylic acid is mearly...uncoated aspirin


So long and short is.... 1 Litre of Scorpion Juice knock off is

30 grams of Thiamine mononitrate 2.80
28.75 grams of 85% pure Chitosan 13.00
12.187 grams of salicylic acid 1.50
top up to 1L mark with distilled H2O


This will make a similar strength mixture to Scorpion Juice for only 17 bucks
Warning though....AN and many brands do not always put as much in their mixes as what they say....so start with less and build up

Just noticed that AN discontinued this....guess the profit margins were not there or not enough demand for it. Still there is the recipe for all you budding DIY'ers"

*I had to erase all the links they provided in their post

I found the chitosan, pure salicylic acid, but I'm having trouble finding the Vitamin B1/ Thiamine mononitrate in Canada

Salicylic acid- https://www.amazon.ca/Mystic-Moments-RMSALI100-Salicylic-Powder/dp/B00DN0DBRI/ref=pd_sbs_194_1/136-0418045-6036824?_encoding=UTF8&pd_rd_i=B00DN0DBRI&pd_rd_r=c04ee254-47f7-11e9-b0ce-1582fe71c4d3&pd_rd_w=s3Hf6&pd_rd_wg=lpOvJ&pf_rd_p=5dcda75b-8643-4da3-9bb1-5c0233790500&pf_rd_r=JP6Q27E4NMFG1DQHGRR6&psc=1&refRID=JP6Q27E4NMFG1DQHGRR6

Chitosan- https://www.amazon.ca/Mystic-Moments-RMCHITOSAN100-Chitosan-Powder/dp/B008TO725K/ref=sr_1_5?keywords=chitosan&qid=1552747746&s=gateway&sr=8-5

Thanks for the help, don't want to pay $50 for 500ml of the bud factor x...

 

[GreeneryBob]

I'm just going lazy style with megacrop. Shipping was a bit spendy to Canada, but I think they figured that out a bit better now. I've been growing with that stuff and it works..has chitosan, seaweed, all the micros and macros, all the goodies that you would usually add from many bottles in a one part dry format. I tried it outside on veggies first and everything grew like mad. I've flowered one crop so far and starting on the next and am very happy with it so far. You will save a fortune if you avoid the trap of bottled water based nutrients. I was a little hesitant to break with the convention of having separate grow and bloom formulas but it worked. The only thing I add is a bit of epsom salt to boost magnesium as I have LEDs but the new formula has added magnesium and should be perfect without anything added. I might fuss with MPK for the next run's flower cycle but that's about it. The nutrients are the boring tedious part of growing for me, the light spectrum tinkering and automation is where I have my fun.

 

[Groat21]

I'm just going lazy style with megacrop. Shipping was a bit spendy to Canada, but I think they figured that out a bit better now. I've been growing with that stuff and it works..has chitosan, seaweed, all the micros and macros, all the goodies that you would usually add from many bottles in a one part dry format. I tried it outside on veggies first and everything grew like mad. I've flowered one crop so far and starting on the next and am very happy with it so far. You will save a fortune if you avoid the trap of bottled water based nutrients. I was a little hesitant to break with the convention of having separate grow and bloom formulas but it worked. The only thing I add is a bit of epsom salt to boost magnesium as I have LEDs but the new formula has added magnesium and should be perfect without anything added. I might fuss with MPK for the next run's flower cycle but that's about it. The nutrients are the boring tedious part of growing for me, the light spectrum tinkering and automation is where I have my fun.

Will look into this some more... looks good, but probably not designed specifically for cannabis, and I’m guessing chitosan levels are low.

Will do some more research on the product and post what I find. Website says “free” code for 300g, might as well try it

 

[waterproof808]

Theres a very informative thread on chitosan on ic mag. The form you should be using is chitosan oligosaccharide. I'm pretty sure I read you sure never use it at the same time as salicylic acid.

 

[Groat21]

Theres a very informative thread on chitosan on ic mag. The form you should be using is chitosan oligosaccharide. I'm pretty sure I read you sure never use it at the same time as salicylic acid.

Bud Factor X has both salicylic acid and chitosan oligosaccharide in it...

Very interested in trying a product called MEGAGROW, comes in a powder, is very cost effective, and has a ton in it (including chitosan).

If anyone has experience with this, let me know. Thanks!

 

[waterproof808]

Bud Factor X has both salicylic acid and chitosan oligosaccharide in it...

Very interested in trying a product called MEGAGROW, comes in a powder, is very cost effective, and has a ton in it (including chitosan).

If anyone has experience with this, let me know. Thanks!

here's a quote from the thread I mentioned in regards to using SA with Chitosan oligo. JA = Jasmonic Acid

And even if you use less SA and chitosan, it still remains a bad choice because the main effect of chitosan on stimulating plant immunity is mediated via jasmonic acid: SA and JA are in most regards mutually antagonistic. Although, chitosan is compatible with both 'mediators', it's not recommendable to externally add one UNLESS you have a specific pest where you know the main signalling/resistance pathway. I think that most of the commonly encountered pests in cannabis growing (I can only guess without a poll

) are mediated by JA or first SA than JA. Adding SA to chitosan will hamper any JA mediated response.
And finally, the effects of JA on plant immunity coincide with several beneficial effects for tokers (like resin production and control of DELLA proteins) whereas SA causes unwanted effects in the eye of a grower (like stomata closure).

 

[GreeneryBob]

Will look into this some more... looks good, but probably not designed specifically for cannabis, and I’m guessing chitosan levels are low.

Will do some more research on the product and post what I find. Website says “free” code for 300g, might as well try it

Strong enough for a vegetable garden, but made for cannabis

 

[Blazinheavy]

So…seems that it’s been a few years since people have been trying to replicate bud factor x … are any die hard bud factor x fans extremely happy with the diy version.

 

[shawn75can]

I use and have used Bud X for about 2 years and prior to that I used lobster and crab shell pieces that were purchased I crushed them into a powder and mixed into my soil. Plus topderssed during flower. I think the raw shells made my buds more trichome covered. I keep using the Bud X though because I want use it up. Good product but similar success with lest cost.

 

[Rurumo]

So…seems that it’s been a few years since people have been trying to replicate bud factor x … are any die hard bud factor x fans extremely happy with the diy version.

Well, I don't use harpin protein, which is in Bud Factor X, but I'm a huge proponent of salicylic acid and chitosan, mainly for fungal prevention, but the growth benefits associated with ISR/SAR is certainly appreciated. I spray aspirin/chitosan water on my buds up to around week 4 of flower and they love it, and I love that I haven't gotten PM or botrytis since I started doing it. Honestly, I think I could just continue doing it weekly through flower with zero issues from the moisture, but I haven't tested it yet. These compounds are being studied in combination as we speak, they seem to work very well together. I do occasionally give these as a root drench, but they really shine as a foliar.