A legal way to store extract

[eugeneoregon]

I have no intention of testing the legal waters, however the legal landscape around marijuanna is full hazards.

One hazard always seems to revolve around posession of too much marijuanna or its extracts. In Oregon the posession of more than five grams of extract is a crime even though Oregon has very liberal recreational marijuanna laws. Five grams is a lot, but what if you find yourself in posession of more than that? A gift or discovery or miscalculation can each be viewed as a crime if the magic number of five grams is exceeded Oregon.

I have no idea if this would stand up in court, but I suspect that it would indeed. Simply disolve the amount of extract you wish to store in methanol.

My thinking is this; ethanol is taxed and regulated and considered safe for human consumption (arguable). So in order to sell ethanol for purposes other than drinking, a mild toxin is put into it. They call this "denatured alcohol" which is a usage of the words that means they poisoned drinking alcohol to make it undrinkable. This avoids the heavy taxes and regulations of regular ethanol because it is no longer fit for human consumption until the toxin is removed (VERY EASY TO DO).

Methanol, on the other hand, is not suitable for human consumption in any amount. So by placing the extract into solution of methanol then in the same context that ethanol is denatured, the extract would be considered denatured too. Every Oregon law always includes the word "useable" when describing how they weigh extract or marijuanna. When dissolved in methanol extract does not fit the definition of "useable" and putting marijuanna products into methanol is the prescribed method that labs use to officially destroy any product remaining after testing.

Removing methanol prior to use is an identical procedure to removing ethanol which is in common use to dewax marijuanna extracts, and frankly it does not take rocket science to do so safely. It could be legally argued that ethanol laced with extract is useable, and in fact it is used this way with the most common phrase I know of being named "Green Dragon".

Methanol laced wih extract is not only unuseable as-is and is toxic, but in the event of court procedings the legal authorities would first have to distill off the methanol and jump through multiple hoops just to confirm if there is more than the legal limit involved - in other words there is no way to know how much is being stored without destroying a substantial part of evidence.

I am looking for opinions for the sake of discussion only. Do you think that denaturing the product with methanol would render it off limits in the case of an attempted drug bust? My personal shield is that I stay under the limits but I wanted to post the idea to hear the thoughts of others.

 

[whitebb2727]

Why does it matter? If you are going to do the crime be prepared to do the time.

Either don't break the law or break it and be prepared for the consequences.

 

[eugeneoregon]

Why does it matter? If you are going to do the crime be prepared to do the time.

Either don't break the law or break it and be prepared for the consequences.

My point, or rather question, would it or would it not be a crime to render the product legal for storage purposes. There is no crime therefor no prospect of being punished if storing the product in poisonous form is allowed under the law. What I am proposing is not a crime but rather a potential method to maintain compliance with the law, not break it!

Perhaps I worded my post incorrectly. The premise was what to do if you find yourself above the legal limit. In a car if your speed exceeds the limit, I suggest slowing down and becoming compliant. Irregardless of intent to commit a crime it is indeed possible to find yourself over the limit. My post suggests a way to COMPLY with the law in such a circumstance, not BREAK it! The question is in regards to whether or not this would be a suitable way to regain compliance while still posessing the product, albeit in a poisonous form. I believe it would given the hurdles it would take to try to prove otherwise.

For those in production of the product it would mean there was a legal way to continue producing a product without going over the limits for usable product. The side benefit is that methanol works wonders dewaxing extract.


Semper Fi

 

[chemphlegm]

I've seen a court case where a guy ruined his marijuana buds in a large jar of rubbing alcohol. he told the judge it is unusable and won. Keep it in iso, evap as needed

 

[dstroy]

My point, or rather question, would it or would it not be a crime to render the product legal for storage purposes. There is no crime therefor no prospect of being punished if storing the product in poisonous form is allowed under the law. What I am proposing is not a crime but rather a potential method to maintain compliance with the law, not break it!

Perhaps I worded my post incorrectly. The premise was what to do if you find yourself above the legal limit. In a car if your speed exceeds the limit, I suggest slowing down and becoming compliant. Irregardless of intent to commit a crime it is indeed possible to find yourself over the limit. My post suggests a way to COMPLY with the law in such a circumstance, not BREAK it! The question is in regards to whether or not this would be a suitable way to regain compliance while still posessing the product, albeit in a poisonous form. I believe it would given the hurdles it would take to try to prove otherwise.

For those in production of the product it would mean there was a legal way to continue producing a product without going over the limits for usable product. The side benefit is that methanol works wonders dewaxing extract.


Semper Fi

http://www.oregon.gov/olcc/marijuana/Pages/FAQs-Personal-Use.aspx

Q: What is meant by “useable” marijuana?
A: Useable marijuana refers to dried marijuana flowers or leaves. In other words, marijuana that is ready to smoke.

////////

Methanol is not a carcinogen, nor does it contain any carcinogens. However, methanol may be metabolized in the body to formaldehyde, which is both toxic and carcinogenic. Methanol occurs naturally in small quantities in the human body and in edible fruits.

////////

Q: How much marijuana can I have?
A: The personal possession limits are:

• One ounce of usable marijuana;
• 16 ounces of a cannabinoid product in solid form;
• 72 ounces of a cannabinoid product in liquid form;
• Five grams of cannabinoid extracts or concentrates, whether sold alone or contained in an inhalant delivery system;
• Four immature marijuana plants; and
• Ten marijuana seeds.

////////

Seems pretty "cut and dry" on what you can and can't do. If you want to store your flowers wet you could probably circumvent the law. But I wouldn't go carrying around more than 5g of extract in any form.


I don't follow Oregon mj court case outcomes, you might want to ask a lawyer what other people have gotten away with in your county.

 

[eugeneoregon]

http://www.oregon.gov/olcc/marijuana/Pages/FAQs-Personal-Use.aspx

Q: What is meant by “useable” marijuana?
A: Useable marijuana refers to dried marijuana flowers or leaves. In other words, marijuana that is ready to smoke.

////////

Methanol is not a carcinogen, nor does it contain any carcinogens. However, methanol may be metabolized in the body to formaldehyde, which is both toxic and carcinogenic. Methanol occurs naturally in small quantities in the human body and in edible fruits.

////////

Q: How much marijuana can I have?
A: The personal possession limits are:

• One ounce of usable marijuana;
• 16 ounces of a cannabinoid product in solid form;
• 72 ounces of a cannabinoid product in liquid form;
• Five grams of cannabinoid extracts or concentrates, whether sold alone or contained in an inhalant delivery system;
• Four immature marijuana plants; and
• Ten marijuana seeds.

////////

Seems pretty "cut and dry" on what you can and can't do. If you want to store your flowers wet you could probably circumvent the law. But I wouldn't go carrying around more than 5g of extract in any form.


I don't follow Oregon mj court case outcomes, you might want to ask a lawyer what other people have gotten away with in your county.

nice info!

I suppose the question would then become an interpretation of the "72 ounces of a cannabinoid product in liquid form;" part of your info, right? Agreed about transporting more than 5g of extract unless of course you have an Oregon license available now that allows delivery.

In that case, Oregon now allows up to $3000 retail value of any marijuanna product to be transported for delivery from licensed retailers to the end users. (Pizza tonight?) The product can only be transported in a locked container permanently attached to the vehicle. (no shit...is this what America is now??? - but honest to God it is true lolz)

 

[whitebb2727]

My point, or rather question, would it or would it not be a crime to render the product legal for storage purposes. There is no crime therefor no prospect of being punished if storing the product in poisonous form is allowed under the law. What I am proposing is not a crime but rather a potential method to maintain compliance with the law, not break it!

Perhaps I worded my post incorrectly. The premise was what to do if you find yourself above the legal limit. In a car if your speed exceeds the limit, I suggest slowing down and becoming compliant. Irregardless of intent to commit a crime it is indeed possible to find yourself over the limit. My post suggests a way to COMPLY with the law in such a circumstance, not BREAK it! The question is in regards to whether or not this would be a suitable way to regain compliance while still posessing the product, albeit in a poisonous form. I believe it would given the hurdles it would take to try to prove otherwise.

For those in production of the product it would mean there was a legal way to continue producing a product without going over the limits for usable product. The side benefit is that methanol works wonders dewaxing extract.


Semper Fi

I get what you meant but coming on a forum and asking about it shows intent.

I get what you are asking.

"Usable" is a vague term. I suppose that's open to interpretation and as such you could be charged.

 

[eugeneoregon]

I get what you meant but coming on a forum and asking about it shows intent.

I get what you are asking.

"Usable" is a vague term. I suppose that's open to interpretation and as such you could be charged.

It would only seem to show intent for persons who are inclined themselves to breaking the law. I have NEVER been on ANY marijuanna website in which the vast majority of those who post eiher actively engage in breaking the law from posession, to extraction, to illegally obtaining and illegally selling the product or associate with those who break the law. This places the thinking, right or wrong, into a criminal frame. It is natural to have readers therefor assume my intent mirrors their own.

But you are wrong. My purpose in posting was to offer an idea to enable compliance and to get feedback. You provided feedback based on what you yourself observe about others who have posted ("...coming on a forum and asking...) and what you perceive their motives are. So you naturally offered up an answer that normally only somebody well versed in breaking the law, would say; "If you cant do the time dont do the crime."

I have been a licensed patient for many years and as such have violated fedeal law with each and every dispensary purchase, however I comply wih state law. The "intent" part of the question is to continue complying with the law, but I am also getting older and forgetful. I make most of my trips to stock up and for a severe medical condition use about one gram per day on average.

The basis of my question could better be phrased thusly; if I return home from legally buying dispensary shatter and while putting it away discover a few grams I thouht were lost (actually happened a few times), then what can I do to become compliant? I only post this example to illustrate how easy it can be to "intend" to comply with the (absolutely ludicrous) law but through normal human frailties inadvertantly become non compliant. Since I generally dewax anyway using a chromatography column (DCVC) and since I use methanol as the mobile phase (aluminum oxide as the stationary phase although I do use silica gel 60 at times), then it seemed natural to pose the question from the point of view of having disolved extract in methanol. The question could have been posted about hexane, or ethyl acetate, both of which like methanol are must have solvents for the column chromatography that I do with extract. (chromatography allows me to refine to nearly pure cannibinoid in gram size quantities).

Methanol by the way seems to be a superior solvent when dewaxing and for chromatography it is a must have solvent owing to the polarity which is extremely polar - this makes an alumina column into a defacto filter for waxes which run into the alimina and stop cold while the rest passes easily. This was a smaller question for me too - are the "filtered" portions like waxes which are seperated by chromatography column, or that are left behind in my short path hobby rig also tallied up in the event of legal scrutiny? I mean, if you yourself dewax marjiuanna flower, and the result is over five grams of waxes removed, are you guilty of a crime of posession of more than five grams of extract under Oregon law?

My hunch is that if those five grams of waxes are in methanol then you are not breaking the law because it is poison. However, if the law says ethanol is drinkable then it seems clear that even the waxes and gunk from dewaxing could be used in the tally and then you have a crime committed completely without intent. Since THC and the plant waxes are miscible in all proportions the waxes will indeed test positive for THC when you dewax.

 

[whitebb2727]

It would only seem to show intent for persons who are inclined themselves to breaking the law. I have NEVER been on ANY marijuanna website in which the vast majority of those who post eiher actively engage in breaking the law from posession, to extraction, to illegally obtaining and illegally selling the product or associate with those who break the law. This places the thinking, right or wrong, into a criminal frame. It is natural to have readers therefor assume my intent mirrors their own.

But you are wrong. My purpose in posting was to offer an idea to enable compliance and to get feedback. You provided feedback based on what you yourself observe about others who have posted ("...coming on a forum and asking...) and what you perceive their motives are. So you naturally offered up an answer that normally only somebody well versed in breaking the law, would say; "If you cant do the time dont do the crime."

I have been a licensed patient for many years and as such have violated fedeal law with each and every dispensary purchase, however I comply wih state law. The "intent" part of the question is to continue complying with the law, but I am also getting older and forgetful. I make most of my trips to stock up and for a severe medical condition use about one gram per day on average.

The basis of my question could better be phrased thusly; if I return home from legally buying dispensary shatter and while putting it away discover a few grams I thouht were lost (actually happened a few times), then what can I do to become compliant? I only post this example to illustrate how easy it can be to "intend" to comply with the (absolutely ludicrous) law but through normal human frailties inadvertantly become non compliant. Since I generally dewax anyway using a chromatography column (DCVC) and since I use methanol as the mobile phase (aluminum oxide as the stationary phase although I do use silica gel 60 at times), then it seemed natural to pose the question from the point of view of having disolved extract in methanol. The question could have been posted about hexane, or ethyl acetate, both of which like methanol are must have solvents for the column chromatography that I do with extract. (chromatography allows me to refine to nearly pure cannibinoid in gram size quantities).

Methanol by the way seems to be a superior solvent when dewaxing and for chromatography it is a must have solvent owing to the polarity which is extremely polar - this makes an alumina column into a defacto filter for waxes which run into the alimina and stop cold while the rest passes easily. This was a smaller question for me too - are the "filtered" portions like waxes which are seperated by chromatography column, or that are left behind in my short path hobby rig also tallied up in the event of legal scrutiny? I mean, if you yourself dewax marjiuanna flower, and the result is over five grams of waxes removed, are you guilty of a crime of posession of more than five grams of extract under Oregon law?

My hunch is that if those five grams of waxes are in methanol then you are not breaking the law because it is poison. However, if the law says ethanol is drinkable then it seems clear that even the waxes and gunk from dewaxing could be used in the tally and then you have a crime committed completely without intent. Since THC and the plant waxes are miscible in all proportions the waxes will indeed test positive for THC when you dewax.

Well aren't you up on your high horse.

Some of us don't have the luxury of grow I g cannabis legally. Never known what it was like to grow legally.

As for your words, you seem to infer that I'm a criminal. We all are. Cannabis is federally illegal and sessions is coming after pot. Look out.

Just saying man. Anyone trying to do what you suggest is "knowingly" break the law.

 

[greg nr]

I'm not a lawyer and I'm not playing one here, but my take is that 5 grams is 5 grams no matter what form it is in. They bust people all the time for dissolving meth. They bust people with infused brownies and charge them with the full weight of the brownie as if it were a brick of hash. They weigh entire plants, root balls and all. They claim you were impaired without any positive tests. They claim resisting arrest or disturbing the peace when none existed. They will claim you were merely trying to evade arrest.

I call this the difference between being right, and dead right. You don't want to be dead, no matter how right you were.